WTF is wrong with people?

[Nightingale 0]

sigh. can we not let this go into a death penalty debate? pweese? we've hashed it out before. nobody's going to convince anyone else.

[Push 0]

The right for a fair trial is more important than the right for a speedy trial.

-- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo
Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

[PhillyKev 0]

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My view on the Death Penalty is that if you are found guilty and sentenced to death you get one appeal within 30 days. If your appeal is denied then you are put to death 30 days later. IMHO too much time and money is spent on appeals, briefs, etc.. I mean 9-12 years making appeals is why our judicial system is in total disarray. So much for the right to a speedy trial.

Our justice system makes mistakes. It makes them in both directions. People that are guilty go free, people that are innocent get convicted.

Here are three scenarios that can occur:

1) Guilty person is set free and they can't be retried. Result is a criminal loose on the street.

2) Innocent person is convicted and sentenced to life in prison. 20 years later DNA evidence proves they were innocent. They are set free and the police can try to find the real killer. They lost 20 years of their life but have a chance to still make something out of it.

3) Innocent person is convicted and put to death. 20 years later DNA evidence proves they are innocent. An innocent person has now been killed.

[PhillyKev 0]

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Knock, knock, hello, anyone in there?

I can't argue with that logic. Very convincing reason to kill.

[Zenister 0]

you missed the part about 'proven' or perhaps just ignored it to build your strawman..

i'm not passing judgement here beacuse the facts are not out and the investigation has barely begun...

more to kill them because the system needs an major overhaul, no arguments there along with quite alot of our useless self serving bureaucracy while were at it but once you get past reasonable doubt into absofuckinlutely guilty DNA/video/200 witnesses etc...

the endless appeals should stop. bullets are cheap, but honestly depending on the crime it should be painful..

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Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed.

[AndyMan 7]

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My view on the Death Penalty is that if you are found guilty and sentenced to death you get one appeal within 30 days. If your appeal is denied then you are put to death 30 days later. IMHO too much time and money is spent on appeals, briefs, etc.. I mean 9-12 years making appeals is why our judicial system is in total disarray. So much for the right to a speedy trial

Last year there were 12 people released from Illinois death row after DNA evidence found them not guilty. They all had been on death row for more then 10 years. The relevations disturbed the govener to the point where he commuted the death sentences of everyone on death row to life in prison - the risks of killing more innocent people were just too high. Given the circumstances here, I think he had little choice. Thank god Illinois didn't work on your system.

I have absolutely no doubt that all over America, innocent people are regularly put to death before we truth comes out.

__

You put the fun in "funnel" - craichead.

[Nightingale 0]

something else interesting:

philosophically, the governor of illinois is PRO death penalty. He just doesn't believe the US implements it correctly, and that there's too much of a chance of innocents being killed by state-sanctioned homicide.

[Luv2Fall 0]

Ahhhhhhhhhhhhh.......a voice of reason.

[sdgregory 0]

this breaks my heart..

[PhillyKev 0]

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you missed the part about 'proven'

You missed the part about people who have been 'proven' guilty being exhonerated later. If they're dead, how do you correct that error. At least if they were in prison, they could at least be let out.

The system has errors, mistakes are made. Why put a final, irreversible solution in place within a less than perfect system?

[Gravitymaster 0]

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Life term prison.

fuck that, it cost us more money to keep one such O2 thief in prison for a year than it did to send me

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to college for 4! once you've proven you've official resigned from the human race we should treat them like the sick animal they are and rid the world of them.. compassion should be reserved for those with compassion of their own...

sorry..game over thanks for playing, should have asked for a rules clarification.. try again once you’ve proven to the cosmos you can be trusted with such consciousness..

A 1982 study by the abolitionist New York State Defenders Association -- based on proposed (but never enacted) legislation to reinstate capital punishment in New York (Governor Mario Cuomo has vetoed death penalty legislation seven times in recent years -- speculated that a capital case involving only the first three levels of review (trial and penalty, appeal to the state Court of Appeals, and review by the U.S. Supreme Court) would cost $1.8 million per case, compared to the projected cost of imprisoning a felon for 40 years of $602,000. In another study, the Miami Herald calculated that it had cost Florida taxpayers $57.2 million to execute 18 men ($3.17 million each), whereas keeping a prisoner in jail for life (40 years) costs $515,964 ($12,899.91 per year). Abolitionists tend, we suspect, to exaggerate death-penalty costs while understating the expense of life imprisonment. According to the Justice Department, for instance, it costs around $20,000 a year to house a prisoner ($1 million over 40 years). Other sources peg it as high as $25,000.

[Zenister 0]

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you missed the part about 'proven'

You missed the part about people who have been 'proven' guilty being exhonerated later. If they're dead, how do you correct that error. At least if they were in prison, they could at least be let out.

The system has errors, mistakes are made. Why put a final, irreversible solution in place within a less than perfect system?

fix the system first, it will never be perfect but its can be magnitudes better, and i am not referring to 'iffy' convictions, i'm referring to cases were there is NO DOUBT, and yet we still continue to feed house a large number of these monsters, and at a better standard of living than many free people, for no good purpose whatsoever..

also you are still ridiculously applying a past failures as a 'standard' by way of argument, this is an invalid justification, what murder case now does NOT involve DNA evidence?

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A 1982 study by the abolitionist New York State Defenders Association -- based on proposed (but never enacted) legislation to reinstate capital punishment in New York (Governor Mario Cuomo has vetoed death penalty legislation seven times in recent years -- speculated that a capital case involving only the first three levels of review (trial and penalty, appeal to the state Court of Appeals, and review by the U.S. Supreme Court) would cost $1.8 million per case, compared to the projected cost of imprisoning a felon for 40 years of $602,000. In another study, the Miami Herald calculated that it had cost Florida taxpayers $57.2 million to execute 18 men ($3.17 million each), whereas keeping a prisoner in jail for life (40 years) costs $515,964 ($12,899.91 per year). Abolitionists tend, we suspect, to exaggerate death-penalty costs while understating the expense of life imprisonment. According to the Justice Department, for instance, it costs around $20,000 a year to house a prisoner ($1 million over 40 years). Other sources peg it as high as $25,000.

You do realize the first two steps they cite as costs would occur regardless of the sentence, and so rightly should be excluded from consideration as ‘expenses’ attached to the death penalty alone

What are the actual costs of an execution? Now compare that to the costs of long term imprisonment? Appeals are not part of those costs, of course there is more publicity (and therefore more money to be made) in fighting the higher profile death penalty cases….which simply indicates that many lawyers are more interested in money than justice and that the system still sorely needs to be reformed

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Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed.

[Gravitymaster 0]

Personally, I'm against the death penalty. However I think the system needs major reform. I believe life in prison should be just that. Life in prison. I also believe felons convicted of certain violent and particularly heinious crimes should get life at HARD LABOR. This should be done in as remote a location as possible. I believe DNA testing, when applicable, should be employed on every case where it could establish guilt or innocence. I believe a penal system whose focus is more on reform for non-violent offenders is necessary including drug rehab for those convicted of lesser drug crimes is necessary.

[PhillyKev 0]

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Personally, I'm against the death penalty. However I think the system needs major reform. I believe life in prison should be just that. Life in prison. I also believe felons convicted of certain violent and particularly heinious crimes should get life at HARD LABOR. This should be done in as remote a location as possible. I believe DNA testing, when applicable, should be employed on every case where it could establish guilt or innocence. I believe a penal system whose focus is more on reform for non-violent offenders is necessary including drug rehab for those convicted of lesser drug crimes is necessary.

Good post.....100% agreement.