CrazyThomas 0 #1 March 16, 2003 Narcs at the DZ? It is a good debate, but let's talk about something else. people telling on people. Why does anyone feel the need to "tell on" another person? Alot of people say that if they come across this situation, they will leave. Well, OK, then leave. Just don't call the cops. Why is it that one person feels the need to have another person arrested for their actiions? "Hi, I don't have a badge, but I am so disturbed by your actions that I will report you to authorities". Why is this? Please explain. Why does one person feel their need for safety and perfection and "law-abiding" is more important than another human's to pursue happiness? What is passive interference, and what is pro-active interference? Later, Thomas Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dirtsucks 0 #2 March 16, 2003 People who are unsatisfied with their own life will always feel compelled to reduce others' quality of life. Simple as that. I think I'm dumb, I think I'm dumb, I think I'm dumb... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
blewaway5 0 #3 March 16, 2003 In the interest of being a devil's advocate I've got to mention this, not to mention the fact that this is the way I feel. You asked... QuoteWhy does one person feel their need for safety and perfection and "law-abiding" is more important than another human's to pursue happiness? If you are doing something that violates my safety I'm gonna let you know about it. Am I gonna go to the cops over it, not likely, but you will hear from me, no matter how happy you feel about the situation. *shrug* I guess my need for safety strikes me as more important than any pursuit of happiness. It's simple risk management in my mind, and we all know a little about that. Having said all that, I don't think anybody should have called the cops in on it, but the law's the law, and if you choose to break it you are judging the risk to be acceptable. Live with that judgement call. Truman Sparks for President Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kmcguffee 0 #4 March 16, 2003 QuoteWhy does anyone feel the need to "tell on" another person? Leaving out the issue of whether the law the individual is violating is "right" or "wrong", if the population did not "tell on" anyone then very few crimes would ever be punished. Most crimes are illegal because they infringe on the rights of another individual. There are exceptions. The person might feel it is his/her duty as a citizen or that the person violating the law is a danger to him/her or other people. They could also have a personal vendetta against the person and want to get them in trouble. QuoteWhy does one person feel their need for safety and perfection and "law-abiding" is more important than another human's to pursue happiness? Your pusuit of happiness becomes illegal when it starts infringing on another person's safety or on their rights. If your pursuit of happiness was more important than other peoples safety then what would prevent you from killing them "for fun". I mean as long as you consider it fun it would be OK to do it. If your pursuit of happiness is more important than other people's safety and individual rights then you have an anarchist society. Are you an advocate of a survival of the fittest society with no laws? "Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do." Ben Franklin Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wmw999 2,589 #5 March 16, 2003 "telling on" depends on what the issue is. If I see someone driving really dangerously, I might pull over and call the police. I've done it. If I see someone toking up before going on a load, I might tell the DZO, or I might tell them it was a really stupid thing to do. I haven't been in that situation in a really long time, so I'd have to say it depends. A solo hop'n'pop is way different from a big-way. Who the action infringes on, and who it might damage, are probably the two most important considerations. Once it crosses over into other people's territory, then it's better to have it in the open. Because then the people who are/might being harmed, or the police, can deal with it. Wendy W.There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diverdriver 7 #6 March 16, 2003 QuoteA solo hop'n'pop is way different from a big-way. I would say that it does matter in both situations. Let's just say a jumper was a solo hop-n-pop and they were high. No problem? What if that jumper hooked himself into a pond in front of the whole USPA BOD? There might be some repercussions. Stopping someone from taking AN ILLEGAL SUBSTANCE or an intoxicant before jumping might impact my enjoyment of the DZ I frequent. As in, I get to enjoy a stress free environment instead of trying to defend the vast majority of rule abiding jumpers there. I have banned jumpers from my aircraft after drinking and trying to jump. I can't catch them all but when I know about it I'll do something. Chris Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wmw999 2,589 #7 March 16, 2003 Absolutely -- people hurting themselves can hurt the sport. And part of your specific job as pilot, I would assume, is to make sure that no one impaired was jumping, much as a bartender tries to make sure that no one gets too awfully drunk without a way to go home. A lot of "victimless" crimes are like this, where damage is caused to the setting or the sport by someone's hurting themself. Then come additional regulations, and we all know how much we like them. WendyThere is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jraf 0 #8 March 16, 2003 I undersytand and most definitely respect what you are doing. It is the right thing to do, however we have the power to do these things within our own community. Calling the police is RATTING. Ratting hurts our sport, makes us look like a bunch of dopeheads (OK, so we are a bunch of dopeheads anyway, but why let the world know) and really serves no purpose. The mentioned DZ obviously has a rat - they should call ORKIN as soon as possible jraf Me Jungleman! Me have large Babalui. Muff #3275 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MC208B 0 #9 March 16, 2003 victimless crimes (i.e. dope) have no place on the DZ, before, during or after jump operations. If someone wants to go home and get loaded, that's their business. It is the "beer" light, not the dope light Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lawrocket 3 #10 March 16, 2003 Thomas: Would you ever tell other people that a person is a "snitch?" My guess is you'd let everybody know that the snitch is a rat fink. What is rarely thought about is that people usually rat out a rat. This makes them rats, as well. Isn't it funny how a person is a rat for snitching on illegal activity. Meanwhile, a person who rats out a law-abiding person is usually considered to be the "stand up dude." How do you deal with the rat? Passive interference or pro-active interference? You know the guy will rat out your buddies? Do you rat him out to your buddies? If so, principle falls by the wayside. My wife is hotter than your wife. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bodypilot90 0 #11 March 17, 2003 Quote would say that it does matter in both situations. Let's just say a jumper was a solo hop-n-pop and they were high. No problem? What if that jumper hooked himself into a pond in front of the whole USPA BOD? There might be some repercussions. Stopping someone from taking AN ILLEGAL SUBSTANCE or an intoxicant before jumping might impact my enjoyment of the DZ I frequent. As in, I get to enjoy a stress free environment instead of trying to defend the vast majority of rule abiding jumpers there. I have banned jumpers from my aircraft after drinking and trying to jump. I can't catch them all but when I know about it I'll do something. Chris I agree 100% Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bbarnhouse 0 #12 March 17, 2003 QuoteI have banned jumpers from my aircraft after drinking and trying to jump. I can't catch them all but when I know about it I'll do something. Good for you Chris...ultimately the pilot is responsible. I take a pro-active stance. More often that not people are hurt or worse by others negligence. Not in my backyard nor in my playground if I can help it. There was an instance during a recent boogie where a jumper was geared up and manifested. He was obviously intoxicated for he could barely walk. I informed him (albeit politley) that he would not be jumping on that day. After he sobered up he actually thanked me and said "More people should have as much balls as you...you probably saved my life". It could have turned out a whole lot different.... Cheers Everyone! B~Squared Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VectorBoy 0 #13 March 17, 2003 Is this really about gettin high or did you get busted helping a sheep "over the fence" ? Actually either way I really don't care. Glen Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Iflyme 0 #14 March 17, 2003 Quotevictimless crimes (i.e. dope)Victimless crime??? Where the hell do you think your dope is grown? Organized criminals rent houses, completely destroying the insides, to grow your dope. Have you never heard of a "grow-op"? The person who owns the rental property is just one of the victims. That's just one example. Smoking pot is NOT a victimless crime. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zenister 0 #15 March 17, 2003 just to point out the straw man argument growing again.. those conditions you mention are created because its illegal, not because of any inherent property of the substance. If your tracing root causes the governments position actually creates that environment. as to "ratting" on someone I am a firm believer that things should be handled at the lowest level possible. If i see someone who acts or appears unsafe (in any environment) I would certainly say something to them (if only to avoid unnecessary drama). If they persist in their behavior so that it endangers myself or those i care about, then it become time to "elevate" things.____________________________________ Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
n2skdvn 0 #16 March 17, 2003 in the incidend decribed in the other thread the "rat" was an undercover cop and the accused is a friend of mine he is not happy about the situation and i cant comment on the rest due to his legal problems nuff said... if my calculations are correct SLINKY + ESCULATOR = EVERLASTING FUN my site Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MC208B 0 #17 March 17, 2003 Victimless crime??? Where the hell do you think your dope is grown? Organized criminals rent houses, completely destroying the insides, to grow your dope. Have you never heard of a "grow-op"? The person who owns the rental property is just one of the victims. That's just one example. Smoking pot is NOT a victimless crime. Sorry pal, it's not my dope, I don't use dope. Maybe you should fix yourself a drink and calm down Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #18 March 17, 2003 QuoteWhy does anyone feel the need to "tell on" another person? Alot of people say that if they come across this situation, they will leave. Well, OK, then leave. Just don't call the cops. Why is it that one person feels the need to have another person arrested for their actiions? Because some people feel they're self appointed holy riteousness supersedes anything else. They think they are more important than anyone else and have some warped need to impose their view and their will on others. Basically it all comes down to insecurity. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diverdriver 7 #19 March 17, 2003 [Sex Pistols] And Iiiiiii.....wannna beeeee......Anarchy!!!!!!!!![/johnny rotten] Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,120 #20 March 17, 2003 >Why is it that one person feels the need to have another person >arrested for their actiions? If they are doing something dangerous, their arrest may be preferable to their injury or death (or someone else's injury or death.) Talking to them and their friends is a good first step, but that doesn't always work. When all else fails, arresting someone may be the best of several bad options. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lazerq3 0 #21 March 18, 2003 QuotePeople who are unsatisfied with their own life will always feel compelled to reduce others' quality of life. Simple as that. On the other hand if someone is worried about being told on then they probably shouldnt be doing what ever it is there worried about being told on!!... The majority of poeple( now notice I said majority ..not all) that want dope leagalized or get pissed cause someone got caught up to no good are the ones doing the shit..!!! Goes back to "If your gonna play you may have to pay" PERIOD!!! If ya get away with it...hey more power to you but if you get cuaght ..suck it up and quit your bitchin!! jasonFreedom of speech includes volume Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
harryskydives 0 #22 March 18, 2003 Victimless crime??? Where the hell do you think your dope is grown ____________________________________________ The problem is this has been made a crime. I am sure no one has a problem reporting a beating / robbery to the police. I seems we could have learned from the prohibition of the 20's. When you look at all the crime associated with rec drugs and compare that to alcohol. Humm when was the last time a 7-11 owner shot up an Quicky Mart, because he was selling Budweiser cheeper?? i still do not want people who are hammered jumping and risking the DZ operation. Don't run out of altitude and experience at the same time... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Iflyme 0 #23 March 18, 2003 Quotei still do not want people who are hammered jumping and risking the DZ operationMe neither! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #24 March 18, 2003 Quote Humm when was the last time a 7-11 owner shot up an Quicky Mart, because he was selling Budweiser cheeper?? Simpson's episode 214. Of course shooting Apu has been reduced to a misdemeanor and small fine. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mountainman 0 #25 March 18, 2003 Quotepeople telling on people. Why does anyone feel the need to "tell on" another person? Why would I ? Because if I see people doing drugs or drinking and making it more unsafe for me to jump, someone is getting call. Simple as that.http://www.brandonandlaura.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
