lawrocket 3 #1 October 23, 2003 This issue is moving more and more into the forefront. Dennis Kucinich has said that if he were elected he would make a board to study the issue of reparations. In fact, two people were convicted of fraud for receiving $500,000 in a tax return for fraudulent reparations. See story here. Though this guy doesn't seem to me to be the best spokesman on behalf of the issue, there seem to be some powerful arguments on both sides. (Legally, I would say there is a statute of limitations issue - they missed it by about 150 years). Should there be reparations for slavery? I'd be interested in the viewpoints, as I've never discussed this issue before. Maybe I shoulda made this a poll... edited to remove a potentially harsh sounding phrase... My wife is hotter than your wife. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DJL 235 #2 October 23, 2003 Edited to remove reference to possibly harsh sounding comment. Reparations for slavery? No. Otherwise, I want reparations because my great grandfather was paid less as a doctor because he was born in Sweden and not in the US."I encourage all awesome dangerous behavior." - Jeffro Fincher Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lawrocket 3 #3 October 23, 2003 You're right. That did sound harsh. Thanks for pointing that out. My wife is hotter than your wife. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turtlespeed 226 #4 October 23, 2003 And I want Reparations because I wasn't born black and wasn't made to transfer to a school 3 hours away from my home and didn't have to suffer through affirmative action and I never had a black dad to teach me golf like tiger woods, yep about 300 million ought to do it. Ok, so that was uncalled for, but comon...150 years ago. I say I want reparations from King George III, he has effected my heritage in Scotland, I haven't been the same ever since.I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nigel99 616 #5 October 23, 2003 Definetely not - its to long ago and besides like it or not the descedents of slaves are far better off being US/UK citizens.Experienced jumper - someone who has made mistakes more often than I have and lived. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jayruss 0 #6 October 23, 2003 well I shouldn't have to pay because my great great grandfather was an abolitionist preacher that aided slaves through the underground rail road __________________________________________________ "Beware how you take away hope from another human being." -Oliver Wendell Holmes Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CrazyIvan 0 #7 October 23, 2003 Reparations for __________________ (fill the blank) is just a LAME excuse to attempting to make money WITHOUT working, don't you think? all those guys just want to make a quick buck using some bullshit excuse.__________________________________________ Blue Skies and May the Force be with you. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #8 October 23, 2003 Basically, I look at this issue and call bullshit. Yes, slavery was a horrible thing, but that was 150++ years ago. The people alive now had no hand in that process, instead of living in the past and trying to use the distant past as a free lunch, why don't we focus on fixing the social problems that we currently have.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,111 #9 October 23, 2003 >Reparations for slavery? Nope. It is essential that we change our policies and laws so they are fair to all - and we did that. It is sometimes appropriate to compensate the people who were wronged. But compensating their great-great-grandkids? Makes no sense to me. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turtlespeed 226 #10 October 23, 2003 QuoteReparations for __________________ (fill the blank) is just a LAME excuse to attempting to make money WITHOUT working, don't you think? all those guys just want to make a quick buck using some bullshit excuse. Ok, so a shorter version of what I was illuding to...I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lawrocket 3 #11 October 23, 2003 But, Aggie, isn't there something to be said about the long-term effects of it? Jim Crow was still alive and well forty years ago. And, like it or not, there is a disproportionate level of poverty and crime amongst the African American community. Is there not a possibility those effects are sequellae of slavery? My wife is hotter than your wife. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mirage63 0 #12 October 23, 2003 The main problem with this is who pays? Taxes are from all the people, not just the relatives of people who supported slavery. How about payments to the union forces that were killed? The real reason for this is to promote that some FORM of payment is "fair and needed" Once that has been established then the WHO is going to pay will begain. It will be ugly, it is uneeded, and common sense SHOULD stop it-but it won't Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turtlespeed 226 #13 October 23, 2003 I disagree. There is no way to answer the what if question. There are opinions and theorys and false conclusions. Until we are able to travel back in time and adjust history we will never know. One thing that is certain, if there are reparations ordered, it would be the most racist thing that anyone has ever heard of. There is no way to track the responsible parties. There is no way that an accountability can be fairly executed.I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #14 October 23, 2003 Jim Crow laws weren't repercussions of slavery, basically those were social norms that were bred from racism, the same racism that brought slavery. The social norms were enacted into law when other social norms and laws weren't available to racists to propagate their ideals. Thus, we as a society need to work together to bring about more social change to create an equal standing for all persons. Nothing other then that will rectify the situation that we currently have. If anything, reparations will only serve to widen the gap between the races, since it will do nothing but create a hostile social and economical environment. Thus potentially creating more of a racially motivated society, with bitter distrust and possible racial violence due to the reparations.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MC208B 0 #15 October 23, 2003 Another one that Bill and I agree on! No, there should be no reparations for slavery, period. That said, if somehow it comes to pass then those that accept it should agree to return to Africa and stay out of the USA for the rest of their lives Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jfields 0 #16 October 23, 2003 QuoteThere is no way to track the responsible parties. There is no way that an accountability can be fairly executed. True. The modern talk of reparations isn't about fairness, or accountability. It passed that a long time ago. It is about politics and greed these days. For everyone calling for reparations, someone else can ask something just as invalid and make it look pretty silly. If we are entering into the absurdity, I put my personal dibs in for reparations starting with Adam & Eve. I deserve money from Adam's medical malpractice suit in losing a rib. Gimme! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
storm1977 0 #17 October 23, 2003 The problem with the current society of America is that there is no accoutability instead just excuses and laziness...this goes for everyone. In order to succeed you need to work and be motivated. You need to overcome hurdles in your life and move on. Using the past (slavery) as an excuse as to why you are not successful is ignorant!!!!! We all have the power to overcome the challenges we face in life no matter where you are from. This country was founded on hard work and struggle, not lame bullshit excuses and government bailouts... IMHO we should do away with wellfare as well for the same reasons. Chris ----------------------------------------------------- Sometimes it is more important to protect LIFE than Liberty Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CrazyIvan 0 #18 October 23, 2003 QuoteIf we are entering into the absurdity, I put my personal dibs in for reparations starting with Adam & Eve. I deserve money from Adam's medical malpractice suit in losing a rib Yeah...I'd say we all get together and sue Italy, since they basically 'conquered' and 'exploited' the whole world when they started expanding the 'Roman Empire" __________________________________________ Blue Skies and May the Force be with you. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jib 0 #19 October 23, 2003 Quote...the same racism that brought slavery. I'm not a history expert and don't condone slavery, but I thought slavery regularly occured in Africa when one tribe defeated another and originally, slaves were purchased from the victorious tribes. I also thought some Africans were indentured servants, like some Europeans. -------------------------------------------------- the depth of his depravity sickens me. -- Jerry Falwell, People v. Larry Flynt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
champu 1 #20 October 23, 2003 QuoteOne thing that is certain, if there are reparations ordered, it would be the most racist thing that anyone has ever heard of.well... maybe the second most but otherwise I completely agree, using taxpayer dollars which come entirely from people who have never owned slaves (many of whose, at this point, predecessors never owned slaves) to give reparations entirely to people who have never been slaves (and again, at this point, many of whose predecessots never were either) will do nothing but make those recieving happy for a short while, and those giving angry forever. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turtlespeed 226 #21 October 23, 2003 QuoteQuoteThere is no way to track the responsible parties. There is no way that an accountability can be fairly executed. True. The modern talk of reparations isn't about fairness, or accountability. It passed that a long time ago. It is about politics and greed these days. For everyone calling for reparations, someone else can ask something just as invalid and make it look pretty silly. If we are entering into the absurdity, I put my personal dibs in for reparations starting with Adam & Eve. I deserve money from Adam's medical malpractice suit in losing a rib. Gimme! Gives Jfields a thermometer and asks him if he's feeling ok. Did you realize you actually agreed with me? Just curious.I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jib 0 #22 October 23, 2003 QuoteYeah...I'd say we all get together and sue Italy, since they basically 'conquered' and 'exploited' the whole world when they started expanding the 'Roman Empire" No, a class action lawsuit against the slave traders/shipping companies from Europe for kidnapping, RICO, .... -------------------------------------------------- the depth of his depravity sickens me. -- Jerry Falwell, People v. Larry Flynt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jfields 0 #23 October 23, 2003 QuoteGives Jfields a thermometer and asks him if he's feeling ok. I must have a fever, or malaria, or work-induced insanity. Doh! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turtlespeed 226 #24 October 23, 2003 Quotewell... maybe the second most Again, I say that it would be the MOST. Slavery has never been limited to the "African Americans." To give reparation to only them would be desecrating the memory of the non-black members of the slaves, and unjustly denying culture and history to their descendants.I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mouth 0 #25 October 23, 2003 I tell ya what. You give me a few slaves and then I'll consider your reparation theory. That is how silly this sounds. Give me a break...both arms please cause this is rediculous. I've never owned a slave, neither did any of my family; however, I can trace back 7 generations to an indentured servant on my grandmother's side. So what do I get? Huh? -- Hot Mama At least you know where you stand even if it is in a pile of shit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
