The Monday Morning Gun Debate.

[miked10270 0]

Hi Y'all,

Yeah... OK... I know this has kind of been done to death, but "This just in" from World News Daily:

http://wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=34355

One of the things that the Gun Owners of America objects to is that students would be asked:

"Whether the right to keep and bear arms is still as 'important today' as it was in the 18th century, and to decide what 'limitations' should be placed on the right,"

So... 2 points:

1. Should this question be asked?

If yes (gotta love dat good ole "Free Speech" thing), then...

2. Is the right to keep and bear arms as important today as it was int the 18th Century, and what limitations or conditions (if any) should be imposed on this right?


Let's face it, King George III is kind of dead now, and the Brits & French ain't coming back to invade anytime soon. In the case of the Brits their army is all kind of busy in Iraq! Also, it's completely uncivilised to invade a country before afternoon Tiffin, and after Tiffin, one really just wants to snooze with a good book. In the case of the French... Well... Nowadays they prefer to host the invasion - it all makes for a far faster surrender and less travel sickness.

So... Discuss..

Mike.

Taking the piss out of the FrenchAmericans since before it was fashionable.

Prenait la pisse hors du FrançaisCanadiens méridionaux puisqu'avant lui à la mode.

[pds 0]

i dont know much about the gun owners of america, or even the nra for that matter.

i do know that i have the right to say what i want and i have the right (although it is held out to be a priveledge) to own firearms.

if one likes living in a country where you can be jailed for defending yourself in your own home, from a intruder, more power to you.

happily, i do not live in a country like that.

why dont gun control freaks go try to take the guns away from the somolis or afghans and get the fuck offa my constitutional rights.

namaste, motherfucker.

[lazyfrog 0]

in my country (very small and multi cultural) (switzerland) (nooooo not sweden) most of the people hava a gun at home, actually there are more than 300'000 weapons in homes... we "receive" them when we do our military service (at approx 20 yrs old) and keep them until we are "liberated" from this same service at approx 50... and nearly no murder or accident involves one of these weapons.
I guess it's a question of education.

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Fumer tue, péter pue
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ourson #10, Mosquito Uno, CBT 579

[pds 0]

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in my country (very small and multi cultural) (switzerland) (nooooo not sweden) most of the people hava a gun at home, actually there are more than 300'000 weapons in homes... we "receive" them when we do our military service (at approx 20 yrs old) and keep them until we are "liberated" from this same service at approx 50... and nearly no murder or accident involves one of these weapons.
I guess it's a question of education.

right-fuckin-on. now that is proof of intelligent life on this planet.

i will never deny that america has a gun problem. but the vast majority of american gun owners are not part of it.

namaste, motherfucker.

[miked10270 0]

Hey Sky,

Looks like these posts have just bumped you from "Old Hand" to "Addict". Congrats

Anyway... How do you fix the "American Gun Problem" without affecting the overwhelming majority of responsible, law-abiding, sensible gun owners?

Mike.

Taking the piss out of the FrenchAmericans since before it was fashionable.

Prenait la pisse hors du FrançaisCanadiens méridionaux puisqu'avant lui à la mode.

[pds 0]

lmao. thanks for noticing my right of passage.

fix the problem? i don't think the best solution i can think of is a solution that would work. i say remove the stigma and restrictive legislation and allow law abiding and responsible gun owning americans to overwhelmingly outnumber violent criminals. the problem i see with this is that the highest concentrations of armed criminals are in communities with socio-economic issues that would preclude more prevalent gun ownership.

i don't pretend to have an answer, but the old adage 'outlaw guns and only outlaws will have guns' still rings true.

namaste, motherfucker.

[miked10270 0]

What about some form of gun control and gun registration?

Lets say that if you want to hold guns & ammunition then you've gotta get a licence from the police or Federal agency. Any gun you buy or acquire is recorded against your licence so there's (ideally) a record of who owns what gun. Anytime you gain or lose a gun you get your licence amended. Guns & ammunition is only sold to folk with a licence. You can only get rid of a gun by giving it to a licence holder or dealer (or if it's stolen). After a while, the only place you'd get a gun is from a dealer or another licence holder.

Holding gun(s) &/or ammunition without a licence is an offence. Supplying gun(s) &/or ammunition to non licence holder is offence. etc...

So who gets a licence? ANYONE. At least anyone over age with certain exceptions like person convicted of certain crimes (armed robbery would be a biggie)

In effect, a way of differentiating between the law-abiding majority & the criminal minority and starting to make it harder for the minority to acquire firearms.

Just a thought...

Mike.

Taking the piss out of the FrenchAmericans since before it was fashionable.

Prenait la pisse hors du FrançaisCanadiens méridionaux puisqu'avant lui à la mode.

[pds 0]

better idea from a deeper thinker....

hand the guns out fo free. make bullets cost five thoouuusand dollars... EACH. thats a solution.


mike, the criminal minority will NEVER have ANY trouble getting or using firearms. it is ALREADY an offence for them to own firearms and it is ALREADY an offense to sell to them.

namaste, motherfucker.

[miked10270 0]

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better idea from a deeper thinker....

hand the guns out fo free. make bullets cost five thoouuusand dollars... EACH. thats a solution.

Yeah, that'd work... but don't you think it's kinda hard on that guy who's got the quad .50" aa gun (for home defense of course)?

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mike, the criminal minority will NEVER have ANY trouble getting or using firearms. it is ALREADY an offence for them to own firearms and it is ALREADY an offense to sell to them.

True, I was just trying to get individual guns recorded against individual owners - that way there's be less chance of a legally bought gun passing into criminal hands.

Mike.

Taking the piss out of the FrenchAmericans since before it was fashionable.

Prenait la pisse hors du FrançaisCanadiens méridionaux puisqu'avant lui à la mode.

[Beerlight 0]

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Yeah... OK... I know this has kind of been done to death

Yep, you are right.......

[Flygator 0]

Well, your correct on a few things...
__________________________________________________
Let's face it, King George III is kind of dead now, and the Brits & French ain't coming back to invade anytime soon. In the case of the Brits their army is all kind of busy in Iraq! Also, it's completely uncivilised to invade a country before afternoon Tiffin, and after Tiffin, one really just wants to snooze with a good book. In the case of the French... Well... Nowadays they prefer to host the invasion - it all makes for a far faster surrender and less travel sickness.
__________________________________________________
but this country is going to take guns from all of us so there for when the government has complete control of our lives and taxation is even worse than it is right now, we will be completely powerless when the next revolution comes. Think about all the taxes, hidden taxes, so called "fees", etc etc etc. We are slowly being drained for every penny we make. If we have guns, we can overthrow our current government if it becomes too abusive. The Declariation of Independence gives us the right to form a new government in that case. How can you do that without force. I'm sorry if I sound like some off the wall extremist. I'm not. It's just that I've been seeing this coming for a long time. Another point is, do you wonder why we don't have other countries invading us? Every person from a teenager to an 85 year old granny will pull out their guns if that happened. The right to bear arms is our constitutional right that we need not give up...

The secret to life is not arriving at the grave in a well preserved body but sliding in sideways completely worn out yelling "holy crap" what a ride!!!

[sinker 0]

in my country (very small and multi cultural) (switzerland) (nooooo not sweden) most of the people hava a gun at home, actually there are more than 300'000 weapons in homes... we "receive" them when we do our military service (at approx 20 yrs old) and keep them until we are "liberated" from this same service at approx 50... and nearly no murder or accident involves one of these weapons.
I guess it's a question of education***

I've always admired the Swiss for their stance on guns and defense... notice that Hitler thought twice about trying to plow through your country... You all have it RIGHT! Gun violence is low, gun accidents are low. If things ever get too much like Canada or Britain here, I know where I am moving...

-the artist formerly known as sinker

[jumper03 0]

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the government has complete control of our lives and taxation is even worse than it is right now, we will be completely powerless when the next revolution comes. Think about all the taxes, hidden taxes, so called "fees", etc etc etc. We are slowly being drained for every penny we make. If we have guns, we can overthrow our current government if it becomes too abusive.

Not to hijack the thread but I suppose the gun issue can be woven into this....

I used to feel the same as you about this, then a wise man asked me a question about our "abusive" government and the coming revolution -
Where in the world can you go where you will have it better? Where is there a less abusive government and would you really want to live there?

Maybe there is a such a place, mebbe there ain't. As for the gun issues, I don't see guns as the problem - I see people as the problem. Somebody gots to pull the trigger and its all in why they pull the trigger.....

Personally, I've sold most of my guns and will probably let my dad have the rest. I'd much rather sink my Ka-bar into an SOB who breaks into my house or tries to harm my family.

Jump

Scars remind us that the past is real

[pds 0]

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Personally, I've sold most of my guns and will probably let my dad have the rest. I'd much rather sink my Ka-bar into an SOB who breaks into my house or tries to harm my family.

i absolutely felt the same way following my first live fire experience. i sold my gun, was depressed for a year or two and decided if that ever had to happen again it would be up close and personal. a ColdSteel tactical tanto was my pigsticker of choice.

the years have tempered that particular temperence and i have most definitely reaquired a uniquely american gun lust.

namaste, motherfucker.

[leroydb 0]

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Supplying gun(s) &/or ammunition to non licence holder is offence. etc...

what about those that make their own ammo for hunting?

Leroy


..I knew I was an unwanted baby when I saw my bath toys were a toaster and a radio...

[murrays 0]

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What about some form of gun control and gun registration?

Oh my god NO!

The Canadian Gun Registry system is a billion dollar waste of taxpayer money. The crooks will always be able to buy guns. Registration will do nothing to keep guns out of their hands. It is a complete waste of time and money.

--
Murray

"No tyranny is so irksome as petty tyranny: the officious demands of policemen, government clerks, and electromechanical gadgets." - Edward Abbey

[pds 0]

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What about some form of gun control and gun registration?

Oh my god NO!

The Canadian Gun Registry system is a billion dollar waste of taxpayer money. The crooks will always be able to buy guns. Registration will do nothing to keep guns out of their hands. It is a complete waste of time and money.

they gonna deport you.

namaste, motherfucker.

[btvr 0]

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What about some form of gun control and gun registration?

Lets say that if you want to hold guns & ammunition then you've gotta get a license from the police or Federal agency.

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See the problem is that there are thousands of laws on the books already for hand guns. They are simply not enforced enough. most states require that you apply for a permit and the guns are in fact registered with the police! Stats show that less than 1% of all handgun crimes are committed by law abiding gun owners. The criminals are the ones who get them illegally and do the crimes. Perfect example of something that can't be controlled is drugs! Drugs are illegal and nobody can go buy them in a store, but look at the problem there! Gun control would end up with the same results. Only the criminals would be able to get them. It's not gun control it's criminal control! It's funny how people are so quick to ban something that they have no part in or interest in. USPA fights for our rights. How many people do not skydive? Those people don't give a rat's ass if skydiving was banned or not. I don't do hook turns but I would never support a move to ban them! Just like the guns, a hook turn doesn't kill the jumper, the error in performing it does along with that jumpers dicision to do it. I don't like to play golf either but don't want to see it banned. I'm not a member of the NRA (anymore), but they fight just like USPA. If you give these people an inch they will go for that mile.You have to make that stand up fight early on.

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[Laurel 0]

I'm an advocate for letting people have guns and rather than teaching our children to hate guns, we should keep a more neutral stance on the topic by teaching them that guns are dangerous, but there is a time and place for them, as well - like for sporting events (not soccer or football - tee hee - but hunting and gun accuracy events).

Guns do not kill people - people kill people. Think about it - do you think if you outlawed guns the criminals in the world would suddenly put theirs down because they are illegal?

.....................................................................
PMS#28, Pelogrande Rodriguez#1074
My Pink M

[Amazon 7]

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I'm an advocate for letting people have guns and rather than teaching our children to hate guns, we should keep a more neutral stance on the topic by teaching them that guns are dangerous, but there is a time and place for them,

I am more of an advocate of actually teaching all children they are not only dangerous... but the consequences of using one. As part of that everyone should be taught proper GUN CONTROL..in other words how to actually use the damn thing. I do admire the Swiss.. Every able bodied adult has one issued..... and knows how to use it. I think Robert Heinlein had a good idea.. if EVERY criminal KNEW that every citizen had a gun and KNEW how to use it.... there would be FAR less victims. He said " an armed society is a polite society"

Amazon....

[AggieDave 6]

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like for sporting events (not soccer or football

Right! Sporting events like NASCAR are perfect!

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[dterrick 0]

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most of the people hava a gun at home, actually there are more than 300'000 weapons in homes... we "receive" them when we do our military service (at approx 20 yrs old) and keep them until we are "liberated" from this same service at approx 50... and nearly no murder or accident involves one of these weapons.
I guess it's a question of education.

WELL, so much for the Swiss Army Knife jokes .

What a fantastic perspective from the land of the Neutral. Were we all of that same mindset...

-Dave

Life is very short and there's no time for fussing and fighting my friend (Lennon/McCartney)

[GigaBuist 0]

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if EVERY criminal KNEW that every citizen had a gun and KNEW how to use it.... there would be FAR less victims. He said " an armed society is a polite society"

This month's issue of "America's 1st Freedom", an NRA publication, brought to light a town in Georgia that's had it's crime rate drop by 89% in the past 21 years. It's accredited to a local ordinance passed in 1982 that required the head of every household to maintain a firearm and ammunition in the home. Sure makes for some interesting thinking.

[SkydiverRick 0]

Let's face it, King George III is kind of dead now, and the Brits & French ain't coming back to invade anytime soon.

[kmcguffee 0]

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If we have guns, we can overthrow our current government if it becomes too abusive.

I'm not for banning guns but this statement makes me laugh. Do you really think you could take your 12 gauge shotgun and 30-06 rifle and overthrow the government today? That was a good arguement when armies only used flintlocks and bayonets. The US Army has enough weapons in the modern era that civilians can't own that would enable it to crush any uprising fairly quickly. Guerilla warfare to force the cange of certain policies is still theoretically possible but not the outright overthrow of the current government by force. That's just silly.

"Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do." Ben Franklin