skydyvr 0
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Amazon 7
QuoteHey - be fair, Bush was in the military during a shooting war. Don't recall offhand what he was doing though...
uh. I was being fair.... he went into the military with I believe with a juicy deployment to what....Ellington AFB and the 147th FIG/ 111th FIS.?
That is if he ever actually showed up http://www.awolbush.com/
And then there is http://www.seanet.com/~johnco/bush102.htm
Bush Service Time Line
May 28, 1968: Bush enlists as an Airman Basic in the 147th Fighter-Interceptor Group, Ellington Air Force Base, Houston, and is selected to attend pilot training.
July 12, 1968: A three-member board of officers decides that Bush should get a direct commission as a second lieutenant after competing airman's basic training.
July 14 to Aug. 25, 1968: Bush attends six weeks of basic training at Lackland Air Force Base, Texas.
Sept. 4, 1968: Bush is commissioned a second lieutenant and takes an 8-week leave to work on a Senate campaign in Florida.
Nov. 25, 1968 to Nov. 28, 1969: Bush attends and graduates from flight school at Moody Air Force Base, Georgia. (UTP Course #P-V4A-A Moody AFB, Ga. 53 weeks November 1969)
January 1,1970 147th changes from doing Alerts to training F-102 pilots.
December 1969 to June 27, 1970: Bush trains full-time to be an F-102 pilot at Ellington Air Force Base.
Febuary 1970 Bush attends Preint Pilot Training (T-33 ANG112501 5 weeks )
June 1970 his records are not clear his computer records show RGRAD NAV TNG but his Discharge shows F102 Intcp Pilot Training (F102 ANG1125D 16 weeks). His Military Biography shows: Professional Military Education: Basic Military Training, Undergraduate Pilot Training and nothing else.
Here is his total Service
July 1970 to April 16, 1972: Bush, as a certified fighter pilot, attends frequent drills and alerts at Ellington.
Computer records show last Physical as May 1971. Which also shows him as CR MEM ON FS (crew member on flight service) not PILOT.
During his fifth year as a guardsman, Bush's records show no sign he appeared for duty.
May 24, 1972: Bush, who has moved to Alabama to work on a US Senate race, gets permission to serve with a reserve unit in Alabama. But headquarters decided Bush must serve with a more active unit.
Sept. 5, 1972: Bush is granted permission to do his Guard duty at the 187th Tactical Recon Group in Montgomery. But Bush's record shows no evidence he did the duty, and the unit commander says he never showed up.
November 1972 to April 30, 1973: Bush returns to Houston, but apparently not to his Air Force unit.
May 2, 1973: The two lieutenant colonels in charge of Bush's unit in Houston cannot rate him for the prior 12 months, saying he has not been at the unit in that period.
May to July 1973: Bush, after special orders are issued for him to report for duty, logs 36 days of duty.
July 30, 1973: His last day in uniform, according to his records.
Oct. 1, 1973: A month after Bush starts at Harvard Business School, he is formally discharged from the Texas Air National Guard -- eight months before his six-year term expires.
Bush on Bush:
C-SPAN: How long did you spend in the service?
GOV. BUSH: Six years total. Active duty as a-I flew F-102 fighters out of Ellington Air Force Base. I was in the Texas Air National Guard. The 102 is a Delta wing air-to-air interceptor. And I went to basic flight school at Moody Air Force Base in Valdosta, Georgia, came back, spent another six months or so on active duty learning how to fly the 102, transitioning from what was then-the last plane I flew was the T-38.
C-SPAN: What years?
GOV. BUSH: Nineteen sixty-eight, when I got out of college. I started pilot training in November of '68 and got out in November of '69.
C-SPAN: Why didn't you go on full active duty?
GOV. BUSH: Because I was interested in becoming a pilot, and it became the first slot open and I took it.
C-SPAN: Did you ever become a pilot?
GOV. BUSH: Yeah.
C-SPAN: I mean, a commercial pilot, beyond-
GOV. BUSH: Oh, no, no, no, not at all. Just an old jet jockey.
C-SPAN: What'd you learn about anything from the service?
GOV. BUSH: I learned that there's a way to train a person who knew nothing about flying into being a good pilot. The service did a wonderful job of training. And I'm most impressed about how they drew a rote exercise into one's daily schedule until you got it right. And that's particularly important when you fly.
I'll never forget getting in the airplane and the guy said, "Okay, now do a 30-degree bank and do the turn at 60 degrees." And I did a 28-degree bank and turned 50 degrees, and he bangs his hand on the dashboard there and says, "I said a 30-degree bank at 60 degrees, and that's exactly what we mean." And from that point forward, I got my banks right and the degrees right. And it came in handy in the long run, because there's not much margin for error when you're flying jets.
Bush Flying in 1972?:
"David Anderson was another PULL employee, two years older than Bush, and he especially liked the fact that Bush had made arrangements to take some of the PULL kids such as Jimmy up for their first airplane ride.
The day of the ride, Bush asked his sixteen-year-old brother, Marvin, to come along. One of the PULL kids started popping off, making noise, once they were up in the air. Bush stalled the engine for a second, and the passengers, scared to death, grew quiet." Minutaglio, Bill. First Son, George W. Bush and the Bush Family Dynasty, Random House, NY, 1999 Pg. 151,
jraf 0
War on Terror?
There is no war on terror in Iraq. The occupying army of the US (yes our own armed forces) is under guerilla attack from local militia. It is not terror, it is resistance. Please, lets not get the terms mixed up.
In the last 10 years there have been two (2) attack on US soil by external terrorists, both on the same structures. No further terrorist acts since then.
There is no war on terror in Iraq. The occupying army of the US (yes our own armed forces) is under guerilla attack from local militia. It is not terror, it is resistance. Please, lets not get the terms mixed up.
In the last 10 years there have been two (2) attack on US soil by external terrorists, both on the same structures. No further terrorist acts since then.
jraf
Me Jungleman! Me have large Babalui.
Muff #3275
Me Jungleman! Me have large Babalui.
Muff #3275
Amazon 7
QuoteThe first George Bush was shot down twice serving his country.
George Herbert Bush served his country in a time of need... and yes he was shot down two times.. one ditch and one parachute. Him... I respect.. as I also respect Sen McCain for his service and sacrifice in Vietnam. There is a large group of our politicians who HAVE served our country.. on both sides of the political isle. The deserve nothing less than the gratitude of all americans.
But in this case our current president is certainly not the man his father is.
http://www.motherjones.com/news/outfront/2003/02/ma_217_01.html
Jeanne
tcnelson 1
i was one of those soldiers and i'd do it again if need be. we are doing the right thing and i thank god every day that gore didn't lawyer his way to the oval office after the eighty-seventh recount.
"Don't talk to me like that assface...I don't work for you yet." - Fletch
NBFT, Deseoso Rodriguez RB#1329
NBFT, Deseoso Rodriguez RB#1329
b1jercat 0
"Bring them on"
"We won't be intimidated"
"Hold my beer and watch this"
Famous last words.
blue skies
jerry
"We won't be intimidated"
"Hold my beer and watch this"
Famous last words.
blue skies
jerry
TheAnvil 0
Hello Bill and Jeanne -
Jeanne - only if LIEberman runs would they switch. Or if they watched none of the debates. 'Tis the concepts of personal responsibility, not caring what color anyone is nor supporting any program that does so, concept of achievement, merit based rewards, and and knowledge of foreign policy - among other things - that primarily makes the military lean right. Especially in its officer corps. LIEberman has told so many whoppers both in his last run and in the course of this primary that I doubt many would do so, even for him. The best thing that could happen for the Republicans is MAXIMUM exposure to the 'naive nine' as Zell Miller (D-GA) refers to them. Their positions on Iraq alone - LIEberman excepted - would drive any who served over there to cast their vote elsewhere
Bill - you nailed it there in some respects dude. We HAVE been there for a while. Unlike Iraq, we don't see the billions flowing there for investment and such. Granted, Afghanistan never had as high level/modern an infrastructure as Iraq but that doesn't mean ignore it. I don't see or hear about as organized of a guerilla resistance to coalition occupation there either, but your point is pertinent. What the hell ARE we doing? What is the status of progress there? I'd like to know. Lot's of differences betwn Vietnam and there too. Tons. But that's an area of foreign policy that hasn't been too publicly commented upon. If there have been great successes, they should be touted (I did see that Ms. Afghanistan competed in some nit-wit beauty pageant somewhere). The lack of publicity leads me to believe there's not, but I haven't been reading as much as of late.
Beers,
Vinny
Jeanne - only if LIEberman runs would they switch. Or if they watched none of the debates. 'Tis the concepts of personal responsibility, not caring what color anyone is nor supporting any program that does so, concept of achievement, merit based rewards, and and knowledge of foreign policy - among other things - that primarily makes the military lean right. Especially in its officer corps. LIEberman has told so many whoppers both in his last run and in the course of this primary that I doubt many would do so, even for him. The best thing that could happen for the Republicans is MAXIMUM exposure to the 'naive nine' as Zell Miller (D-GA) refers to them. Their positions on Iraq alone - LIEberman excepted - would drive any who served over there to cast their vote elsewhere
Bill - you nailed it there in some respects dude. We HAVE been there for a while. Unlike Iraq, we don't see the billions flowing there for investment and such. Granted, Afghanistan never had as high level/modern an infrastructure as Iraq but that doesn't mean ignore it. I don't see or hear about as organized of a guerilla resistance to coalition occupation there either, but your point is pertinent. What the hell ARE we doing? What is the status of progress there? I'd like to know. Lot's of differences betwn Vietnam and there too. Tons. But that's an area of foreign policy that hasn't been too publicly commented upon. If there have been great successes, they should be touted (I did see that Ms. Afghanistan competed in some nit-wit beauty pageant somewhere). The lack of publicity leads me to believe there's not, but I haven't been reading as much as of late.
Beers,
Vinny
Vinny the Anvil
Post Traumatic Didn't Make The Lakers Syndrome is REAL
JACKASS POWER!!!!!!
Post Traumatic Didn't Make The Lakers Syndrome is REAL
JACKASS POWER!!!!!!
TheAnvil 0
What was Ted Kennedy doing in July 1969 while GWB was at Moody AFB? (I assume your post is correct) On the 19th perchance?
If those screaming about the supposed irregularities in Bush's NG service hadn't elected everyone's favorite Harvard expelee to congress repeatedly, we might have paid them more attention when they brought this up. How does this compare with Clinton's military record
?
The election of El Jefe Clintonista is actually the reason the content of your post (I assume it's correct; too tired to pick it apart) didn't weigh into the minds of any swing voters all that heavily. Hard to slam evading military service in Vietnam when you elected an admitted draft dodger in the previous two elections. Horrible strategy. But not as bad as the one the socialists have underway now. McGovern-Mondale hybrid there for the most part. Ooooooooh boy.
If those screaming about the supposed irregularities in Bush's NG service hadn't elected everyone's favorite Harvard expelee to congress repeatedly, we might have paid them more attention when they brought this up. How does this compare with Clinton's military record
?
The election of El Jefe Clintonista is actually the reason the content of your post (I assume it's correct; too tired to pick it apart) didn't weigh into the minds of any swing voters all that heavily. Hard to slam evading military service in Vietnam when you elected an admitted draft dodger in the previous two elections. Horrible strategy. But not as bad as the one the socialists have underway now. McGovern-Mondale hybrid there for the most part. Ooooooooh boy.
Vinny the Anvil
Post Traumatic Didn't Make The Lakers Syndrome is REAL
JACKASS POWER!!!!!!
Post Traumatic Didn't Make The Lakers Syndrome is REAL
JACKASS POWER!!!!!!
Shark 0
QuoteI wonder how many of the troops who I would surmise are overwhelmingly republican till they got sent over there will vote after returning. War has an interesting way of making your own personal reality a bit more real to you than campaign slogans.
What if Rev. Sharpton represents the democratic party?
How do you think these swing votes might go? Looks like he rated better than a lot of the more popular candidates during the last debate.
kallend 2,150
QuoteWhat was Ted Kennedy doing in July 1969 while GWB was at Moody AFB? (I assume your post is correct) On the 19th perchance?
I didn't know Ted Kennedy was Commander in Chief and sending our boys in harm's way.
Quote
The election of El Jefe Clintonista is actually the reason the content of your post (I assume it's correct; too tired to pick it apart) didn't weigh into the minds of any swing voters all that heavily. Hard to slam evading military service in Vietnam when you elected an admitted draft dodger in the previous two elections. Horrible strategy. But not as bad as the one the socialists have underway now. McGovern-Mondale hybrid there for the most part. Ooooooooh boy.
How is following US Government rules "draft dodging"? The Government, in its wisdom, decided that Rhodes Scholars, among others, were worthy of deferments. A very sensible policy IMO, when you see what happened to people like Henry Moseley in WWI.
OTOH, going AWOL is clearly not following the rules, rather like DUI.
...
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
Amazon 7
Dude you need someone else other than Clinton ( 39 refferences all by you to El Jefe when you do a search )and Kennedy to hate... Find someone new...to hate... will it be Al Sharpton.. from your tone??
I lived thru that time period.. I had friends who went off to that war and never returned, others returned in body.. but not in spirit or mind... The list of men seeking draft defferments to college were VERY very long.
Clinton was subject to the draft.. and got a high number of 311.. guaranteed to stay home. He went thru a long process of trying to get the defferrments before that.... .. and appointments that others found quite a bit more easily because they had far better family connections. If we are to extrapolate here a bit.. I would say with his intellect... and his grades in college.. he was far more deserving than any boozing frat boy. But the reality was.. if you had money and connections.. you need never serve. Since Mr Clinton did not serve in the military.. he is VERY good company by your brethern on the far right... Shall we have a role call of the CHICKENHAWKS PLEASE
http://www.bartcop.com/chickenhawks.htm
Excerpt
THE CHICKENHAWKS
Conservatives make great fun of President Clinton for questioning the Vietnam War,
standing up to his beliefs and questioning his own participation in that war as well, i.e.,
being honest and walking the walk of his own belief system. On the other hand there
were literally millions of dishonest hypocritical, cowardly right-wing "patriots" who
supported the war while refusing to personally participate. Here are just a few:
Elliott Abrams - Sought deferment for bad back.
Richard Armey - Sought college deferment, too smart to die.
Bill Bennett - Sought graduate school deferment, too smart to die.
Pat Buchanan - Sought deferment for bad knee.
Resident George W. Bush - Turned down as too dumb for graduate school or law school
so daddy had to get him into the Reserves. He MAY have learned to fly jets, if he did,
the type of jet he says he trained in was no longer in service in Viet Nam at that time.
He then proves how brave a patriot he is by going AWOL from the Reserves for over a year
(which means he deserted). It is important to note that George Bush Sr. likes to tell how he is
a WWII hero (you only find this version in publications funded by Bush backers). He says he
bailed out on a mission because his plane was hit, on fire and going down. Unfortunately for
Lieutenant Bush, the official day log entry of the Tail -gunner in the plane ahead of George Sr.
wrote that he saw only a puff of smoke, no flame, no loss of altitude or control and only one
parachute - that of the pilot ejecting immediately.
The other two airmen in the plane died when it crashed into the sea with no pilot at the controls.
So much for the rules of the Navy where the captain goes down with his ship. So we can't blame
Little George for cowardice, he can't help if it's genetic.
Vice Resident Dick Cheney - Sought school deferments five times, too smart to die,
wanted to live so he could make millions off of the taxpayers without ever working.
Tom DeLay - - Sought college deferment, too smart to die.
Newt Gingrich - Sought graduate school deferment, too smart to die.
Phil Gramm - Sought marriage deferment, too loved to die.
Jack Kemp - Sought medical deferment while still playing in the NFL.
Rush Limbaugh - Sought deferment for ingrown hair follicle on his butt (bizarre but true).
Trent Lott - Sought deferment, didn't want to muss his hair.
P.J. O'Rourke - Sought deferment, too stoned.
Dan Quayle - Family got him into the Reserves (too dumb for grad school but was not a deserter like the Bush boy).
Ron Reagan - Enlisted but never left U.S. (although he later claimed to have liberated the concentration camps).
Stayed on Hollywood backlit to do war films while cheating on his wife and later impregnating girl friend Nancy)
Pat Robertson - Father pulled him out of Korea as soon as the shooting began
(went home, heard the call of God and proceeded to knock-up his girl friend... alleluia).
Kenneth Starr - Sought deferment for psoriasis (can't pull a trigger if your trigger finger is scratching other itches).
John Wayne - Sought deferment to further acting career (never served, never left country).
George Will - Sought deferment, too much of a wussy, wanted to stay home
watch baseball and use stolen Presidential documents to brief the actor, Ronald Reagan.
NOW lets look at who REALLLY has served....
http://awolbush.com/whoserved.html
Prominent Democrats
Representative Richard Gephardt, former House Minority Leader - Missouri Air National Guard, 1965-71. (1, 2)
Representative David Bonior - Staff Sgt., United States Air Force 1968-72 (1, 2)
Senate Minority Leader Tom Daschle - 1st Lt., U.S. Air Force SAC 1969-72 (1, 2)
Former Vice President Al Gore - enlisted August 1969; sent to Vietnam January 1971 as an army journalist, assigned to the 20th Engineer Brigade headquartered at Bien Hoa, an airbase twenty miles northeast of Saigon. More facts about Gore's Service
Former Senator Bob Kerrey... Democrat... Lt. j.g., U.S. Navy 1966-69; Medal of Honor, Vietnam (1, 2)
Senator Daniel Inouye, US Army 1943-'47; Medal of Honor, World War Two (1, 2)
Senator John Kerry, Lt., U.S. Navy 1966-70; Silver Star, Bronze Star with Combat V, and three awards of the Purple Heart for his service in combat (1)
Representative Charles Rangel, Staff Sgt., U.S. Army 1948-52; Bronze Star, Korea (1, 2)
Former Senator Max Cleland, Captain, U.S. Army 1965-68; Silver Star & Bronze Star, Vietnam (1, 2)
Senator Ted Kennedy (D-MA) - U.S. Army, 1951-1953. (1)
Senator Tom Harkin (D-IA) - Lt., U.S. Navy, 1962-67; Naval Reserve, 1968-74. (1, 2)
Senator Jack Reed (D-RI) - U.S. Army Ranger, 1971-1979; Captain, Army Reserve 1979-91 (1)
Senator Fritz Hollings (D-SC) - served as a U.S. Army officer in World War II, receiving the Bronze Star and seven campaign ribbons. (1)
Representative Leonard Boswell (D-IA) - Lt. Col., U.S. Army 1956-76; two tours in Vietnam, two Distinguished Flying Crosses as a helicopter pilot, two Bronze Stars, and the Soldier's Medal. (1, 2)
Former Representative "Pete" Peterson, Air Force Captain, POW, Ambassador to Viet Nam, and recipient of the Purple Heart, the Silver Star and the Legion of Merit. (1, 2)
Rep. Mike Thompson, D-CA: Staff sergeant/platoon leader with the 173rd Airborne Brigade, U.S. Army; was wounded and received a Purple Heart. (1, 2)
Bill McBride, Democratic Candidate for Florida Governor - volunteered and served as a U.S. Marine in Vietnam; awarded Bronze Star with a combat "V." (1)
Gray Davis, California Governor, Army Captain in Vietnam; received Bronze Star. (1)
Pete Stark, D-CA, served in the Air Force 1955-57
Prominent Republicans
Speaker of the House Dennis Hastert - avoided the draft, did not serve.
Former House Majority Leader Dick Armey - avoided the draft, did not serve.
House Majority Leader Tom Delay - avoided the draft, did not serve (1). "So many minority youths had volunteered ... that there was literally no room for patriotic folks like himself."
House Majority Whip Roy Blunt - did not serve
Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist - did not serve. (An impressive medical resume, but not such a friend to cats in Boston.)
Majority Whip Mitch McConnell, R-KY - did not serve (1)
Rick Santorum, R-PA, third ranking Republican in the Senate - did not serve. (1)
Former Senate Majority Leader Trent Lott - avoided the draft, did not serve.
Secretary of Defense Don Rumsfeld - served in the U.S. Navy (1954-57) as an aviator and flight instructor. (1) Served as President Reagan's Special Envoy to the Middle East and met with Saddam Hussein twice in 1983 and 1984.
GW Bush - decided that a six-year Nat'l Guard commitment really means four years. Still says that he's "been to war." Huh?
VP Cheney - several deferments (1, 2), the last by marriage (in his own words, "had other priorities than military service") (1)
Att'y Gen. John Ashcroft - did not serve (1, 2); received seven deferment to teach business ed at SW Missouri State
Jeb Bush, Florida Governor - did not serve. (1)
Karl Rove - avoided the draft, did not serve (1), too busy being a Republican.
Former Speaker Newt Gingrich - avoided the draft, did not serve (1, 2)
Former President Ronald Reagan - due to poor eyesight, served in a noncombat role making movies for the Army in southern California during WWII. He later seems to have confused his role as an actor playing a tail gunner with the real thing.
"B-1" Bob Dornan - avoided Korean War combat duty by enrolling in college acting classes (Orange County Weekly article). Enlisted only after the fighting was over in Korea.
Phil Gramm - avoided the draft, did not serve, four (?) student deferments
List of Honor
Senator John McCain - McCain's naval honors include the Silver Star, Bronze Star, Legion of Merit, Purple Heart and Distinguished Flying Cross. Why did the Bush campaign smear him so? At least Senators Cleland (D-GA), Kerry (D-MA), Kerrey (D-NE), Robb (D-VA) and Hagel (R-NE) defended him.
Former Senator Bob Dole - an honorable man. http://www.bobdole.org/bio/wwII.php
Chuck Hagel - two Purple Hearts and a Bronze Star, Vietnam.
http://www.senate.gov/~hagel/Information/bio.htm
Duke Cunningham - nominated for the Medal of Honor, received the Navy Cross, two Silver Stars, fifteen Air Medals, the Purple Heart, and several other decorations http://www.house.gov/cunningham/about_duke.htm#Biography
Senator Jeff Sessions U.S. Army Reserves, 1973-1986
Colin Powell. What are we to make of Powell? On the one hand, a long career as a military manager. On the other hand, accused of covering up the My Lai massacre. Back on that first hand, one of the seemingly sane voices in this administration when it comes to Iraq (or at least he used to be). On the other hand, a clear hypocrite ("I am angry that so many of the sons of the powerful and well-placed... managed to wangle slots in Reserve and National Guard units...")
Representative Wayne Gilchrest (R-MD), served in USMC in Vietnam; wounded in action.
Now to thow something else into your spin.. check this out.
It appears.. as always to be..... more to the story( there always is) than just the superficial features
http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/8425/CLIN-CIA.HTM
As far as Kennedy... yup he made bad decisions when he was young... but has served the people of MASS.. fairly well for MOST of his life. They are the ones who elected him.. and by the way.. ever been in a severe car accident... ever hear of shock??? Nah nothing like that could ever happen to you....
I lived thru that time period.. I had friends who went off to that war and never returned, others returned in body.. but not in spirit or mind... The list of men seeking draft defferments to college were VERY very long.
Clinton was subject to the draft.. and got a high number of 311.. guaranteed to stay home. He went thru a long process of trying to get the defferrments before that.... .. and appointments that others found quite a bit more easily because they had far better family connections. If we are to extrapolate here a bit.. I would say with his intellect... and his grades in college.. he was far more deserving than any boozing frat boy. But the reality was.. if you had money and connections.. you need never serve. Since Mr Clinton did not serve in the military.. he is VERY good company by your brethern on the far right... Shall we have a role call of the CHICKENHAWKS PLEASE
http://www.bartcop.com/chickenhawks.htm
Excerpt
THE CHICKENHAWKS
Conservatives make great fun of President Clinton for questioning the Vietnam War,
standing up to his beliefs and questioning his own participation in that war as well, i.e.,
being honest and walking the walk of his own belief system. On the other hand there
were literally millions of dishonest hypocritical, cowardly right-wing "patriots" who
supported the war while refusing to personally participate. Here are just a few:
Elliott Abrams - Sought deferment for bad back.
Richard Armey - Sought college deferment, too smart to die.
Bill Bennett - Sought graduate school deferment, too smart to die.
Pat Buchanan - Sought deferment for bad knee.
Resident George W. Bush - Turned down as too dumb for graduate school or law school
so daddy had to get him into the Reserves. He MAY have learned to fly jets, if he did,
the type of jet he says he trained in was no longer in service in Viet Nam at that time.
He then proves how brave a patriot he is by going AWOL from the Reserves for over a year
(which means he deserted). It is important to note that George Bush Sr. likes to tell how he is
a WWII hero (you only find this version in publications funded by Bush backers). He says he
bailed out on a mission because his plane was hit, on fire and going down. Unfortunately for
Lieutenant Bush, the official day log entry of the Tail -gunner in the plane ahead of George Sr.
wrote that he saw only a puff of smoke, no flame, no loss of altitude or control and only one
parachute - that of the pilot ejecting immediately.
The other two airmen in the plane died when it crashed into the sea with no pilot at the controls.
So much for the rules of the Navy where the captain goes down with his ship. So we can't blame
Little George for cowardice, he can't help if it's genetic.
Vice Resident Dick Cheney - Sought school deferments five times, too smart to die,
wanted to live so he could make millions off of the taxpayers without ever working.
Tom DeLay - - Sought college deferment, too smart to die.
Newt Gingrich - Sought graduate school deferment, too smart to die.
Phil Gramm - Sought marriage deferment, too loved to die.
Jack Kemp - Sought medical deferment while still playing in the NFL.
Rush Limbaugh - Sought deferment for ingrown hair follicle on his butt (bizarre but true).
Trent Lott - Sought deferment, didn't want to muss his hair.
P.J. O'Rourke - Sought deferment, too stoned.
Dan Quayle - Family got him into the Reserves (too dumb for grad school but was not a deserter like the Bush boy).
Ron Reagan - Enlisted but never left U.S. (although he later claimed to have liberated the concentration camps).
Stayed on Hollywood backlit to do war films while cheating on his wife and later impregnating girl friend Nancy)
Pat Robertson - Father pulled him out of Korea as soon as the shooting began
(went home, heard the call of God and proceeded to knock-up his girl friend... alleluia).
Kenneth Starr - Sought deferment for psoriasis (can't pull a trigger if your trigger finger is scratching other itches).
John Wayne - Sought deferment to further acting career (never served, never left country).
George Will - Sought deferment, too much of a wussy, wanted to stay home
watch baseball and use stolen Presidential documents to brief the actor, Ronald Reagan.
NOW lets look at who REALLLY has served....
http://awolbush.com/whoserved.html
Prominent Democrats
Representative Richard Gephardt, former House Minority Leader - Missouri Air National Guard, 1965-71. (1, 2)
Representative David Bonior - Staff Sgt., United States Air Force 1968-72 (1, 2)
Senate Minority Leader Tom Daschle - 1st Lt., U.S. Air Force SAC 1969-72 (1, 2)
Former Vice President Al Gore - enlisted August 1969; sent to Vietnam January 1971 as an army journalist, assigned to the 20th Engineer Brigade headquartered at Bien Hoa, an airbase twenty miles northeast of Saigon. More facts about Gore's Service
Former Senator Bob Kerrey... Democrat... Lt. j.g., U.S. Navy 1966-69; Medal of Honor, Vietnam (1, 2)
Senator Daniel Inouye, US Army 1943-'47; Medal of Honor, World War Two (1, 2)
Senator John Kerry, Lt., U.S. Navy 1966-70; Silver Star, Bronze Star with Combat V, and three awards of the Purple Heart for his service in combat (1)
Representative Charles Rangel, Staff Sgt., U.S. Army 1948-52; Bronze Star, Korea (1, 2)
Former Senator Max Cleland, Captain, U.S. Army 1965-68; Silver Star & Bronze Star, Vietnam (1, 2)
Senator Ted Kennedy (D-MA) - U.S. Army, 1951-1953. (1)
Senator Tom Harkin (D-IA) - Lt., U.S. Navy, 1962-67; Naval Reserve, 1968-74. (1, 2)
Senator Jack Reed (D-RI) - U.S. Army Ranger, 1971-1979; Captain, Army Reserve 1979-91 (1)
Senator Fritz Hollings (D-SC) - served as a U.S. Army officer in World War II, receiving the Bronze Star and seven campaign ribbons. (1)
Representative Leonard Boswell (D-IA) - Lt. Col., U.S. Army 1956-76; two tours in Vietnam, two Distinguished Flying Crosses as a helicopter pilot, two Bronze Stars, and the Soldier's Medal. (1, 2)
Former Representative "Pete" Peterson, Air Force Captain, POW, Ambassador to Viet Nam, and recipient of the Purple Heart, the Silver Star and the Legion of Merit. (1, 2)
Rep. Mike Thompson, D-CA: Staff sergeant/platoon leader with the 173rd Airborne Brigade, U.S. Army; was wounded and received a Purple Heart. (1, 2)
Bill McBride, Democratic Candidate for Florida Governor - volunteered and served as a U.S. Marine in Vietnam; awarded Bronze Star with a combat "V." (1)
Gray Davis, California Governor, Army Captain in Vietnam; received Bronze Star. (1)
Pete Stark, D-CA, served in the Air Force 1955-57
Prominent Republicans
Speaker of the House Dennis Hastert - avoided the draft, did not serve.
Former House Majority Leader Dick Armey - avoided the draft, did not serve.
House Majority Leader Tom Delay - avoided the draft, did not serve (1). "So many minority youths had volunteered ... that there was literally no room for patriotic folks like himself."
House Majority Whip Roy Blunt - did not serve
Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist - did not serve. (An impressive medical resume, but not such a friend to cats in Boston.)
Majority Whip Mitch McConnell, R-KY - did not serve (1)
Rick Santorum, R-PA, third ranking Republican in the Senate - did not serve. (1)
Former Senate Majority Leader Trent Lott - avoided the draft, did not serve.
Secretary of Defense Don Rumsfeld - served in the U.S. Navy (1954-57) as an aviator and flight instructor. (1) Served as President Reagan's Special Envoy to the Middle East and met with Saddam Hussein twice in 1983 and 1984.
GW Bush - decided that a six-year Nat'l Guard commitment really means four years. Still says that he's "been to war." Huh?
VP Cheney - several deferments (1, 2), the last by marriage (in his own words, "had other priorities than military service") (1)
Att'y Gen. John Ashcroft - did not serve (1, 2); received seven deferment to teach business ed at SW Missouri State
Jeb Bush, Florida Governor - did not serve. (1)
Karl Rove - avoided the draft, did not serve (1), too busy being a Republican.
Former Speaker Newt Gingrich - avoided the draft, did not serve (1, 2)
Former President Ronald Reagan - due to poor eyesight, served in a noncombat role making movies for the Army in southern California during WWII. He later seems to have confused his role as an actor playing a tail gunner with the real thing.
"B-1" Bob Dornan - avoided Korean War combat duty by enrolling in college acting classes (Orange County Weekly article). Enlisted only after the fighting was over in Korea.
Phil Gramm - avoided the draft, did not serve, four (?) student deferments
List of Honor
Senator John McCain - McCain's naval honors include the Silver Star, Bronze Star, Legion of Merit, Purple Heart and Distinguished Flying Cross. Why did the Bush campaign smear him so? At least Senators Cleland (D-GA), Kerry (D-MA), Kerrey (D-NE), Robb (D-VA) and Hagel (R-NE) defended him.
Former Senator Bob Dole - an honorable man. http://www.bobdole.org/bio/wwII.php
Chuck Hagel - two Purple Hearts and a Bronze Star, Vietnam.
http://www.senate.gov/~hagel/Information/bio.htm
Duke Cunningham - nominated for the Medal of Honor, received the Navy Cross, two Silver Stars, fifteen Air Medals, the Purple Heart, and several other decorations http://www.house.gov/cunningham/about_duke.htm#Biography
Senator Jeff Sessions U.S. Army Reserves, 1973-1986
Colin Powell. What are we to make of Powell? On the one hand, a long career as a military manager. On the other hand, accused of covering up the My Lai massacre. Back on that first hand, one of the seemingly sane voices in this administration when it comes to Iraq (or at least he used to be). On the other hand, a clear hypocrite ("I am angry that so many of the sons of the powerful and well-placed... managed to wangle slots in Reserve and National Guard units...")
Representative Wayne Gilchrest (R-MD), served in USMC in Vietnam; wounded in action.
Now to thow something else into your spin.. check this out.
It appears.. as always to be..... more to the story( there always is) than just the superficial features
http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/8425/CLIN-CIA.HTM
As far as Kennedy... yup he made bad decisions when he was young... but has served the people of MASS.. fairly well for MOST of his life. They are the ones who elected him.. and by the way.. ever been in a severe car accident... ever hear of shock??? Nah nothing like that could ever happen to you....
Tonto 1
QuoteThe first George Bush was shot down twice serving his country.
I thought you served your country by NOT being shot down.
General Patton said -
"You don't win a war by dying for your country. You win a war by making other young men die for THEIR country!"
(Or words to that effect.)
t
It's the year of the Pig.
mikkey 0
I saw a documentary some years ago about the "composition" of combat troops in Vietnam (i.e. social status, education, race etc. ). Makes you wonder how come that if you have a draft system that so disproportional many soldiers were from the "lower" social layers of society and/or of non-Caucasian ethnic background….
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When people look like ants - pull. When ants look like people - pray.
When people look like ants - pull. When ants look like people - pray.
Amazingly, there are large numbers of significant figures from across the political spectrum who embraced or avoided the call to serve.
. . =(_8^(1)
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