twoweeks 0 #1 January 10, 2008 Last week was my 4th AFF jump. My task was to jump with one instructor with him holding onto me. Do a circle of awareness, reach touch and recover, and when he is ready, he lets go. Then I turn 90° to the right, stop, fly forward and dock. Then repeat to the left. Sounds easy enough. FALSE. Well I was pretty excided about this jump. I would be falling on my own, turning, interacting with someone in flight. I was stoked. Check in, Check out, prop, up, down, ARCH. The next thing I remember thinking is “why are we upside down. I’m not going to fight this ill let him flip us over. That’s his job right”. So he did and we got stable. Good, Circle of awareness. Altitude 8,500. “CRAP that burnt a lot of time” my instructor feels that I’m stable and lets go. “SWEEEEET I’m on my own” Everything is great. I’m on the column of air falling perfectly. I turn my head to the right, chin to right shoulder, and then rotated the shoulders pushing the right shoulder down. I start the right turn. When 90° comes, I stop the turn. Well kind of. Instead of turning I am kind of now slowly spiraling backwards and to the right and I can’t figure out how to stop it. It is like the column of air moved from my lower abdomen to my left peck. At this point I knew I shouldn’t try the rest of the maneuvers until I can stop this slow, slow, backwards, right spiral. And I couldn’t. I tried dropping the left shoulder to counter act the spin. Which helped, but as soon as I squared back up the spiral started again. I check my altitude, saw 5,500, waved off and pulled the chute. The rest of the flight was fine but I was pissed off about the failed skydive. Any advise out there to help me on the nest jump?? Thanks for reading. FYI: incase it helps, I’m 6’4” 190lb, long and skinny Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dragon2 2 #2 January 10, 2008 Only one answer to that one, go talk to your instructor on that jump ciel bleu, Saskia Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bodypilot1 0 #3 January 10, 2008 Quote Instead of turning I am kind of now slowly spiraling backwards and to the right and I can’t figure out how to stop it. Your AFFI should have debriefed you on what the cause was and noted it in your logbook. It sounds like you probably weren't sticking your legs out enough and they were uneven as well. Get video of your next AFF, it's priceless tool for a better and faster learning curve. Edwww.WestCoastWingsuits.com www.PrecisionSkydiving.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fast 0 #4 January 10, 2008 Please insist from your instructors that they talk to you about these things after a skydive. If they aren't doing so, remind them that you are paying them good money to teach you something. If you aren't debriefed you aren't being taught. I don't let any of my students leave until they have gone over the skydive with me and know what they did well and what they need to do better the next time they jump. Have fun! ~D Where troubles melt like lemon drops Away above the chimney tops That's where you'll find me. Swooping is taking one last poke at the bear before escaping it's cave - davelepka Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
taylor.freefall 0 #5 January 10, 2008 Seriously try the windtunnel, it did wonders to help me with very similar problems. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
denete 3 #6 January 10, 2008 Debrief, debrief, debrief. Isn't that standard for AFFIs? I'm mildly curious if this was a "my-job's-over-when-you-deploy" kind of instructor. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,087 #7 January 10, 2008 >Any advise out there to help me on the nest jump? Look at your instructor. He will give you hand signals to correct whatever problems you're having. You might expect to see a legs-out if you are backsliding, or a toe tap if your legs have gotten screwy (and are causing the turn.) After the dive, ask him what happened, and he will go over how to prevent that in the future. Generally such things are pretty easy to fix on a creeper/trainer. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
grannyinthesky 0 #8 January 10, 2008 Quote The rest of the flight was fine but I was pissed off about the failed skydive. You pulled at altitude and walked away from the jump...that's good. I look at this kind of jump as anew learning opportunity, not a failure. Listen to the other posters here. Your instructor should be debriefing you after the jump. I generally find there are things that I did right and wrong that I wasn't even aware of. It should be part of the learning process."safety first... and What the hell..... safety second, Too!!! " ~~jmy POPS #10490 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
in2jumping 0 #9 January 10, 2008 Quote Seriously try the windtunnel, it did wonders to help me with very similar problems. I second that, if you have a wind tunnel any where close go get some time. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chrismgtis 0 #10 January 10, 2008 You will get it. I don't think most people show themselves as naturals during AFF. Just redo the dive if you have. You will eventually work it out. You would be surprised how one dive can go so terrible with all you're unintentional turns and flips and the next goes very well. Most importantly, talk to the instructor and anyone else at the DZ that is willing. Also, it's always a possibility if you don't mind the cost to get video with your next dive so you and your instructor both can see what is going on and explain it even better.Rodriguez Brother #1614, Muff Brother #4033 Jumped: Twin Otter, Cessna 182, CASA, Helicopter, Caravan Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,087 #11 January 10, 2008 > Seriously try the windtunnel . . . Wind tunnels are a great tool, and will almost certainly help - but they can be expensive solutions to what is often a cheap and easy to fix problem. Generally I recommend going out of your way to find a tunnel only if there's a specific and repeated problem (like uncontrollable legs.) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #12 January 11, 2008 so you didn't pass L4 on the first try. Big whoop. It's not like it went badly, might well be a slam dunk for you on the next try. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
erikph 0 #13 January 11, 2008 Quote and when he is ready, he lets go. most instructors let go when YOU are ready Quote That’s his job right wrong Quote “SWEEEEET I’m on my own” Witnessing this is one of the reasons why I am an instructor. Congrats to you. You recovered from a bad exit and got your act together again: good! Quote falling perfectly sure about that? Quote as soon as I squared back up the spiral started again sounds like you were concentrating on the turn too much and neglecting your overall body position a bit Quote 5,500, waved off and pulled you got the essentials rightblue skies, http://myjumps.blogspot.com/ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Para5-0 0 #14 January 14, 2008 Relax and remember that every jump from now until 10,000 is a learning experience. Your instructor will guide you through, it is not uncommon and you are not abnormal. You made a safe, fun, skydive right? Remember why you are doing this. As far as the AFFI I am sure he will work with you as this is what he is trained to do. Be wary of advice online, your instructor is the ultimate authority for the time being. Also keep your eyes and ears open at your DZ, I am sure you have some very experienced people there as well. Good Luck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ladydyver 0 #15 January 15, 2008 You will find that there are some things that you pick up really quickly and do well and others that you will find you need to work on - took me 30 jumps to break my back sliding habit/and I am still working on my landings. The big thing is to not get too frustrated because it will just make you more stressed with the next jump. You will not do everything perfectly every time......skydiving has a learning curve to it - just enjoy the ride. DPH # 2 "I am not sure what you are suppose to do with that, but I don't think it is suppose to flop around like that." ~Skootz~ I have a strong regard for the rules.......doc! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
popsjumper 2 #16 January 15, 2008 Quote .."Be wary of advice online, your instructor is the ultimate authority for the time being".... VS..."Also keep your eyes and ears open at your DZ, I am sure you have some very experienced people there as well. " Conflicting advice. I'd clarify by saying, "...and take anything anyone else says to you back to your instructor and ask him/her about it before you attempt to do any of it."My reality and yours are quite different. I think we're all Bozos on this bus. Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kkeenan 14 #17 January 16, 2008 Quote I'm mildly curious if this was a "my-job's-over-when-you-deploy" kind of instructor. Posts like this (from the OP) always amaze me. I can't imagine an instructor not giving a debrief addressing these points and answering the student's questions. However, I suppose there are instructors out there who feel their job is to supervise the student on the jump and then go on to work with the next student. It just seems bizarre to me that a student would get down from a jump, not be talked to by anyone, and then resort to asking a bunch of i-net yahoos how to learn to skydive. Another scenario is that the student feels that his local instructor is nowhere as skilled and knowledgable as the "experts" on DZ.com. So he barely listens to his debrief, hardly able to wait until he can post his questions and get the "real" answers from this "international panel of skygods". People are funny. _____________________________________ Dude, you are so awesome... Can I be on your ash jump ? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Baksteen 84 #18 January 16, 2008 From the OP's introduction thread: Quote I am new to the scene with only 3 jumps. I am planning on doing my level 3 & 4 jumps on the 8th and i am already looking into buying a rid. Where is the best place (book, website, person) i could find out some more info on parachutes, containers, reserves. I'm one of those "research things to death people" Give them the benefit of the doubt, maybe they are really looking for alternative views to discuss with their instructor...."That formation-stuff in freefall is just fun and games but with an open parachute it's starting to sound like, you know, an extreme sport." ~mom Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gofastrlbrown 0 #19 January 28, 2008 I agree that the instructor is at fault a lot of times during AFF. GOFASTIt is strange, the more I practice, the better I get! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
grannyinthesky 0 #20 January 28, 2008 Quote I agree that the instructor is at fault a lot of times during AFF. I'm puzzled.......How do you figure the instructor is at fault, here or in the other times you are refering to. From my limited perspective and having to repeat a jump, I don't see anything that would have been my instructor's fault. Some of the AFF descriptions here sound like the curriculum is pushing students to do a lot really fast. My instructor has been following the ISP in the SIM which really makes a nice sequence of the necessary skills. Even with that, you need to learn a radically different skillset than skills learned in the earthbound world and there is very little time to practice them. Doing things less than perfectly is to be expected....."safety first... and What the hell..... safety second, Too!!! " ~~jmy POPS #10490 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
