VOTING FOR ARNIE.

[miked10270 0]

This is one for all the Californians:

As you'll all know, I don't like to get mixed up in politics, well... Except for the politics where, say 2000 redcoats re-colonise the bits of America with the nice climate or 5000 "stout hearted englishmen" take their longbows with them on an extended touring holiday of France .

But I did happen to catch a summation of Arnie Schwarzenegger's election speeches last night.

There wasn't a single speech that didn't include some reference to his films! I was particularly bemused be "Davis has terminated hope, D.H.T education... Etc... It's time to terminate Davis."

Who the f"*% writes this $hit!?

Then there's his answer to the whole groping thing - getting 50 female toothpaste advert failures to stand behind him and then say how wonderful it felt... Yep. Fell off my seat at that one

Is Arnie actually aware that he's running for office? You don't suppose that those sneaky faschist republicans have actualy told him that they're making a comedy film starring him? Maybe "Twins II - Running for California". Once he's offstage is Arnie asking: "So vhen's Danny De-Vito" gonna show up and shoot his scenes?"

Nothing less than that would explain Arnie's behaviour. Or his "Thunderbird puppet acting".

Now OK, I know that one of your previous governors was Ronald Reagan, but at least Ronnie talked sense.

MIke.

Taking the piss out of the FrenchAmericans since before it was fashionable.

Prenait la pisse hors du FrançaisCanadiens méridionaux puisqu'avant lui à la mode.

[encinoadam 0]

Well, Clinton ran on good old fashioned family values. Some people are just better liars.

[SkyDekker 1,465]

you guys crack me up.

One guy says something about a Republican. Stock answer: Clinton was worse. I have heard children in kindergarden agrue and debate better than that

I mean be honest, Arnold doesn't come accross as even a halfway intelligent guy. Do you really wonder why the whole world is chuckling at this situation?

[encinoadam 0]

Actually, I'm wondering why, if he is SOOOOO dumb... that so many people are voting for him.

Typical name calling: I argue like a child (actually, not even as well as one)... and Arnold is dumb. Guess you have it all figured out, dude.

And as far as debate tactics... I never said Clinton was worse. I don't know quite where you are getting your information from, but it ain't me.

Keep sailing, Bob.

ac

[lawrocket 3]

Interesting. Ever notice how conservatives are always called names?

Reagan was an amiable dunce. George Bush, Sr. was a "wimp." Bob Dole? A geezer. Dubya? An idiot. Now, we have Schwarzenegger as "stupid."

Liberals amaze me. I remember when Gore debated Bush the first time. All the time before, it was mentioned how stupid Dubya was, and that Al Gore in his brilliance would kick his ass.

result? Most thought that Bush won that debate. I didn't, but Bush held his own, while Gore was stumbling. Why? Gee, so much time had been spent talking about what an idiot Dubya was that when he was merely bad, he was impressive.

So, liberals, go ahead and call him stupid. If he screws it up? Well, what did you expect from an idiot? Nothing to lose.

If he actually does well? Then we see that idiots can do a better job than most politicians.

Democrats are digging their own graves on this... It's gonna bite them hard, like it did in 2000. Never, ever underestimate the opponent...

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[kmcguffee 0]

Quote

I have heard children in kindergarden agrue and debate better than that

I mean be honest, Arnold doesn't come accross

I've seen them spell better too.

Quote

Do you really wonder why the whole world is chuckling at this situation?

Please leave the rest of the US out of this joke.

"Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do." Ben Franklin

[quade 4]

Quote

Interesting. Ever notice how conservatives are always called names?

Reagan was an amiable dunce. George Bush, Sr. was a "wimp." Bob Dole? A geezer. Dubya? An idiot. Now, we have Schwarzenegger as "stupid."

You're right -- I've noticed that ONLY conservatives get called names . . . HUH?

No, no, no. This happens by and to both sides.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[encinoadam 0]

Just to add.... I never mentioned Democrats or Republicans in my post. In fact, I am neither. I'm interested in who I think will do the best job as governor. That is my right as a voter. You brought the party system into this. It's a good thing Clinton isn't black, for I fear I'd be labeled a racist, as well.

Why can't I just prefer one candidate over another, without you resorting to name calling? Granted, I called Clinton a liar. But, this is rather factual since he DID run on family values and he DID cheat on his wife. I actually think Clinton did a great job as president, but you're too quick to cast judgment to find that out.

I was just trying to show that the wholesome values that many politicians run on are disingenuous. So Arnold's past is not so squeaky clean. That doesn't mean he'll do any worse in office than Clinton did.

Anxiously awaiting to see what name I'll be called next...

ac

[tcnelson 1]

here's the important part, Mike...Arnold has character; i guess he has demonstrated to californians that he isn't a liar or a cheat. funny how that inspires confidence with people.

"Don't talk to me like that assface...I don't work for you yet." - Fletch
NBFT, Deseoso Rodriguez RB#1329

[Gawain 0]

Mike, I read a really good column on BBCi by Matt Frei. The link is below, but I included the text too. I'm not very familiar with European or British politics, but I've been told the US political system definitely has its own unique tough flavor...this essay isn't a bad summary and provides a reasonably genuine outside view.

---

---

US diary: California recall
By Matt Frei
BBC Washington correspondent

In the second of a series of regular columns, Matt Frei gives his own perspective on the California recall election.

No longer content just to deliver other peoples lines, many Hollywood stars aspire at some stage in their career to become directors, producers or writers.

Perhaps that's what Arnold Schwarzenegger is really up to - only he has chosen politics!

I know he is only one of 135 candidates - many of whom argue that it is unfair to lavish so much attention on a man only because he is a celebrity - but, let's face it, celebrity is what this election is all about.

Actress Diane Keaton turned out for an anti-recall rally California is merely applying the guiding principal of its public life to the one area that had almost miraculously been spared it - politics.

It always seemed odd that this star-struck state should elect a governor, Gray Davis, who embodied the antithesis of charisma.

I met Mr Davis at his final rally in San Francisco on Monday. His campaign had mobilised the one union that every American politician wants on his or her side after 9/11 - the firefighters.

Hundreds of burly men with gravel voices and knuckle-breaking handshakes, donned silly 'No recall' T-shirts, and marched towards Union Square.

In their midst, the reed-like governor with his tapering features and bloodless complexion looked like a blanched twig floating amongst logs. His high-fives seemed self conscious and contrived. I feared for his delicate hands.

No one in the square shouted his name. In fact his name was almost taboo, the mere mention of which would bring out the recall demons. Instead they all yelled "No to the recall".

"Why?" I asked some of the firefighters. "Surely Arnie is your kind of man?"

"Arnie is a squillionaire," came the response from the gravel-voiced chorus. "With his plans to cut taxes and spending he is bound to take away our jobs."

Who knows? Arnie has played his economic cards very close to his well-toned chest.

Antidote
"Not a bad turnout," I told an old friend I bumped into at Union Square. She is the bureau chief for Newsweek in San Francisco.

She pointed out that if it hadn't been for the firefighters, the square would be almost deserted apart from a few tourists and office workers sipping their lattes.

This is the heartland of democratic America where almost no one voted for George W Bush in 2000. They should have been hanging from lampposts and balconies to support their man. And they were not.

Gray Davis is the antidote to California celebrity, but he has also neglected his electoral base and presided over the mismanagement of the Golden State.

So why didn't he get thrown out 11 months ago at the mid-term elections? Simple answer - he was running against a divided Republican party that was divided and had slipped too far to the right for the taste of moderate, mainstream Californians.

Today Ronald Reagan may be the hero of the Republican right but as governor of California he enacted the most pro-choice legislation the state had ever seen.

Dream card
This is where Arnie comes in.

OK, his lines may be wooden and his smile trapped in an ecstatic Hollywood rictus. But on paper, the terminator is as much a dream candidate for the Republicans as former General, Wesley Clark, is for the Democrats in the presidential race.

Arnie looks like a red meat-devouring barbarian, but he is also pro-choice, not anti-gay and he is married to a Kennedy.

This makes him unacceptable to most bible-bashing Republicans from the south, but very acceptable to mainstream Californians.

Schwarzenegger has a cross-section of support
In the White House, they still haven't made up their minds if an Arnie victory in the most populous state, and one with the largest number of electoral college votes, is a good thing because it reverses the terminal decline of the Republican Party in California or bad because it dilutes the Dixie-fication of the Grand Old Party, the GOP.

I went to Arnie's last rally in an aircraft hanger for executive jets at San Jose airport. The fact it had been booked by a recall campaign instead of Silicon Valley tycoons parking their Gulfstreams spoke volumes of the parlous state of the Californian economy.

The crowd was a motley array of Arnistas - a true cross-section of one of the most motley corners of America.

There was a white-haired, white granny with a Zimmer frame who told me she admired the body builder because he was strong. Then there was a car mechanic who liked Arnie even more after he was accused of having groped no fewer than 15 women: "At least they were women."

A Mexican immigrant turned up in a two-ton Hummer gas guzzler with a sticker "Red, White and Blue - these colours don't run". The Avon lady, immaculately turned out and brittle as a porcelain doll who I later saw hover expectantly behind Arnie. And the hardcore feminist who still supported the "grope-amater" despite his wandering hands.

Recount?
These are the independent voters who everyone is always trying to court.

Who knows if today they will actually vote for the body builder from Austria in the privacy of the polling booth, or opt for the governor whose name they dare not speak but who is the chastened devil they know.

That and the outcome of this extraordinary election, will probably depend in large part on whether they can figure out the novella-sized ballot papers in some counties or the ATM-style voting system in others.

Final foolish predication. Expect the recall to be recounted and decided in courts... a la Florida 2000!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/3173166.stm

So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!

[billvon 3,107]

>Mike...Arnold has character; i guess he has demonstrated to
>californians that he isn't a liar or a cheat.

You might want to think twice before you hold up Arnold as a moral role model. Such things have a way of coming back and biting you. I'm sure there were people who thought of Nixon (and Clinton) the same way before they were elected - and they didn't take office with accusations of sexual assault in the double digits.

[TheAnvil 0]

I think the LA Times really bit themselves with their Dirty Thursday shenannigans.

Vinny the Anvil
Post Traumatic Didn't Make The Lakers Syndrome is REAL
JACKASS POWER!!!!!!

[billvon 3,107]

>Ever notice how conservatives are always called names?

Yep. Like "El Jefe Clintonista," a favorite of one of the posters here. "Grayout Davis" was another favorite, as was "the Gorebot." Yep, it's only liberals who call conservatives names because they have no intelligent comebacks.

[Gawain 0]

Quote

>Mike...Arnold has character; i guess he has demonstrated to
>californians that he isn't a liar or a cheat.

You might want to think twice before you hold up Arnold as a moral role model. Such things have a way of coming back and biting you. I'm sure there were people who thought of Nixon (and Clinton) the same way before they were elected - and they didn't take office with accusations of sexual assault in the double digits.

What do you mean Bill? What has Arnold not fessed up to? He pays his taxes (unlike Arianna), he didn't pander to specifics on these sexual accusations, but he did offer a broad amends, knowing that the LA Times error (NY Times recanted) was going to spread like wildfire. The campaign didn't give him time to deal with it. After he's elected, we all know these issues are not going to disappear, but on the face of it, Arnold is not going to run from it.

So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!

[Gawain 0]

Quote

>Ever notice how conservatives are always called names?

Yep. Like "El Jefe Clintonista," a favorite of one of the posters here. "Grayout Davis" was another favorite, as was "the Gorebot." Yep, it's only liberals who call conservatives names because they have no intelligent comebacks.

I always liked "Gumby" and "Booz Crustamante" ....

So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!

[billvon 3,107]

>What do you mean Bill? What has Arnold not fessed up to?

He has (alternately) apologized for his past exploits, denied them, and claimed that he made them up for the publicity value. Which explanation do you choose? Or are they all equally valid on some sort of "well, time's short, so honesty is optional" scale?

>The campaign didn't give him time to deal with it. After he's elected,
> we all know these issues are not going to disappear, but on the face
> of it, Arnold is not going to run from it.

I'm not too interested in whether he runs from it or not. Such things have a way of catching up with you in either case.

In addition, I can't help but thinking that ongoing sexual assault case(s), and lying about the cases during the campaign, will be cause for recall. Which is fine - we have this new political tool (the recall) and it seems to be a popular one.

[Gawain 0]

Quote

- we have this new political tool (the recall) and it seems to be a popular one.

Oh no you don't Bill -- you don't get to spin this. This is not a new law. It has been on the books since 1911 and there have been 31 previous attempts to recall a California Governor.

So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!

[Michele 1]

Quote

ongoing sexual assault case(s),

Sorry. I must have missed the investigations and the arrests. I mean, I've been busy recently. What on-going sexual assault cases?

Ciels-
Michele

~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek
While our hearts lie bleeding?~

[miked10270 0]

OK. I read all the posts and it's "Off we go again... My candidate has a HALO and WINGS and your candidate has HORNS and CLOVEN FEET"



My real pop was at Arnie's campaign organisers, speech writers, the folk who actually put a man accused of groping women in the middle of a bunch of women, switch the TV cameras on and get him to say that this situation felt wonderful!

At the end of the day, If Arnie wins (which I think he will) it'll be in spite of his speeches and appearances.

ANyway. Since this is now JAPT, I think that Davis will be recalled. He was Governor during Cali's dot.com boom times and put in place long term spending plans assuming that lots of money would continue to roll in. Fast-forward a couple of years and california has suffered more than most in the recession, but is trapped in long-term high spending projects. It's either abandon the projects or borrow and tighten the belt. Hence the massive budget deficit and service cutbacks.

A scapegoat is required 'cos "Shit doesn't just happen" does it?

Who to replace Davis with? Well. Here is a "Republican" candidate who's about as centerist as they go. Pro-choice, homosexual-tolerant... Yeah, a repeat of Reagan, and he did well in his governorship.

Personally I think that Arnie will do well in the Governorship of Cali, and you guys had better make another amendment to your constitution so he can be president in a few years.

Mike.

Taking the piss out of the FrenchAmericans since before it was fashionable.

Prenait la pisse hors du FrançaisCanadiens méridionaux puisqu'avant lui à la mode.

[lazyfrog 0]

apparently, he won... but will he have Mary Carey for assistant ???

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Fumer tue, péter pue
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ourson #10, Mosquito Uno, CBT 579