Reparations for slavery???

[lawrocket 3]

I myself agree that the idea of reparations is ridiculous. Still, I figured there'd be a few people who would say that there are good reasons for it.

How odd that all the posters here agree with the premise that reparations are, at a minimum, a bad idea and unfair.

I have a hard time even making arguments in favor of them.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[turtlespeed 226]

If you spoil the child, the child will not learn to do for it's self. It expects that the things that it want's and needs will be provided for them. If you teach a child how to do for it's self, it will challenge itself to be better and greater than those before it.

There is no difference between the psychology of a child and the psychology of a social culture. The basic rules apply to both.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[TheAnvil 0]

No way in hell. That's just an issue race-baiting yellow bellies bring up to rally votes to their cause. Nothing done in the present will change what has been done in the past - short of the invention of the time machine. Perhaps Wendy, BillVon, and I should get together and work on that. Naaaah. I'd rather skydive.

Anyway, all of the reparations rhetoric and hoopla, just like the affirmative action and racial preference hoopla harms America by stratifying it upon racial lines. I have no use for those who do so.

Vinny the Anvil
Post Traumatic Didn't Make The Lakers Syndrome is REAL
JACKASS POWER!!!!!!

[shedao 0]

I say that if the person wanting reparations can prove that his/her family was in one time owner of a piece of property that was taken in the civil war then yes they should recieve compensation of some sort.

But only under those circumstances.

[CrazyIvan 0]

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I say that if the person wanting reparations can prove that his/her family was in one time owner of a piece of property that was taken in the civil war then yes they should recieve compensation of some sort.

But only under those circumstances.

And what's the point of that?

__________________________________________
Blue Skies and May the Force be with you.

[turtlespeed 226]

OK...so what about the thousands that have no record what so ever of what ever was lost. It HAS to be fair or it HAS to go away.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[PhillyKev 0]

Aren't reparations already being made in the form of affirmative action? Blacks are definitely at a disadvantage today because of the prejudice that has been perpetrated against them by society. And I think that there needs to be some effort in order to rectify that and bring the playing field even before we can ignore racial issues. But, I don't think there should be a monetary handout to the descendants of slaves. Rather we should work as a society to elliminate the cultural bias that exists.

[storm1977 0]

I seem to remember seeing pictures of signs in the 1920 that said Help Wanted...Irish Need NOT Apply.

Funny how we forget. Did my grandparents (off the boat from Ireland get compensation????

NO.

Did my Grandparents WANT compensation???
NO.

It's called pride and a good work ethic.

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Sometimes it is more important to protect LIFE than Liberty

[storm1977 0]

To say blacks in america are where they are today because of slavery is BS. Blacks in America are where they are because of Who they are. It may sound harsh, but it is true.

2000 census - 70% of Black children born in the USA to a mother between the ages of 18 and 24 are without a father

So, are you going to argue that Slavery is the cause for Black men to be knocking up Black women in this country? No, the reason is no Civic Responsibility. And you know what. When the woman has to work all day to support her kid, who is going to look after the kid????? Then guess what, the kid grows up to be just like his runaway dad.

Don't blame Slavery... Don't make excuses for BAD BEHAVIOR!

Chris

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Sometimes it is more important to protect LIFE than Liberty

[billvon 3,114]

>So, are you going to argue that Slavery is the cause for Black men to
> be knocking up Black women in this country? No, the reason is no
> Civic Responsibility.

And most terrorists are white males. I'd say killing thousands makes you a worse person than being a deadbeat father, not to mention a bit lower on the scale of civic responsibility.

What? Don't like being lumped in with radical islamic terrorists just because you happen to have a similar skin color? Think that's unfair and absurd? Interesting.

Some people spend much of their time trying to define themselves by their race or religion or something so that there's a "them" you can blame everything on. It's the black's fault. It's the jews. It's the drug addicts. It's the arabs. Then you meet some, and you realize that even successful talk show hosts can be drug addicts. Brilliant engineers, scientists, and Nobel peace prize winners are arabs. It's harder to hate people once you see that, but that's a good thing (to most people.)

[PhillyKev 0]

I'm not making excuses for anyone. But there's a big difference between people who immigrate in order to have the opportunity to prove themselves in a land of opportunity, and those who are brought here against their will, have their individuality elliminated, their families split apart, etc. That was what slavery did. Then after it was over, they were not just not hired for jobs, they were not allowed to eat in public, or drink from water fountains that others did. They were chased down and beaten or murdered. Comparing the discrimination against immigrants to the discrimination against the blacks in this counry is ridiculous.

Yes, that was 150 years ago, but the people today grew up in a society and culture impacted by that injustice. Let me see you grow up the son of a released slave who was torn away from his family, and doesn't even know what a family is. Then show me how your generation and your children and grandchildren turn out being raised in a ghetto filled with people that have been through the same thing.

[turtlespeed 226]

Ok. I'm in. Lets do it...oh, yeah, i already did.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[storm1977 0]

Well Bill, for the most part the MAJORITY of black americans do consider themselfs as a group. And in many cases like the free handouts they have recieved for being a minority.

However, the stats don't lie. The stats are given for Whites, blacks, hispanics, and asians. The numbers for blacks are through the roof.

You often here from the "Black Community" excuses on why it is soooo tough for them. Why Slavery 150yrs ago and oppression 50 years ago has profoundly hurt them.

I don't hear about JEWS in Germany complaining of the same problem The jews have been persecuted all over the world for a LOT longer than blacks, yet, they seem to be doing fine. In fact, I would go so far as to say they are prospering...

Pride : Work Ethic: and Civic Resposibility

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Sometimes it is more important to protect LIFE than Liberty

[PhillyKev 0]

Quote

Well Bill, for the most part the MAJORITY of black americans do consider themselfs as a group. And in many cases like the free handouts they have recieved for being a minority.

However, the stats don't lie. The stats are given for Whites, blacks, hispanics, and asians. The numbers for blacks are through the roof.

You often here from the "Black Community" excuses on why it is soooo tough for them. Why Slavery 150yrs ago and oppression 50 years ago has profoundly hurt them.

I don't hear about JEWS in Germany complaining of the same problem The jews have been persecuted all over the world for a LOT longer than blacks, yet, they seem to be doing fine. In fact, I would go so far as to say they are prospering...

Pride : Work Ethic: and Civic Resposibility

Ok, so if I'm interpreting you correctly, you think that the historical treatment of blacks in this country has nothing to do with their cultural differences from other groups in any way. Could you explain to me what is the cause then? Are you implying it is some genetic defect based on their race?

[TheAnvil 0]

Discrimination of any sort is wrong. I would be very surprised if you could find a living son or daughter of a former slave alive today. 1865+18=1883, so if the father or mother was 18 at the end of the civil war the son or daughter would be 120 today. Highly unlikely.

The reparations idea is a rally cry that buffoons use to incite the ignorant masses to vote for them at election time. I really doubt anyone with three digit IQ would ever support such a measure.

I'm for targeted help to certain segments of society, but NEVER based upon skin color. Racial discrimination of any sort is both unethical and wrong.

Vinny the Anvil
Post Traumatic Didn't Make The Lakers Syndrome is REAL
JACKASS POWER!!!!!!

[Jib 0]

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But, Aggie, isn't there something to be said about the long-term effects of it? Jim Crow was still alive and well forty years ago. And, like it or not, there is a disproportionate level of poverty and crime amongst the African American community. Is there not a possibility those effects are sequellae of slavery?

We can't pay for our welfare programs already, e.g. social security, and we're supposed to give a pile of money to people for something that happened to their ancestors?

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the depth of his depravity sickens me.
-- Jerry Falwell, People v. Larry Flynt

[JDBoston 0]

Actually, I think he's saying that it's exactly the culture (to the extent to which you can generalize for any ethnic group) which is the problem. Just the way I read his post.

Joe

[PhillyKev 0]

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Actually, I think he's saying that it's exactly the culture (to the extent to which you can generalize for any ethnic group) which is the problem. Just the way I read his post.

Joe

Well if that's the case, tell me why that culture exists as it does? What was the cause of the cultural morays of today's blacks. Can anyone honestly say that the effects of slavery have been elliminated?

[Zlew 0]

Show me someone who was a slave, and show me someone who owned that slave.... and pay the man.

But I don't think people should get paid for things that happend generations before them. And i really don't think that the government should be paying for the actions of it's citizens.
Reperations is a great scame to fuck poor folk out of their money, and a great tool for losing political figures to grow the minority vote, but it will never happen.

Z

[storm1977 0]

No, not genetic. Like i said in my first post it is a societal problem. As the saying goes... give someone too much rope and they'll fuck it up.

I would like to see an explaiation (intelligent) of how Slavery in the mid 1800's caused the social problems of blacks today.

See, this is new. Blacks in the USA 30yrs ago didn't have these problems. Yes, 50 years ago in this country they were oppressed and there was a great deal of racism, however, the same societal problems weren't there.

What I am saying is that there is no connection to slavery and the current situation that blacks in america are in. (BTW - I am painting a broad brush there are exceptions obviously.)

Chris

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Sometimes it is more important to protect LIFE than Liberty

[TheAnvil 0]

Storm isn't saying that at all. The entire nation's culture was affected by the way blacks were treated. You're grasping at straws in order to avoid his point.

Pride, work ethic, and civic responsibility ARE lacking in the poor neigbhorhoods. I think you'll find these qualities lacking in poverty stricken areas throughout the nation - regardless of the race of the occupants.

Good point storm.

Vinny the Anvil
Post Traumatic Didn't Make The Lakers Syndrome is REAL
JACKASS POWER!!!!!!

[jfields 0]

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I really doubt anyone with three digit IQ would ever support such a measure.

Depends on where in the digits you find the decimal point.

[AggieDave 6]

Or how far left that IQ is.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[turtlespeed 226]

Here's a cliche':

Black Man: Oh, the man is gonna keep you down.

Ummm, weeelllll, if you think that way, then yes, the black man will keep you down. If you are told that you are not good enough by people you are taught to respect, and are given ways to get by without having to improve yourself to do it, of course you won't florish.
If the government programs quit giving to a point of sustaining it would be different. Noone likes to admit that. But as a whole, the black community would have to get on the ball and succeed.

Simple marketing principles apply here. Take for instance rebates. Company X has a product that it takes 2 dollars to manufacture and sell retail. Company X says that they will put it on the shelf for free. FREE! All you have to do is send in the rebate form worth the 7 dollars that it took to purchase it.

Well, statistically, (no, not 100 percent accurate), the rebate only gets turned in 20% of the time. Why? Because people as a society are F'ing LAZY, as a whole we would rather not do anything but sit on our asses and watch a football game, or what ever else is on the TV.

So, if you give the welfare to any societal group anyway, what incentive do they have to even try to better them selves? And with people like Jessie Jackson telling them that they need not do anything because they will recieve what is owed to them?

?

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[jfields 0]

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Or how far left that IQ is.

Is that due to a lack of 3-digit IQs to the right?

Just teasing.