JohnRich 4 #326 February 17, 2004 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuote Laws that try to tell you what two consenting adults can do with each other are unreasonable. Does that include spousal abuse? Be careful of the broad brush. I don't speak for billvon - he's quite capable of doing that himself. However, even though I didn't write that statement, I managed to notice that he said "consenting" adults. If both spouses consent to the behavior, then I don't think it can be considered "abuse". Several states have laws that state if there are visible signs of injury caused by a spouse the Police have no choice but to arrest. Consenting or not. I don't think there are many spouses out there who consent to being beaten to the point of injury. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,090 #327 February 17, 2004 >I don't think there are many spouses out there who consent to being >beaten to the point of injury. If both you and your spouse were taking a karate class, it would be illegal to spar with them? A stranger OK, but a wife/husband not OK? Odd. Another example of political correctness run amok. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,117 #328 February 17, 2004 QuoteMan...I really hate Bush...bla...bla...I don't really know why Stir the pot! Stir the pot! Record deficit Loss of jobs Plummeting dollar just for starters.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Luv2Fall 0 #329 February 17, 2004 Bill, I taught martial arts to both men and women up until eight years ago and not even I can correlate your remark with John's intent. Edited for grammer......... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #330 February 17, 2004 It's the point that even well meaning laws always come up against an exception to the rule any visible indication of damage by the spouse is grounds for arrest - even if a charge wasn't leveled by the damaged party consequences - spouses should avoid being sparring partners under this law, for example I trust our police can have some discretion in this, but then someone else would complain lesson - can't win, don't try ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,090 #331 February 17, 2004 >not even I can correlate your remark to John's intent. If you spar with your wife, and she incurs a visible injury (i.e. a bruise on her forearm) you could be arrested if the quote that appears in John's post is accurate. In John's terms, she "agreed to be beaten to the point of injury" by agreeing to spar with you; bruises are one possible result of fighting someone. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,090 #332 February 17, 2004 >lesson - can't win, don't try Or perhaps think about the consequences of laws _before_ passing them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #333 February 17, 2004 Quote>lesson - can't win, don't try Or perhaps think about the consequences of laws _before_ passing them. Lawmakers are not all knowing and can't anticipate all the consequences available to millions of humans in infinite combinations. Better to just keep the laws extremely simple if you can and deal with the exceptions on a case basis. If lawmakers think too long without passing knee jerk laws, then they miss out on all those votes they could have bought with passing the knee jerk law quickly. ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Luv2Fall 0 #334 February 17, 2004 Let me say this - then - I don't think he was referring to a sterile environment such as a dojo..........more in context with "abuse"? Student composite included law enforcement personnel....................never was there a problem given the nature of the training and environment........when, indeed, a woman was injured (very rare) or bruised which is most likely the case anyway - regardless if opponent was female, male, spouse or whomever. Personally - we're talking something a bit different here..................or in my opinion anyway. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
benny 0 #335 February 17, 2004 QuoteLet me say this - then - I don't think he was referring to a sterile environment such as a dojo So you're saying they can't agree to beat the sh#t out of each other in the comfort of their own home, and that they should have to pay for that pleasure? Never go to a DZ strip show. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Luv2Fall 0 #336 February 17, 2004 Yes - what plan would you like to enroll in? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
benny 0 #337 February 17, 2004 QuoteYes - what plan would you like to enroll in? If I want the crap beat out of me, I can always call my older brother, he was always happy to do it free of charge. If that fails, I'll join the military and they can pay me to get the crap beat out of me. Never go to a DZ strip show. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pajarito 0 #339 February 17, 2004 Hey, that sounds like one of my uncles. Do you know him? I'm from Alabama but live in Georgia now. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #340 February 17, 2004 Quotebla...bla...bla...it's Bill Clinton's fault...bla...bla...if it weren't for those Liberals...bla...bla...bla...Man...I really hate Clinton...bla...bla...I don't really know why....bla...I just really, really do...bla...bla...down with Democrats...bla...bla...gotta take our country back. "Make love, not jihad!" Stir the pot! Stir the pot! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkydiverRick 0 #341 February 17, 2004 QuoteI agree! Those conservatives are the most heartless, uneducated, knuckle draggin, redneck, Nascar loving, trailer living, Big Gulp cup collecting, Elvis's fine velvet merchandise buying, pickup drivin, toothless grinning, beer gut wearing, plumber crack-a-shinin gun toting people I've ever seen!!! Is that a bad thing? never pull low......unless you are Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkydiverRick 0 #342 February 17, 2004 QuoteQuoteYes - what plan would you like to enroll in? If I want the crap beat out of me, I can always call my older brother, he was always happy to do it free of charge. If that fails, I'll join the military and they can pay me to get the crap beat out of me. I like a guy with a plan. never pull low......unless you are Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pajarito 0 #343 February 17, 2004 I was just firing for effect. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Luv2Fall 0 #344 February 17, 2004 Do we have the same uncle? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Luv2Fall 0 #345 February 17, 2004 Not really lol. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pajarito 0 #346 February 17, 2004 Record deficit Loss of jobs Plummeting dollar Be realistic. We were in a recession before Bush. Got hit on 9-11 to further drive the economy down. Went to war. War is expensive. We're still in it. The general public has just forgotten. Most people don't care about anything if it doesn't affect them in their immediate future. Very short term memory. There's going to be a loss of jobs anyway. Do you think there hasn't been job creation. They don't talk about that on the news. You're just talking about a particular segment of the work force. Not as a whole. The dollar may have dropped but plummeting is a stonger term than I would have used. I don't think we're going to fold just yet. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,117 #347 February 17, 2004 QuoteRecord deficit Loss of jobs Plummeting dollar Be realistic. We were in a recession before Bush. Got hit on 9-11 to further drive the economy down. Went to war. War is expensive. We're still in it. The general public has just forgotten. Most people don't care about anything if it doesn't affect them in their immediate future. Very short term memory. There's going to be a loss of jobs anyway. Do you think there hasn't been job creation. They don't talk about that on the news. You're just talking about a particular segment of the work force. Not as a whole. The dollar may have dropped but plummeting is a stonger term than I would have used. I don't think we're going to fold just yet. Go check your data. In the President's Economic Report to the Nation, Feb. 2003, Bush predicted 1.7 million new jobs. What actually happened in 2003 was a loss of more than 50,000 jobs Now, if he's so smart, how come HE didn't know by 2003 what you know about the economy already going down? He made his prediction in 2003, not in 1998. Not only did he not meet his own goals, he was even wrong in the sign of the change. I'll tell you why. He's clueless!... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #348 February 17, 2004 Quote and the ACLU, those are some of the most hateful organizations we’ve got. If you think that about the ACLU then you do not really support and defend the constitution of these United States. They continually fight for many issues both left and right , and sometimes no matter how despicable the group, to preserve the freedoms we as Americans enjoy. But last time I checked they were not preaching racial purity or some of the other hate filled jingoistic writings of groups like the CCC, who actually have prominent Republicans speaking at their fund raisers. The CCC is for all intents and purposes an upscale group of the Klan with the same old tired message when you read their literature. QuoteThe left has people attacking others based on the fact that they’re driving SUV’s. I don’t discredit the Democrats on that basis. Also, don’t you think it might be a little ridiculous and completely out of line to compare GWB to Stalin or Adolph Hitler I would have to say that those groups are not democrats but anarchists. When they had the WTO here in Seattle a few years ago these Greenies and others came out in force. The great unwashed.. various people living or trying to relive the protest days of the 1960's and 1970's. But they don’t grab people and beat them based on their ethnicity or sexual preference or religion. There is a sickness in this society and groups like the CCC or Christian Identity Movement or any one of the myriad of hate groups that the Southern Poverty Law Center lists, foster an atmosphere of intolerance that lessens all of us as Americans. ON balance their listing is decidedly stacked against groups that claim family values and conservatism as a cover for their hatred of others. http://www.splcenter.org QuoteWhat did you expect us to do after 9-11 take the pacifist approach after they just killed several thousand Americans on our own soil? That’s exactly what the UN does. I’ve had to serve under UN control. Very reluctantly, I might add. During wartime, and we are at war, sacrifices must be made and not just by the soldiers fighting. It costs money which affects a myriad of other things including jobs. As far as comparing GWB to Stalin or Hitler... I said that his foreign policy is the most arrogant towards the rest of the world SINCE them. Our country was attacked by terrorists on 9/11. at that time the world was shocked and sympathetic towards us. We had a chance to build a consensus of the worlds nations against the terrorists and the nations that supported them. Had we followed a policy of going after the Taliban and Al Qaeda the vast majority of the world was willing to help us rid the planet of the fundamentalists and terrorists who seek to destabilize the world and return it to their world view of 7th century greatness. Instead we are fed bogus bullshit and kept in the dark like mushrooms. Instead of using our forces wisely and going after real enemies with support of all of the civilized nations of the world we went after a dictator who WE had built and supplied in our quest to punish the Iranians for their rejection of us and our policies in the 1970's and 1960's. A LOOONG string of people from the Regan Administration in the 1980's went to Iraq and we gave him the tools of war to further their war. In 1990 when our Ambassador stupidly gave him the idea we would do nothing with his Kuwait problem.. He invaded and lost in the subsequent war. HE lost and was contained. The weapons inspectors destroyed his WMD over the next few years. The UN was looking for the WMD and could not find any, but the Administration wanted a war and they now have one.. a very great squandering of our resources and now we are stuck with the consequences. But never forget.. our SHOCK AND AWE campaign has sent a real message to the rest of the world. The last time we did that with the atomic bombs in Japan, to send a message to Stalin, it did not quite achieve the results we had intended. It scared him into developing other weapons and causing a 40 year long war that cost the world millions of people. QuoteAs far as these other terrorist rogue countries and we pissing them off. WHO GIVES A SHIT? We’re limited on how much money we can spend and how many troops we can support but I say “Go get them.” I can say that because I’ve spent my time in Kosovo and Afghanistan on the front line. It still freakin’ pisses me off to see the video of 9-11. Don’t kid yourself into thinking that was an isolated incident. Other attacks are in planning. The country that supplies funds, drugs for funds, weapons, or people is also just as guilty as the country or organization that did the deed. Screw them!!! It’s not just about pissing off those rogue nations. It’s pissed off the countries we need as allies. WE need the help of all the countries of the world to fight the terrorists. Going to Afghanistan was the right thing to do at the time. Hell we need to go into the mountains of Pakistan. Our people know the area well since we used it so well to support the Muja's in their fight against the Soviets. The arrogance of pre-emption has sent a message to the world. The message is that we are to be feared. And when you have someone who doesn’t play well with others eventually that person will be ostracized. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkydiverRick 0 #349 February 17, 2004 The last time we did that with the atomic bombs in Japan, to send a message to Stalin, it did not quite achieve the results we had intended. Another miscalculation by a democrat. never pull low......unless you are Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
juanesky 0 #350 February 17, 2004 QuoteThe last time we did that with the atomic bombs in Japan, to send a message to Stalin, it did not quite achieve the results we had intended. Another miscalculation by a democrat. Well it is not miscalculation, perhaps some good history reading and searching is in order."According to some of the conservatives here, it sounds like it's fine to beat your wide - as long as she had it coming." -Billvon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Another miscalculation by a democrat.
Well it is not miscalculation, perhaps some good history reading and searching is in order.