wmw999 2,584 #1 October 17, 2003 OK, maybe since we've had another spate of hot threads, we can have a meta-discussion -- what makes a good discussion? Me, I like being able to flesh out ideas; both ones I agree with, and ones I don't. I really like online discussions for that, because no one ever interrupts me, and I can formulate a whole thought. Things that detract from a discussion include name-calling, belittling statements, and people who think that calling a group as a whole "stupid" or "dishonest" is different from going up to a person who considers themself to be a member of a group, and saying it to their face. Other than a shit-posting thread, I think just posting shit to get stuff started is kind of childish. Not that I'm immune, but I can always hope, right? So -- what do others like in a hot debate? Wendy W.There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ScubaSteve 0 #2 October 17, 2003 I like when people with conflicting opinions actually examine the others ideas before discarding. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diablopilot 2 #3 October 17, 2003 I like Boobies. Seriously, I lke a discusion in which I can learn as much as I feel I'm teaching. Debate is fun, as long a everyone involve keeps an open mind.---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gawain 0 #4 October 17, 2003 I like it when there is an obvious attempt to explain a thought concisely. I think providing enough detail to make a point, still showing that grammar and spelling are important lends much greater credibility as well. what i dont like are when people appearto blather on without looking at what there typing or thinking nad not using puncuation or anythin like that and they let themselfs get so mad that they misss their point So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright 'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life Make light! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zenister 0 #5 October 17, 2003 themselfs? sorry couldnt resist____________________________________ Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gawain 0 #6 October 17, 2003 Quotethemselfs? sorry couldnt resist You understood the intentional dichotomy of my post then. So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright 'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life Make light! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shark 0 #7 October 17, 2003 QuoteOther than a shit-posting thread, I think just posting shit to get stuff started is kind of childish. Not that I'm immune, but I can always hope, right? Yep. I've made it a point to stay away from the crap, and not even open a potentially biased thread. But sometimes you get funneled back in. With an unsuccessfull attempt to lighten up an already hijacked thread, I was accused of being a redneck and a bigot. I guess it can be difficult to hijack a hijacked thread. I always laugh when I see someone quoting the "facts" as they see them. I'll stick to the T&A discussions on Talk Back and read the Women's Forums for their educational value. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
juanesky 0 #8 October 17, 2003 QuoteQuoteOther than a shit-posting thread, I think just posting shit to get stuff started is kind of childish. Not that I'm immune, but I can always hope, right? Yep. I've made it a point to stay away from the crap, and not even open a potentially biased thread. But sometimes you get funneled back in. With an unsuccessfull attempt to lighten up an already hijacked thread, I was accused of being a redneck and a bigot. I guess it can be difficult to hijack a hijacked thread. I always laugh when I see someone quoting the "facts" as they see them. I'll stick to the T&A discussions on Talk Back and read the Women's Forums for their educational value. QuoteJust when I was out they pulled me BACK IN!!!! Total Recall 2004 Gawain for Gov! "According to some of the conservatives here, it sounds like it's fine to beat your wide - as long as she had it coming." -Billvon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
champu 1 #9 October 17, 2003 I enjoy reading just about any type of discussion as long as it's not worn out ("hey should I downsize my canopy","I'm trying to get some person to jump but they won't what is wrong with them") I do think that discussions bereft of wit can get dry pretty fast, so the occasional on topic humor can certainly help things along provided it's not insulting. I have a few times typed out a post in a thread, read it, then smacked my hand on my forehead and just clicked the back button. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shark 0 #10 October 17, 2003 QuoteTotal Recall 2004 More like True Lies... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dterrick 0 #11 October 17, 2003 I like your aproach, Wendy. We have such a diverse group here on dropzone.com that we could likely solve all the world's problems - I was an orator in Jr high school. Logic and eloquence kicks ass! I went on to take Formal Logic, Psychology, and Crimonomlgy subjects as my businsess degree electives. Though some people used to tell me to 'shut up, already' they were typically the ones whom I had just shot down, logically. (see below, and also the Penguin sketch). For me, a discussion DOES involve, principally, i) the ability and intent to LISTEN and COMPREHEND the other party (ies) ii) the ability and capability to voice your opinion without prejudice iii) a comprehension of the idea that no two people see life the same way; no two hear the same words spoken the same way; no two people read the same printed words the same way. That which makes us perceive the world differently from others is a two edged sword. Were we homogenious, we'd live in Huxley's Brave New World . As is, on a religious and political level (see other threads) we seem to have Brave New Worlds. Is this good, or is this simply necessary for the advancement of civilization? Will the lack of this talent by the Powers that Be cause our demise? /will Dogs and Cats ever live in harmony? Can you imagine how life would be different if Whuffos actually UNDERSTOOD what we were saying about Skylife? Extrapolate this horror to civilization in its entirety... We, those who acted after listening to someone about the joys of the unknown, should be the FIRST (...BEER!) to accept and discuss ideas with others without prejudice. And now for something completely different courtesy of http://orangecow.org/pythonet/sketches/index.htm#A QuoteArgument Clinic ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- About the Sketch: This sketch not only appeared in the Flying Circus TV Show - Episode 29, it also performed live in the Movie - 'Live at the Hollywood Bowl'. It was also featured on their albums 'Monty Python's Previous Record', 'Monty Python's Instant Record Collection (UK version)', 'The Monty Python Instant Record Collection' (US version), ''Monty Python's The Final Ripoff' and 'The Ultimate Monty Python Ripoff'. It was also performed live on their album - 'Monty Python live at the Theatre Royal Drury Lane'. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The cast: MAN Michael Palin RECEPTIONIST Rita Davies MR. BARNARD Graham Chapman MR. VIBRATING John Cleese COMPLAINER Eric Idle SPREADERS Terry Jones -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The sketch: Man: Ah. I'd like to have an argument, please. Receptionist: Certainly sir. Have you been here before? Man: No, I haven't, this is my first time. Receptionist: I see. Well, do you want to have just one argument, or were you thinking of taking a course? Man: Well, what is the cost? Receptionist: Well, It's one pound for a five minute argument, but only eight pounds for a course of ten. Man: Well, I think it would be best if I perhaps started off with just the one and then see how it goes. Receptionist: Fine. Well, I'll see who's free at the moment. (Pause) Receptionist: Mr. DeBakey's free, but he's a little bit conciliatory. Ah yes, Try Mr. Barnard; room 12. Man: Thank you. (Walks down the hall. Opens door.) Mr Barnard: WHAT DO YOU WANT? Man: Well, I was told outside that... Mr Barnard: Don't give me that, you snotty-faced heap of parrot droppings! Man: What? Mr Barnard: Shut your festering gob, you tit! Your type really makes me puke, you vacuous, coffee-nosed, maloderous, pervert!!! Man: Look, I CAME HERE FOR AN ARGUMENT, I'm not going to just stand...!! Mr Barnard: OH, oh I'm sorry, but this is abuse. Man: Oh, I see, well, that explains it. Mr Barnard: Ah yes, you want room 12A, Just along the corridor. Man: Oh, Thank you very much. Sorry. Mr Barnard: Not at all. Man: Thank You. (Under his breath) Stupid git!! (Walk down the corridor) Man: (Knock) Mr Vibrating: Come in. Man: Ah, Is this the right room for an argument? Mr Vibrating: I told you once. Man: No you haven't. Mr Vibrating: Yes I have. Man: When? Mr Vibrating: Just now. Man: No you didn't. Mr Vibrating: Yes I did. Man: You didn't Mr Vibrating: I did! Man: You didn't! Mr Vibrating: I'm telling you I did! Man: You did not!! Mr Vibrating: Oh, I'm sorry, just one moment. Is this a five minute argument or the full half hour? Neeh! -Dave Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pds 0 #12 October 17, 2003 Quote So -- what do others like in a hot debate? an unarmed opponent.namaste, motherfucker. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wmw999 2,584 #13 October 17, 2003 Quotean unarmed opponent. Bwahaha! And you know what I'd like to say after that about the supply Wendy W.There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #14 October 18, 2003 Quotestill showing that grammar and spelling are important lends much greater credibility as well. Quotewhat{What} i {I}dont {don't} like are when people appearto {appear to} blather on without looking at what there{they're} typing or thinking nad {and} not using puncuation{punctuation} or anythin{anything} like that and they let themselfs{themselves} get so mad that they misss{miss} their point {.} I would not even try to fix that statement gramatically. Jeanne Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Michele 1 #15 October 18, 2003 Good topic, Wendy. I hate to see namecalling. Generally, every opinion is valid...the facts they base it on may not be, but the opinion/view is. An outward show of respect (which I do my best to display - futilely in some cases) and a willingness to not immediately discount it because "this" or "that" person wrote it but base any response on content not character would be nice to see. Often, I see things degenerate into vile namecalling, or hyperbolic exaggeration to make a point. I think that condescending to someone really does not help a situation. For example, if someone is asked something, lay it out clearly, concisely (that part is hard for me sometimes), and be willing to back it up with links. If quoting something or someone, the link to where the quote is lifted from is important...and lends credibility to the poster. But I think the most important thing is that someone feel they are heard...and that the listener is heard in return. I find that lack of respect to be distasteful. I love learning things, and, like you said, fleshing out ideas, whether or not I personally agree with things. No-one can know everything...but together, we can add to our base of knowledge and move forward from there. {Edited to add....a sense of humor. Gawain was playing around...) (so much for being concise, hey? )... Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflybella 0 #16 October 18, 2003 If I get the sense that a person truly believes in what they are posting - and not trying to sound smart, or put others down, and is coming from a caring/educational perspective - I will listen and weigh my beliefs/opinions/thoughts equally with theirs. If they're just being a blowhard know-it-all - I like to participate in/observe a mental beating! Overall - all talk/discussion is good. No one can predict how others' learn. Keep up the talk, keep up the education. If you believe in something, don't get discouraged and stop discussions, even with jackass blowhards - you may not change someone's mind but you could affect the brilliant mind of someone who will! Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LouDiamond 1 #17 October 18, 2003 QuoteYou understood the intentional dichotomy of my post then. THAT'S what kills me about the forums sometimes. That which is apparently blatently obvious is understood as the exact opposite and pointed out. It's like HELLO, McFly? I think the best thing Dz.com could use is an addition of a tounge in cheek smiley and an eye roll smiley. It always seems that the conversation goes a stray for several posts after such an incident. If anything, as much as I like discoursing, the one thing that I think always goes wrong is the political/religious threads. It always degrades in to everything everyone has said they dislike. On the flip side, I have found that very,very few people will voice their opinions in the same manner when the other person is standing in front of them at a boogie. Just goes to show how impersonal the internet can be even when being personal."It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required" Some people dream about flying, I live my dream SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LouDiamond 1 #18 October 18, 2003 QuoteI was accused of being a redneck and a bigot. BWAAAAHHHHHH! I just find that EXTREMELY funny. Maybe it's because I've met you and know that to not be true. Your neck is far from red"It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required" Some people dream about flying, I live my dream SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shark 0 #19 October 18, 2003 QuoteQuoteI was accused of being a redneck and a bigot. BWAAAAHHHHHH! I just find that EXTREMELY funny. Maybe it's because I've met you and know that to not be true. Your neck is far from red You're just saying that because we were on the record skydive. I particularly like your video taken from the side-mount monkeycam staring at my as on point one. Well, okay, I own guns and like to hunt occasionally. Does that make one's neck red? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gawain 0 #20 October 18, 2003 QuoteQuoteQuoteI was accused of being a redneck and a bigot. BWAAAAHHHHHH! I just find that EXTREMELY funny. Maybe it's because I've met you and know that to not be true. Your neck is far from red You're just saying that because we were on the record skydive. I particularly like your video taken from the side-mount monkeycam staring at my as on point one. Well, okay, I own guns and like to hunt occasionally. Does that make one's neck red? Well, the fact that you're in Hemet may be factor too. So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright 'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life Make light! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LouDiamond 1 #21 October 18, 2003 QuoteI particularly like your video taken from the side-mount monkeycam staring at my as on point one. Hey now, I was looking inside the formation. The camera was working with what it had in front of it at the time. Besides, I bet you've never seen your self from that angle? Although, I'm sure those who called you a redneck would say that you are quite familiar with that part of your anatomy"It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required" Some people dream about flying, I live my dream SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #22 October 18, 2003 QuoteOn the flip side, I have found that very,very few people will voice their opinions in the same manner when the other person is standing in front of them at a boogie. Just goes to show how impersonal the internet can be even when being personal. I can assure you that on more than one occasion I have called a bigoted/racist/faschist/mysogynistic simpleton a dickweed to his face.. boogie or no boogie. In most cases its just shallowness, simplicity, and unawareness spawned of ignorance. But most who fit into that behavior are usually an ignoramus with low self esteem that are desparately in need to feel superior to someone... anyone else to give meaning to thier all too often pathetic lives. Jeanne Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LouDiamond 1 #23 October 18, 2003 QuoteIn most cases its just shallowness, simplicity, and unawareness spawned of ignorance. But most who fit into that behavior are usually an ignoramus with low self esteem that are desparately in need to feel superior to someone... anyone else to give meaning to thier all too often pathetic lives. Ya know, I hate it when people beat around the bush. Why don't you tell us what you really think?"It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required" Some people dream about flying, I live my dream SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #24 October 18, 2003 QuoteWhy don't you tell us what you really think? It has been pointed out to me in the past.. that sometimes I am lacking in tact and diplomacy But when the stuff stanks.....I don't pretend its really roses. Life is too short to spend it around fools. Jeanne Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RippedCord 0 #25 October 18, 2003 QuoteWith an unsuccessfull attempt to lighten up an already hijacked thread, I was accused of being a redneck and a bigot. ... I'll stick to the T&A discussions on Talk Back and read the Women's Forums for their educational value Make that sexist redneck & bigot! AMDG Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
