PhillyKev 0 #76 July 17, 2003 Somewhere in the Federalist papers they discussed what they intended by the right to bear arms. They didn't intend for average citizens to have canons or war ships or other heavy arms of the day. They intended for them to be equipped and have access to what a standard foot soldier would. I'd say that assault rifles with full capacity magazines fit into that description. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jib 0 #77 July 17, 2003 I *think* that's what the Supreme Court said about 65 years ago in a case arising from a sawed off shotgun. -------------------------------------------------- the depth of his depravity sickens me. -- Jerry Falwell, People v. Larry Flynt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jfields 0 #78 July 18, 2003 QuoteIt sounds like you are just the kind of subject the one world government is looking for . " You are going to take my land to build a road , that annoys me but I guess there is nothing I can do about it so pay less than what it's worth and I will accept it " . Hire a fucking lawyer and fight the sons of bitches . Grow some balls between your legs people . Come on. Grow up. Kevin and I totally disagree on this, but we can go back and forth on points and learn from each other without resorting to profanity and immature taunts. Before slinging insults, give a try to engaging in educated rational discussion. Before telling people to grow balls, consider engaging something much more fundamental, namely, your brain. If that is too much to ask, I apologize in advance. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Unstable 9 #79 July 18, 2003 I wish the UN would realize that they are a treaty organization - not a world Government. I'm not a member of the John Birch Society, but i do feel that the UN is getting out of hand here.=========Shaun ========== Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites jumprunner 0 #80 July 18, 2003 QuoteThe UN would ask for "TROOPS" from America to help disarm Americans. The power behind the UN is the US. No two ways about it. So, SWOOP THEM IF THEY CAN'T TAKE A JOKE. Im afraid you may have a point here, the US may very well be its own worst enemy. This is not to say they are necessarily backed by the US govt, but moreso by Americans with a lot of political and financial clout, and by the democrats. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites jumprunner 0 #81 July 18, 2003 QuoteAll the more reason to get the Fuck out of the UN, and to kick the UN out of the USA. What good are they really? Do you think single gun ownership in the US or other countries is the biggest concern the UN should have? This is just stupid.... I hate the UN almost as much as I hate the ACLU!!!!! Dont forget the NAACP. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rhino 0 #82 July 18, 2003 QuoteSo if bush declares war on the UN for this attack on our sovereignty, is it OK to bomb the UN because its in New York? Smart Ass!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rhino 0 #83 July 18, 2003 Quote""The United Nations remains firmly committed to prevent, combat and eradicate the illicit trade of small arms and light weapons in all its aspects," he said. " They would have to defeat the NRA and that will NEVER happen. The NRA is better armed than the UN.. LOL Rhino Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites jumprunner 0 #84 July 18, 2003 QuoteDon't you have to register your firearms Kev? How does registering your firearms cause a legal user a problem? Confiscation. Not hard when you have the list of people who own them and what they own. Registration always leads to confiscation, which is the underlying, intended purpose of registration. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Jib 0 #85 July 18, 2003 Quote The NRA is better armed than the UN.. LOL ROTFLMAO!!!! -------------------------------------------------- the depth of his depravity sickens me. -- Jerry Falwell, People v. Larry Flynt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites jumprunner 0 #86 July 18, 2003 Quote*** We cannot show that strong united resolve and defiance, because "we", the American people, don't have a united opinion. I'm in favor of registration. So are lots of other Americans. Lots aren't. Welcome to our country. Land of the free... to argue about everything. I see registration as a good thing. It helps us keep track of the weapons, and who their rightful owners are. If a particular type of weapon is outlawed, registration aids in the efficient enforcement of the law. If you own that type of weapon, your objection shouldn't be the enforcement of the law, but the law itself. (Not talking about overzealous enforcement of things that aren't laws, just proper enforcement of those on the books.) Sir, You may be entitled to your opinion, and this may be the opinion of many Americans, but I know that the reasoning behind opinions like this are to create a dictorial govt which will enslave the freedoms of its population, this is your goal and this is what you and people like you want to see happen. So hopefully, you will never get your way. "Give me freedom or give me death" - Thomas Jefferson I support what he said and like many, I will live by it. If you or people like you want my guns, then my freedom, you will have to kill me for it. Death is scary when youre jumping out of a plane for the first time not knowing whats going to happen, it is much less scary when I see nothing to live for because I have to live under a dictorial govt, and under the circumstances, I wouldnt be in the slightest bit afraid to die. Those that want my freedom, guns, or anything else I own, and plan on comming after it, my question is: under the circumstances, are you afraid to die? If the UN plans on collecting arms in this country, they are going to have a serious problem. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mnischalke 0 #87 July 18, 2003 The UN is a joke! They want to rule the world with this new world order neo-utopia crap that will NEVER fucking work. People are humans after all. Peace and harmony will never exist completely in humanity. We are flawed, folks. Tell me there's never been a time you wished someone harm. It's just human nature. The sooner some people realize that, the sooner we can work to at least better ourselves rather than spending countless billions on stupid projects just to disarm and unify the world. If you want to be sick, just do a little research on how the UN handled Rwanda. Find and watch "The Last Just Man." Fucking sickening shit. That's certainly just one of the long list of failures the UN has tried to interject itself into halfheartedly at the great expense of only a handful of countries. Somalia was another. I know first hand how mishandled operations in that little piece of shit country were. After they made us look like shit (yet again) until we joined in their little reindeer games soiree, they turned around and tied our hands very tightly. Again, the UN sucks ass. I, as one voting American, want out. mike Girls only want boyfriends who have great skills--You know, like nunchuk skills, bow-hunting skills, computer-hacking skills. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites jumprunner 0 #88 July 18, 2003 In a speech at the annual meeting of the G8, Brazil's President Luiz Inacio Lula da Silva pushed the arms-sales tax as a scheme whereby the world's wealthiest nations could fund efforts to eliminate world hunger, Bloomberg News reported earlier this week. The G8 countries are U.S., UK, France, Germany, Italy, Canada, Japan and Russia. Quoting the Brazilian paper Folha de S. Paulo, Bloomberg reported that Lula said such taxes would create "a global fund capable of giving food to those who are hungry and for creating the conditions to end the causes of hunger." Doesnt this sound a bit apocolyptic? I really think the problem here goes way, way beyond the possession of firearms. These actions by the UN are in accordance with what is in Revelations. And when will people finally come to realize, it isnt just your guns they want. You must be silly if you think theyre going to stop there. Its your soul they want. In many African countries, Christians are being threatned to either give up thier beliefs or die, or be tortured to death. The latest one I heard of is the act of hammering nails into the skulls of anyone who didnt immediately choose to give up Christian beliefs and convert to Muslim beliefs. The act of first removing any defenses you might have is the first step into this type of progression. Left wingers who want gun control are basically people who are adversaries to Christianity, they want this kind of disarmement so that it will be easier to persecute anyone with Christian beliefs, eliminating any way for them to fight back and survive the outcome. This is what gun control is all about, and this is the only purpose it serves, it serves no other purpose. Its also the reason why gun control fanatics never go after criminals with guns, they obviously dont support Christian beliefs. Its only the law abiding type that they are after, the ones who dont propose any kind of threat to society, who may use firearms as a means of survival when the situation arises. Why dont you just admit what you really are Mr Fields...another athiest with a cause. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites jfields 0 #89 July 18, 2003 QuoteLeft wingers who want gun control are basically people who are adversaries to Christianity, they want this kind of disarmement so that it will be easier to persecute anyone with Christian beliefs, eliminating any way for them to fight back and survive the outcome. This is what gun control is all about, and this is the only purpose it serves, it serves no other purpose. Excuse my bluntness, but this is a load of crap. What about the Christian "left-wingers" that support gun control? What about the people that are trying to preserve your ability to own guns, despite your own best efforts to alienate them? If you think this is a special plot against Christianity, perhaps your senses are a bit skewed. QuoteWhy dont you just admit what you really are Mr Fields...another athiest with a cause. What cause are you accusing me of having? In the context of this conversation, I've said: If we have a law, we ought to enforce it. We have lots of laws we shouldn't. I'm not pushing for the specific ban of any weapons. All Americans are not agreed on firearm issues. Which of those is the "cause" I'm taking up. Please clarify. I'd love to know. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites fasterfaller 0 #90 July 18, 2003 That was not an insult . If I insulted you , you would clearly know it . Guys like you just don't get it about gun control and never will . Registration is the first step towards confistation . Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites jfields 0 #91 July 18, 2003 Would you believe you are providing the first real laughs and entertainment in this thread? Just who are "Guys like me"? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites PhillyKev 0 #92 July 18, 2003 Ok...now we've entered the bizarro world. Taxing small arms I do believe is designed to relegate the poor and lower classes to the masses of the unarmed, particularly in S. America and third world areas. The more expensive guns are, the better for the ruling class. But how did religion get into this? I feel like I'm reading something from David Koresh. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites jfields 0 #93 July 18, 2003 QuoteBut how did religion get into this? I feel like I'm reading something from David Koresh. Me too. Going into the creepy zone. A few posts above mine, and the one I was responding to: http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=573649#573649 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites PhillyKev 0 #94 July 18, 2003 Yeah, I know....my reply was directed that way, just clicked in the wrong place. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SkyDekker 1,465 #95 July 18, 2003 QuoteThere's no need to bomb the UN. We pay for most of it. So, just withdraw funding for it and its programs. Actually for years the US did not pay its share of the UN bill. The UN lived through that, so I don't think it would be quite as easy as that. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Amazon 7 #96 July 18, 2003 QuoteBut how did religion get into this? I feel like I'm reading something from David Koresh. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Me too. Going into the creepy zone. If I remember bible studies correctly. Christ was a pacifist.. render unto Ceasar etc.....I dont think he carried a Roman Short Sword( ancient version of the Glock) under that long flowing robe they wore. I myself am FAR from being an athiest having been educated in parochial schools. I cant STAND modern churches that blur the line between government and christianity. AS far as Koresh and Jim Jones et al..... I do believe in a certain chapter and verse.... there is that little part about.... " In the latter days there will arise many FALSE prophets" Anyone watched the Right Wing TV evangelists lately??? There are your false prophets in the flesh. They are not far removed from being the cultists. OH and before the flames start.. I am a gun owner/ user and NRA member and a veteran and a liberal who believes in human rights for ALL people. Amazon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites jumprunner 0 #97 July 18, 2003 QuoteQuoteLeft wingers who want gun control are basically people who are adversaries to Christianity, they want this kind of disarmement so that it will be easier to persecute anyone with Christian beliefs, eliminating any way for them to fight back and survive the outcome. This is what gun control is all about, and this is the only purpose it serves, it serves no other purpose. Excuse my bluntness, but this is a load of crap. What about the Christian "left-wingers" that support gun control? What about the people that are trying to preserve your ability to own guns, despite your own best efforts to alienate them? If you think this is a special plot against Christianity, perhaps your senses are a bit skewed. QuoteWhy dont you just admit what you really are Mr Fields...another athiest with a cause. What cause are you accusing me of having? In the context of this conversation, I've said: If we have a law, we ought to enforce it. We have lots of laws we shouldn't. I'm not pushing for the specific ban of any weapons. All Americans are not agreed on firearm issues. Which of those is the "cause" I'm taking up. Please clarify. I'd love to know. Gun control targets those law abiding people who own guns who use them for self defense, hunting, target shooting, ect. It does absolutely nothing to even remotely affect criminals with guns, since they would not be affected by registration at all. I think it would be pretty idiotic to imagine a criminal registering his gun because its the law. So you end up with a disarmed population that has absolutely no defense against crime, and a field day for those criminals who are still armed. And please dont tell me the police are here to protect you, the police arent there to protect anyone, they handle crimes after the fact (after it happens), not before. tell the American public that their local police force does not have - and never had - a duty to protect the average person, according to the U.S. Supreme Court and state Supreme Courts or Courts of Appeal; - Aaron Zelman - Speech to NRA Board If someone breaks into your house, do you really think the cops are going to be there in time to save your life? In most parts of town, it takes them at least an hour if not more to show up if they show up at all. It takes less than a minute for someone to break into your house and kill you. So what is the logic behind gun control? To stop crime? Obviously not, as we have just seen. So what are the real motives? Maybe you can explain that. I dont know any Christian organizations that sponsor gun control, they usually avoid the issue altogether whereas they are more involved with trying to promote belief in Christ. As for you, you can believe in what you want, you can be an athiest, or maybe a devil worshiper, whatever you are its your God given choice to be that, and I support it because its God's will. But, when people like you try to force your own choices on others, especially through things like disarmement followed by violence and threats, it becomes a different ballgame altogether. If you want to go to hell, then go there, but I wont be joining you. Thats something you need to understand. On this note: What cause are you accusing me of having? Im not accusing you of anything. What Im trying to say is that I know the real motive behind gun control, basically, it leads to the day when you want to take my life if I dont change by beliefs in accordance with yours. I just wish yall would stop covering up your real motives and state what youre trying to do. And dont tell me that this is all BS when it has already happened in several African countries...gun control, weapons bans, making private firearms illegal, then Christians getting tortured and killed for their beliefs. Thats the pattern. Ofcourse the process would take a lot longer in more developed countries like the US, but the end result is the same in the long run. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites jumprunner 0 #98 July 18, 2003 QuoteQuoteBut how did religion get into this? I feel like I'm reading something from David Koresh. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Me too. Going into the creepy zone. If I remember bible studies correctly. Christ was a pacifist.. render unto Ceasar etc.....I dont think he carried a Roman Short Sword( ancient version of the Glock) under that long flowing robe they wore. I myself am FAR from being an athiest having been educated in parochial schools. I cant STAND modern churches that blur the line between government and christianity. AS far as Koresh and Jim Jones et al..... I do believe in a certain chapter and verse.... there is that little part about.... " In the latter days there will arise many FALSE prophets" Anyone watched the Right Wing TV evangelists lately??? There are your false prophets in the flesh. They are not far removed from being the cultists. OH and before the flames start.. I am a gun owner/ user and NRA member and a veteran and a liberal who believes in human rights for ALL people. Amazon Ditto! I cant agree with you more. This isnt about Koresh, Jim Jones, religion and Christ are two different things, religion is based on idolitry and they use Christ to make themselves legitimate. Im not a church goer at all, dont listen to any TV or any other kind of evangelism, and dont have a religion. Im actually against going to church period since Christ rebelled against the church. Anyway, I can go on an on. But about the "creepy zone", Id say things are getting pretty creepy...the UN, one world government, world financial system, solution to end hunger throughout the world, looks to me like its comming down. Also, believing in human rights does not make you a liberal, being socially destructive does. I dont have any problem with liberals as long as they dont try to force their beliefs on me, either through politics or otherwise. Anyway, whatevers happening, noone can change it, so you worry about skydiving, Ill worry about surfing and maybe skydiving, and we'll leave it at that. Focus on something you can change, not something you cant. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JDBoston 0 #99 July 18, 2003 Uhhhh... I hope this is a troll. It looks like it got copied off some kind of conspiracy theory parody Website. I'd be interested to hear you cite some sources and figures to back up the assertions in your post. Curious where you get this stuff. Gun control is all about persecuting Christians? Huh? Well I'll give you this, at least I haven't heard that one before. Beer! Joe Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites jumprunner 0 #100 July 18, 2003 QuoteUhhhh... I hope this is a troll. It looks like it got copied off some kind of conspiracy theory parody Website. I'd be interested to hear you cite some sources and figures to back up the assertions in your post. Curious where you get this stuff. Gun control is all about persecuting Christians? Huh? Well I'll give you this, at least I haven't heard that one before. Beer! Joe Sorry, drank up all the beer in SoCal last week in the form of yeager bombs. You can dig up the sources yourself by doing a little searching, but I wont argue about it, whether it is about persecuting Christians, limiting the freedoms of individuals, or whatever, what it isnt about is the safety of the population or to reduce crime, especially since it has been shown to actually increase the crime rate in every country that has banned private weapons. Ill leave it to you to search for that one too. Maybe you can start here: Jews for the Preservation of Firearms Ownership You Won the Battle But Lost the War So if you want to argue with somebody about it or call somebody a troll, maybe you can do that with someone who spent some time in a Nazi death camp. Doesnt sound to me like youve heard much about anything. But I guess you just know it all since youve had so much experience in that area. Heres' something from the JFPO website just in case youre too lazy to look up things for yourself (and keep in mind...I didnt say it, Im just citing it): JPFO is bringing our powerful gun ownership message to television. Like it or not, millions of people watch and get their information from TV. So we're developing a gripping documentary film showing how victim disarmament kills people. Certainly it will tell the history of evil governments using "gun control" schemes to disarm and then murder a targeted group. But it will do more. This film will show how "gun control" in America and other countries is getting innocent people killed right now. Instead of promoting self-defense, governments continue to gather power to themselves while enacting laws that mandate victim disarmament and that leads to incalculable human misery. Maybe you shoud visit a Nazi death camp sometime instead of sitting on this forum and rambling on with your nonsense, that way you may actually learn something about "targeted individuals". Since you like being such a proponent of gun control, you might want to know where our gun control laws come from: Your federal government even passed a "gun-control" law (the Gun Control Act of 1968) based directly on the Nazi law that Sen. Thomas Dodd had the Library of Congress translate for him. He had to have it translated, out of German. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 4 5 Next Page 4 of 5 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. 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Unstable 9 #79 July 18, 2003 I wish the UN would realize that they are a treaty organization - not a world Government. I'm not a member of the John Birch Society, but i do feel that the UN is getting out of hand here.=========Shaun ========== Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jumprunner 0 #80 July 18, 2003 QuoteThe UN would ask for "TROOPS" from America to help disarm Americans. The power behind the UN is the US. No two ways about it. So, SWOOP THEM IF THEY CAN'T TAKE A JOKE. Im afraid you may have a point here, the US may very well be its own worst enemy. This is not to say they are necessarily backed by the US govt, but moreso by Americans with a lot of political and financial clout, and by the democrats. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jumprunner 0 #81 July 18, 2003 QuoteAll the more reason to get the Fuck out of the UN, and to kick the UN out of the USA. What good are they really? Do you think single gun ownership in the US or other countries is the biggest concern the UN should have? This is just stupid.... I hate the UN almost as much as I hate the ACLU!!!!! Dont forget the NAACP. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #82 July 18, 2003 QuoteSo if bush declares war on the UN for this attack on our sovereignty, is it OK to bomb the UN because its in New York? Smart Ass!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #83 July 18, 2003 Quote""The United Nations remains firmly committed to prevent, combat and eradicate the illicit trade of small arms and light weapons in all its aspects," he said. " They would have to defeat the NRA and that will NEVER happen. The NRA is better armed than the UN.. LOL Rhino Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jumprunner 0 #84 July 18, 2003 QuoteDon't you have to register your firearms Kev? How does registering your firearms cause a legal user a problem? Confiscation. Not hard when you have the list of people who own them and what they own. Registration always leads to confiscation, which is the underlying, intended purpose of registration. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jib 0 #85 July 18, 2003 Quote The NRA is better armed than the UN.. LOL ROTFLMAO!!!! -------------------------------------------------- the depth of his depravity sickens me. -- Jerry Falwell, People v. Larry Flynt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jumprunner 0 #86 July 18, 2003 Quote*** We cannot show that strong united resolve and defiance, because "we", the American people, don't have a united opinion. I'm in favor of registration. So are lots of other Americans. Lots aren't. Welcome to our country. Land of the free... to argue about everything. I see registration as a good thing. It helps us keep track of the weapons, and who their rightful owners are. If a particular type of weapon is outlawed, registration aids in the efficient enforcement of the law. If you own that type of weapon, your objection shouldn't be the enforcement of the law, but the law itself. (Not talking about overzealous enforcement of things that aren't laws, just proper enforcement of those on the books.) Sir, You may be entitled to your opinion, and this may be the opinion of many Americans, but I know that the reasoning behind opinions like this are to create a dictorial govt which will enslave the freedoms of its population, this is your goal and this is what you and people like you want to see happen. So hopefully, you will never get your way. "Give me freedom or give me death" - Thomas Jefferson I support what he said and like many, I will live by it. If you or people like you want my guns, then my freedom, you will have to kill me for it. Death is scary when youre jumping out of a plane for the first time not knowing whats going to happen, it is much less scary when I see nothing to live for because I have to live under a dictorial govt, and under the circumstances, I wouldnt be in the slightest bit afraid to die. Those that want my freedom, guns, or anything else I own, and plan on comming after it, my question is: under the circumstances, are you afraid to die? If the UN plans on collecting arms in this country, they are going to have a serious problem. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnischalke 0 #87 July 18, 2003 The UN is a joke! They want to rule the world with this new world order neo-utopia crap that will NEVER fucking work. People are humans after all. Peace and harmony will never exist completely in humanity. We are flawed, folks. Tell me there's never been a time you wished someone harm. It's just human nature. The sooner some people realize that, the sooner we can work to at least better ourselves rather than spending countless billions on stupid projects just to disarm and unify the world. If you want to be sick, just do a little research on how the UN handled Rwanda. Find and watch "The Last Just Man." Fucking sickening shit. That's certainly just one of the long list of failures the UN has tried to interject itself into halfheartedly at the great expense of only a handful of countries. Somalia was another. I know first hand how mishandled operations in that little piece of shit country were. After they made us look like shit (yet again) until we joined in their little reindeer games soiree, they turned around and tied our hands very tightly. Again, the UN sucks ass. I, as one voting American, want out. mike Girls only want boyfriends who have great skills--You know, like nunchuk skills, bow-hunting skills, computer-hacking skills. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jumprunner 0 #88 July 18, 2003 In a speech at the annual meeting of the G8, Brazil's President Luiz Inacio Lula da Silva pushed the arms-sales tax as a scheme whereby the world's wealthiest nations could fund efforts to eliminate world hunger, Bloomberg News reported earlier this week. The G8 countries are U.S., UK, France, Germany, Italy, Canada, Japan and Russia. Quoting the Brazilian paper Folha de S. Paulo, Bloomberg reported that Lula said such taxes would create "a global fund capable of giving food to those who are hungry and for creating the conditions to end the causes of hunger." Doesnt this sound a bit apocolyptic? I really think the problem here goes way, way beyond the possession of firearms. These actions by the UN are in accordance with what is in Revelations. And when will people finally come to realize, it isnt just your guns they want. You must be silly if you think theyre going to stop there. Its your soul they want. In many African countries, Christians are being threatned to either give up thier beliefs or die, or be tortured to death. The latest one I heard of is the act of hammering nails into the skulls of anyone who didnt immediately choose to give up Christian beliefs and convert to Muslim beliefs. The act of first removing any defenses you might have is the first step into this type of progression. Left wingers who want gun control are basically people who are adversaries to Christianity, they want this kind of disarmement so that it will be easier to persecute anyone with Christian beliefs, eliminating any way for them to fight back and survive the outcome. This is what gun control is all about, and this is the only purpose it serves, it serves no other purpose. Its also the reason why gun control fanatics never go after criminals with guns, they obviously dont support Christian beliefs. Its only the law abiding type that they are after, the ones who dont propose any kind of threat to society, who may use firearms as a means of survival when the situation arises. Why dont you just admit what you really are Mr Fields...another athiest with a cause. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jfields 0 #89 July 18, 2003 QuoteLeft wingers who want gun control are basically people who are adversaries to Christianity, they want this kind of disarmement so that it will be easier to persecute anyone with Christian beliefs, eliminating any way for them to fight back and survive the outcome. This is what gun control is all about, and this is the only purpose it serves, it serves no other purpose. Excuse my bluntness, but this is a load of crap. What about the Christian "left-wingers" that support gun control? What about the people that are trying to preserve your ability to own guns, despite your own best efforts to alienate them? If you think this is a special plot against Christianity, perhaps your senses are a bit skewed. QuoteWhy dont you just admit what you really are Mr Fields...another athiest with a cause. What cause are you accusing me of having? In the context of this conversation, I've said: If we have a law, we ought to enforce it. We have lots of laws we shouldn't. I'm not pushing for the specific ban of any weapons. All Americans are not agreed on firearm issues. Which of those is the "cause" I'm taking up. Please clarify. I'd love to know. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
fasterfaller 0 #90 July 18, 2003 That was not an insult . If I insulted you , you would clearly know it . Guys like you just don't get it about gun control and never will . Registration is the first step towards confistation . Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jfields 0 #91 July 18, 2003 Would you believe you are providing the first real laughs and entertainment in this thread? Just who are "Guys like me"? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #92 July 18, 2003 Ok...now we've entered the bizarro world. Taxing small arms I do believe is designed to relegate the poor and lower classes to the masses of the unarmed, particularly in S. America and third world areas. The more expensive guns are, the better for the ruling class. But how did religion get into this? I feel like I'm reading something from David Koresh. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jfields 0 #93 July 18, 2003 QuoteBut how did religion get into this? I feel like I'm reading something from David Koresh. Me too. Going into the creepy zone. A few posts above mine, and the one I was responding to: http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=573649#573649 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #94 July 18, 2003 Yeah, I know....my reply was directed that way, just clicked in the wrong place. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #95 July 18, 2003 QuoteThere's no need to bomb the UN. We pay for most of it. So, just withdraw funding for it and its programs. Actually for years the US did not pay its share of the UN bill. The UN lived through that, so I don't think it would be quite as easy as that. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #96 July 18, 2003 QuoteBut how did religion get into this? I feel like I'm reading something from David Koresh. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Me too. Going into the creepy zone. If I remember bible studies correctly. Christ was a pacifist.. render unto Ceasar etc.....I dont think he carried a Roman Short Sword( ancient version of the Glock) under that long flowing robe they wore. I myself am FAR from being an athiest having been educated in parochial schools. I cant STAND modern churches that blur the line between government and christianity. AS far as Koresh and Jim Jones et al..... I do believe in a certain chapter and verse.... there is that little part about.... " In the latter days there will arise many FALSE prophets" Anyone watched the Right Wing TV evangelists lately??? There are your false prophets in the flesh. They are not far removed from being the cultists. OH and before the flames start.. I am a gun owner/ user and NRA member and a veteran and a liberal who believes in human rights for ALL people. Amazon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jumprunner 0 #97 July 18, 2003 QuoteQuoteLeft wingers who want gun control are basically people who are adversaries to Christianity, they want this kind of disarmement so that it will be easier to persecute anyone with Christian beliefs, eliminating any way for them to fight back and survive the outcome. This is what gun control is all about, and this is the only purpose it serves, it serves no other purpose. Excuse my bluntness, but this is a load of crap. What about the Christian "left-wingers" that support gun control? What about the people that are trying to preserve your ability to own guns, despite your own best efforts to alienate them? If you think this is a special plot against Christianity, perhaps your senses are a bit skewed. QuoteWhy dont you just admit what you really are Mr Fields...another athiest with a cause. What cause are you accusing me of having? In the context of this conversation, I've said: If we have a law, we ought to enforce it. We have lots of laws we shouldn't. I'm not pushing for the specific ban of any weapons. All Americans are not agreed on firearm issues. Which of those is the "cause" I'm taking up. Please clarify. I'd love to know. Gun control targets those law abiding people who own guns who use them for self defense, hunting, target shooting, ect. It does absolutely nothing to even remotely affect criminals with guns, since they would not be affected by registration at all. I think it would be pretty idiotic to imagine a criminal registering his gun because its the law. So you end up with a disarmed population that has absolutely no defense against crime, and a field day for those criminals who are still armed. And please dont tell me the police are here to protect you, the police arent there to protect anyone, they handle crimes after the fact (after it happens), not before. tell the American public that their local police force does not have - and never had - a duty to protect the average person, according to the U.S. Supreme Court and state Supreme Courts or Courts of Appeal; - Aaron Zelman - Speech to NRA Board If someone breaks into your house, do you really think the cops are going to be there in time to save your life? In most parts of town, it takes them at least an hour if not more to show up if they show up at all. It takes less than a minute for someone to break into your house and kill you. So what is the logic behind gun control? To stop crime? Obviously not, as we have just seen. So what are the real motives? Maybe you can explain that. I dont know any Christian organizations that sponsor gun control, they usually avoid the issue altogether whereas they are more involved with trying to promote belief in Christ. As for you, you can believe in what you want, you can be an athiest, or maybe a devil worshiper, whatever you are its your God given choice to be that, and I support it because its God's will. But, when people like you try to force your own choices on others, especially through things like disarmement followed by violence and threats, it becomes a different ballgame altogether. If you want to go to hell, then go there, but I wont be joining you. Thats something you need to understand. On this note: What cause are you accusing me of having? Im not accusing you of anything. What Im trying to say is that I know the real motive behind gun control, basically, it leads to the day when you want to take my life if I dont change by beliefs in accordance with yours. I just wish yall would stop covering up your real motives and state what youre trying to do. And dont tell me that this is all BS when it has already happened in several African countries...gun control, weapons bans, making private firearms illegal, then Christians getting tortured and killed for their beliefs. Thats the pattern. Ofcourse the process would take a lot longer in more developed countries like the US, but the end result is the same in the long run. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jumprunner 0 #98 July 18, 2003 QuoteQuoteBut how did religion get into this? I feel like I'm reading something from David Koresh. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Me too. Going into the creepy zone. If I remember bible studies correctly. Christ was a pacifist.. render unto Ceasar etc.....I dont think he carried a Roman Short Sword( ancient version of the Glock) under that long flowing robe they wore. I myself am FAR from being an athiest having been educated in parochial schools. I cant STAND modern churches that blur the line between government and christianity. AS far as Koresh and Jim Jones et al..... I do believe in a certain chapter and verse.... there is that little part about.... " In the latter days there will arise many FALSE prophets" Anyone watched the Right Wing TV evangelists lately??? There are your false prophets in the flesh. They are not far removed from being the cultists. OH and before the flames start.. I am a gun owner/ user and NRA member and a veteran and a liberal who believes in human rights for ALL people. Amazon Ditto! I cant agree with you more. This isnt about Koresh, Jim Jones, religion and Christ are two different things, religion is based on idolitry and they use Christ to make themselves legitimate. Im not a church goer at all, dont listen to any TV or any other kind of evangelism, and dont have a religion. Im actually against going to church period since Christ rebelled against the church. Anyway, I can go on an on. But about the "creepy zone", Id say things are getting pretty creepy...the UN, one world government, world financial system, solution to end hunger throughout the world, looks to me like its comming down. Also, believing in human rights does not make you a liberal, being socially destructive does. I dont have any problem with liberals as long as they dont try to force their beliefs on me, either through politics or otherwise. Anyway, whatevers happening, noone can change it, so you worry about skydiving, Ill worry about surfing and maybe skydiving, and we'll leave it at that. Focus on something you can change, not something you cant. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JDBoston 0 #99 July 18, 2003 Uhhhh... I hope this is a troll. It looks like it got copied off some kind of conspiracy theory parody Website. I'd be interested to hear you cite some sources and figures to back up the assertions in your post. Curious where you get this stuff. Gun control is all about persecuting Christians? Huh? Well I'll give you this, at least I haven't heard that one before. Beer! Joe Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jumprunner 0 #100 July 18, 2003 QuoteUhhhh... I hope this is a troll. It looks like it got copied off some kind of conspiracy theory parody Website. I'd be interested to hear you cite some sources and figures to back up the assertions in your post. Curious where you get this stuff. Gun control is all about persecuting Christians? Huh? Well I'll give you this, at least I haven't heard that one before. Beer! Joe Sorry, drank up all the beer in SoCal last week in the form of yeager bombs. You can dig up the sources yourself by doing a little searching, but I wont argue about it, whether it is about persecuting Christians, limiting the freedoms of individuals, or whatever, what it isnt about is the safety of the population or to reduce crime, especially since it has been shown to actually increase the crime rate in every country that has banned private weapons. Ill leave it to you to search for that one too. Maybe you can start here: Jews for the Preservation of Firearms Ownership You Won the Battle But Lost the War So if you want to argue with somebody about it or call somebody a troll, maybe you can do that with someone who spent some time in a Nazi death camp. Doesnt sound to me like youve heard much about anything. But I guess you just know it all since youve had so much experience in that area. Heres' something from the JFPO website just in case youre too lazy to look up things for yourself (and keep in mind...I didnt say it, Im just citing it): JPFO is bringing our powerful gun ownership message to television. Like it or not, millions of people watch and get their information from TV. So we're developing a gripping documentary film showing how victim disarmament kills people. Certainly it will tell the history of evil governments using "gun control" schemes to disarm and then murder a targeted group. But it will do more. This film will show how "gun control" in America and other countries is getting innocent people killed right now. Instead of promoting self-defense, governments continue to gather power to themselves while enacting laws that mandate victim disarmament and that leads to incalculable human misery. Maybe you shoud visit a Nazi death camp sometime instead of sitting on this forum and rambling on with your nonsense, that way you may actually learn something about "targeted individuals". Since you like being such a proponent of gun control, you might want to know where our gun control laws come from: Your federal government even passed a "gun-control" law (the Gun Control Act of 1968) based directly on the Nazi law that Sen. Thomas Dodd had the Library of Congress translate for him. He had to have it translated, out of German. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
