Serious question about helping someone maybe suicidal

[wmw999 2,589]

Serious question here.

I have a friend (?) whom I used to date; I broke up with him over 2 years ago. He did not react well to the breakup (I tried to back off first, and it drove him wild, so I broke it off, and that was worse). I had to get call blocker, caller ID, etc. etc. Nothing was ever threatening. Ever. But annoying as hell. Of course he doesn't believe in therapy.

Fast forward; he'll call every now and then, particularly when things aren't going well for him. Lately he's been threatening suicide (well, he's told me at least a hundred times that this is the last time I'll ever hear from him). Mostly he just leaves messages wherever he knows I'm not (he got an unblockable cell phone to call my house, for instance). It's gotten back to the several calls a day level, and I've really had enough.

But it's hard to take threats of suicide lightly, even when they've been made repeatedly. He won't talk to anyone else as far as I know, and I don't really think it's appropriate to report this to his work (he calls mostly either at night or at lunch from his cellphone; I did serve him a paper saying I'd report inappropriate use of company resources to his company). But he needs help. I can't give it to him. He won't try anyone more qualified. And I don't want to give it to him right now. I don't really think it's even right for me to go find the numbers of therapists for him or suggest anything besides Crisis Hotline (which I have mentioned).

Is there anything besides just hanging up on someone who is clearly depressed, and says they're considering suicide? That's just so wrong in my book. But I'm just so much the wrong person.

Wendy W.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[AggieDave 6]

I used to have a serious problem with depression, although people around me tried to help me, I would not take their advice or listen to them. I got lucky a couple times having someone around just at the right time...finally I had been officially kicked out of school and I saw no future ahead of me, I decided to get help. I got help, got back into school and am doing well now. I guess the point of my ramble is that, some people won't get help and won't accept help until they're ready to.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[Jessica 0]

Bleah, that sucks.

If he calls you and says he's going to kill himself, call the police. They will go get him and put him in the hospital for evaluation.

I don't know what else to tell you. You can't be responsible for him, and it sounds like you've tried to help all you can.

Skydiving is for cool people only

[PhillyKev 0]

Quote

If he calls you and says he's going to kill himself, call the police. They will go get him and put him in the hospital for evaluation

Yep, that's all you can do. Been in that situation, it sucks.

[miked10270 0]

Hi Wendy,

This may sound cruel, but I'm speaking from some bitter experience of suicides...

"Suicides" are broadly divided into 2 groups. Those that DO it! And those that talk about it. The 2 groups almost never co-incide. Those who "talk about" suicide repeatedly are almost invariably attempting emotional blackmail. The unspoken message is "You'll be sorry when I'm gone so make the most of me(IE comply with my wishes)while I'm still here".

The solution is what's come to be called "tough love". he should "Tell it to the Samaritans... Of which you're not a member." "IF he does suicide, then you'll be sad, but (your) life goes on & you'll get over it."

Thou shalt not kill, but thou shalt not sacrifice YOUR life & sanity striving to keep alive.

I sympathise and empathise with the invidious position that this man has put you in. For your own peace of mind I beg you to thoroughly distance yourself from his attention seeking. He's contacting you in an effort to get a reaction from you. ANY reaction from you. When he phones again I suggest that you place the handset down and let him tell his troubles to the carpet. This ensures ZERO reaction from you. Do not contact the police or other agencies on his behalf ar about him. This is in itself a reaction and is what he seeks.

Mike.

Taking the piss out of the FrenchAmericans since before it was fashionable.

Prenait la pisse hors du FrançaisCanadiens méridionaux puisqu'avant lui à la mode.

[txblondie 0]

In my experience (and I've lost 2 friends to suicide, intervened in one), unless the person is ready to listen, they are not going to do anything you suggest. However, many times the cry of "suicide" is actually a cry for attention. He may just need a friend, whether you are that friend or not.
The time that I intervened, it was a very close friend, and it was the firs time he'd actually mentioned suicide. He had been depressed for a long time before hand, and I knew he was serious. I went straight to the counselor (this was in high school, by the way), and he hated me forever after that. Then, out of the blue one day, he called me and thanked me. The difference? We were close. The two of you are not.
If you know someone else he is closer to, talk to them, tell them what the situation is, and see if they can get him to a counselor. If you don't, I would just hang up. It may seem wrong, but if he's threatened that many times without an actual attempt, chances are he's not really going to do it.
Overall, I guess I'd have to say that I don't think he's in serious danger, although you are right that suicide threats should never be taken lightly.

*****************************************
Blondes do have more fun!

[Casie 0]

I'm sorry to hear you are going thru this But as it's been stated before.........you cannot help someone who doesn't want to help themself!

~Porn Kitty
WARNING: Goldschlager causes extreme emotional outbursts!

[drewboo 0]

I feel bad for you Wendy, I liked the idea of letting him talk to the carpet, but it's basically the same as hanging up on him....which you disapprove of. Have you tried getting an unlisted number, (changing yours). Otherwise i would either "let him talk to the carpet or just hang up.
I also approve of having the police pay him a concerned visit, perhaps if he calls you while he's at work, and the police show up there..saying that they heard he was sucicidal...he may find the whole thing so embarrassing
that he'll realize its to much of a hassle, and that he's got a lot more to lose than he thinks, if he keeps this behavior up.
Wish i had the perfect answer for you.

[steve1 5]

Quote

Hi Wendy,

This may sound cruel, but I'm speaking from some bitter experience of suicides...

"Suicides" are broadly divided into 2 groups. Those that DO it! And those that talk about it. The 2 groups almost never co-incide.

Mike.

I disagree with this. The two groups often do co-incide. The chances are probably in favor of him not committing suicide, but there is still a very real chance that this could happen. I work as a school counselor. Each year I take a few kids into mental health for suicidal thinking. Usually they are released and sent home. Sometimes they are kept for further evaluation. Usually you can tell if one is serious if they have a plan worked out in there head of how they are going to do it. We're told to report every case of when a kid is contemplating this, but if it is just a general notion, that they want to die, without a plan thought through, it may not be too serious. If a person is talking about doing it, don't ever think they aren't serious. Particularly if they have a plan worked out in their head.

In Wendy's case, it sounds like this guy is trying anything to keep her as a part of his life, and it sounds like he is trying anything that might work, including threatening suicide. This would be a tough call. One thing to keep in mind also, is the fact that he could be dangerous to Windy if he is this desperate. Many people who are suicidal may not care if they take someone else out with them, even someone they once loved. It might be smart to have him picked up and evaluated by a Doctor both for Windy"s safety and his own. He will probably be really PO'd over this, but it would be the right call in my opinion. He needs to start some kind of therapy, and probably medication. If he won't take this step on his own, he may need to be forced into it......Steve1

[Gawain 0]

Given the wonderful advice already provided (really), I want to provide some additional perspective from the edge: Since when would you have any power over this guy's decisions in life, and how can you take responsibility for them?

It's definitely a tough question, but one that must be asked. You broke things off over two years ago. His denial should not equate to you being on the receiving end of harassment. That being said, I have two more words for you: Restraining Order.

Putting that on the radar may shed some light and force his hand into either getting help, or accepting his situation as it is.

I don't know how badly this rubs the situation, but I'm of the opinion that personal responsibility should have precedence. You're not beholden to him.

So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!

[pds 0]

i have nothing to add except my sympathy. call the police. that'll teach him to attempt garnering your attention with false claims of suicide.

good luck.

namaste, motherfucker.

[steve1 5]

Windy,
Listen to your own instincts on this one. I don't know this guy, maybe he is crying wolf, maybe he isn't a danger. If you feel there is any real chance that he could commit suicide or hurt you or someone else the only thing to do is call the authorities. It might be a messy situation, but hopefully the guy will get the help he needs. Trying to rationalize things out sometimes doesn't work as well as listening to your own gut feelings. Hope some of this might help.....Steve1

[Michele 1]

Hi, Wendy.

I am not envious of you - well I am, but not in this regard.

There are a few things to consider.

You are not someone who can help him, at least in an obvious way. You CAN take some steps to get him help, as long as it's "anonymous" and inapparent that you are the person doing it. Call a suicide hotline in your area, and ask them what they can do - maybe nothing, but they can give you some suggestions that will work within your jurisdiction that might help. Explain the "stalking" behavior to them, as well, and see if there's something that they are able to recommend on that level, too.

Another thing you can do, which is a bit of a long shot and depends on your county/state law, is report him for stalking. Here in CA, there are steps that you can take which can get him into court-ordered counselling, after a DA hearing. I would check with the DA's office about this, though, as it is a step which might create great anger and difficulty to you. So be careful should this be the option you take.

I would start with the suicide crisis hotline, and see what suggestions they can give you. Let me know if there's anything I can do from here. You know I will, in a heartbeat.

Ciels-
Michele

PS And just as an aside, Mike, I disagree with lots of what you say...but this isn't the post to debate it.

~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek
While our hearts lie bleeding?~

[Deuce 1]

Wendy, you need to get a restraining order to keep him from pestering you. Once you have that, and it will be easy to have served on him at work, the problem should end.

Keep the records of the phone calls. When he calls, he'll be in violation of the restraining order and he'll be arrested. He may be given a notice to appear rather than taken to jail. If he makes the statements that he's going to end his life on the phone, and you relay those messages to the police, they will have to take some action.

I don't know about Texas, but in California it's called a 5150 Health and Safety report requesting a 72 hour psychiatric evaluation. At the end of that time the person is either committed, can volutarily commit themself, or is deemed no danger to themself or others and is released.

For your peace of mind, I suggest you get the restraining order and follow through with the local version of the 5150 report if it continues.

Coincidentally I was giving this a lot of thought as I was grocery shopping today. We've had a lot of discussion on the forums and in PM's regarding stalkers/predators. There's a personality type that uses your good nature against you. This fellow sounds like exactly that type. By threatening to harm himself, he stays just under your skin. It makes me proud to know you, cause a lesser person might say "SO DO IT AND LEAVE ME THE HELL ALONE!".

Every now and again to everyone's surpirse, they will.

[wmw999 2,589]

I actually turned a tape over to the police; there's absolutely nothing threatening to my safety in any of them, and apparently that changes the nature of the restraining order, or even if I can get one, in Texas. They said that they'd go talk to him, and I did have him served with papers at work.

I'm just loath to incur the increased hassle factor of going through with reporting him to his work, because that might just make it even less pleasant.

But I am back to hanging up when I hear the voice. I spent one phone call repeating for him to call 1-800-SUICIDE. Then I started hanging up.

thanks all; I'll start taping again, and go back to paying extra for callerID that I don't want, and consider paying extra for an unlisted number that my father will have trouble remembering. I'm really pissed is all. Really.

Wendy

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[Deuce 1]

I wish I knew more about Texas law. In California it's an even equation. A threat to others OR a threat to themself. A statement like "I'm going to do something so that you or nobody else will ever be bothered by me again!" is a clear threat to the life of the person making it, and is adequate to forcibly take the person for a psychiatric eval.

A suggestion? Use the kind of answering machine that keeps taping even after you pick up the line. Once you've screened the call with the recording and the BEEP! that tells the person they are being taped, you can pick up the line, and the person can have no expectation they are no longer being taped. It's a legal way to record a telephone conversation.

[whocares 0]

Suicide is very serious. Many people who have a drinking or drug problem talk about suicide, the problem is most of them do it.

I know this for a fact. I am in a 12 step recovery program and have been for some time.

In the last 3 years I can name 23 people who have killed themselves. Just last week, a great lady, 30 years old ,with 2 kids killed herself. She drank to much lost her husband, then her kids, all do to the drinking. she though she was hopeless. Instead of getting her life together she took the easy way out. Pretty fucked up. Take the shit very serious. She was drunk when she did this too. So if people are talking about it they are crying out for help BIG TIME.

[steve1 5]

Quote

Just last week, a great lady, 30 years old ,with 2 kids killed herself. reply]
A lot of people have trouble understanding this, unless they have been there in their own life. Many people who take this route actually feel the world would be a better place without them. Many of these are great people who truly have a lot going for them. Too bad they couldn't have gotten help before it was too late. Sometimes all it would have taken is one person who is willing to listen. Spouting advice to someone who is suicidal is the wrong thing to do during this critical time. Telling them that we all go through tough times probably isn't going to help them. It may actually cause them to feel even more suicidal because they know you are not listening and don't understand. Many of us have no idea how deeply these people are suffering on a daily basis. Probably the best help one can give is to be a good listener and let them know you truly care. And above all help them find a good therapist. (There's a lot of poor ones out there as well as good.) I'm just a school counselor and I refer anyone who is suicidal to someone else with more training in this area. I try to be as supportive as I can until they find that help. It's too bad we aren't all better at spotting signs of depression in people. Some are very good at hiding it and it isn't always that apparent, but the thing is there are usually plenty of signs before someone does commit suicide.

Whocares,
I'm sorry you have lost so many people who you were probably close to.......Steve1

• Quote

[airann 1]

Quote

Take the shit very serious. She was drunk when she did this too. So if people are talking about it they are crying out for help BIG TIME.

As some of you here, I also know a ton about this.

I have to add to this post that the first thing to do is to find or get in touch with his family or other friends.

You are basically done with this person. I know you dont want him to go through with this, but you also can not help him with his issues. Even if you wanted to.

It can be that in addition to his lonely depression, he may have a addictive personality. You can be addicted to persons, the sympathy, and/or attention they give. He sounds BiPolar to me, as he may contact you on the depression side of the disease. Other people may be rather tired of it as well.

Yet it is not for us or anyone to decide what his deal is. Now, there is only one answer. Get the Dude some help in a way that cuts you out. I am hearing that is what you want most. And you are no longer part of his life.

If you know the family, get them involved. And the crisis hotline needs his phone number - give it to them. If they think, and they will, there is trouble they have many ways of dealing with it including the authorities or arranging the pick up and transfer to a hospital.

In Houston, Crisis Hotline

Crisis Hotline 713-HOTLINE
Crisis Hotline Bay Area 281-461-9992
Teenline 713-529-TEEN
Spanish Hotline 713-526-8088

~AirAnn~