happythoughts 0 #26 March 4, 2004 Quote Jump with people that feel the same way and whatever discipline you focus on will be satisfying. Exactly. I do some team stuff now and again. There is a conversation that I have at the start. "If you want to win, we will be serious and train, and we'll pick others with the same skill level. We'll go for medals." "If you want to play and train some new people, we'll put 7 experienced and 3 new people on. We'll get 3rd or 4th. " "What do you want to do?" Almost every year, our 10-way team picks 2 new people and puts them on the team. Some of them are now a boatload better than me. Somebody did it for me, I do it every year. However, everyone has to understand upfront that it's not for 1st place. I also get on some very serious stuff and do some training to improve. Improving my own skills is important. That is a separate event. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
colintri 0 #27 March 4, 2004 Don, I'm going to kick your butt if you fall low at DWR 2005 next year. J/K! or was I? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bch7773 0 #28 March 4, 2004 Quote Seriously, I think many people do FF because as low timers it is difficult to find a group to do RW with on a regular basis and FF can be done alone. I think thats one of the main reasons we see some of the newest skydivers start freeflying straight off of AFF. Its just that a solo belly skydive isn't as exciting as a solo sitfly. Thats why I enjoy jumping with relative low timers... you get to get them excited about doing some fun RW stuff. MB 3528, RB 1182 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kat1221 0 #29 March 4, 2004 So far I've done mostly RW jumps - I'd like to be competent at one before attempting the other. I can stay in a stable sit, but I'd much rather jump with lots of cool people than do solo or two-way sit flying. I'm sure someday I'll get more into freeflying, but right now I'm focused mostly on RW. CanuckInUSA - there is always tracking dives, so we can jump with our FF or RW friends! And yes, good freeflying does look amazing.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CanuckInUSA 0 #30 March 4, 2004 QuoteWhen I was first learning how to skydive, RW was all they had. Now I'm too old to learn how to Freefly. Besides, all the hot FFers at my DZ don't even talk to me Well there you went and blew it for me. I'm obviously not one of the hot freefliers. Try not to worry about the things you have no control over Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CanuckInUSA 0 #31 March 4, 2004 QuoteSome of the same social conflicts are developing. Experienced people want to jump with their experienced friends in order to do more challenging stuff. This may exclude newbies. Be careful, give back to the sport. Yes you are very right here. Try not to worry about the things you have no control over Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CanuckInUSA 0 #32 March 4, 2004 QuoteAt ~100 freefly jumps, I was always "the base." People would fly to me. I get really fed up with that. I even snapped at people for that. Initially I'm of the opinion that it's best to let the newbies be base. But at some point, it's good to set them free so that they learn that "if you want to be in the dive, you do what you need to do to be in the dive". I will continue to mix this up, but a couple of weekends ago while about to do a 4-way FF with three lesser experienced folks, I volunteered to be the base (heck I was the only camera) and made it know to the others that they needed to come to me. It was a fun jump. Try not to worry about the things you have no control over Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CanuckInUSA 0 #33 March 4, 2004 QuoteCanuckInUSA - there is always tracking dives, so we can jump with our FF or RW friends! And yes, good freeflying does look amazing... That's one of the reasons why those Eloy Holiday Boogie tracking dives were so fun. I got to jump with people I otherwise likely wouldn't have jumped with. Hope things are well in AB. I've exchanged a few emails with Kaye and she's been quite the adventurous soul since the New Year. When will you guys start jumping again? Try not to worry about the things you have no control over Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flyangel2 2 #34 March 4, 2004 QuoteI'm obviously not one of the hot freefliers. I wondered how long it would take you to see that. FYI anyone reading this, Steve has offered to take me up on a number of FF jumps, I'm just to scared. But he is one that I would trust to teach me the right way to do things. That's another good point, some of the FF and RW people just go up and learn from people that have the same low experience as they do, thus learning either bad habits or unsafe habits. Doesn't matter if you are learning FF or RW, sit down and talk to someone that knows what it's about and listen to them.May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view. May your mountains rise into and above the clouds. - Edward Abbey Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
weegegirl 2 #35 March 4, 2004 my goal is to be able to fly on every axis of my body. currently, my focus is on vertical flight, specifically ¥ head down ¥. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
airdweller 0 #36 March 4, 2004 I like your answer------------------------------------------------------ "From the mightiest pharaoh to the lowliest peasant, who doesn't enjoy a good sit?" C. Montgomery Burns Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kat1221 0 #37 March 4, 2004 We were jumping last weekend - bad spot, and a couple of us landed off... I was in waist deep snow! (Which really isn't as impressive, when you consider how short I am ) Weather is good, and we are jumping any weekend its above -10 celcius... I think its around 7-10 F, but not sure... Been in touch w/ Kyla too... I'm so jealous! She's coming home later this month, can't wait to see her. Keeping this on topic - yeah, the tracking dives in Eloy rocked... and we can still do hybrids, and cross country sunset loads. So there are lots of ways FF and RW people can jump together, and of course beer brings everyone together. I don't really think it matters what a person does... but some guys do look hot in FF jumpsuits Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zenister 0 #38 March 4, 2004 QuoteThere are so many things that freefliers don't get to do that RW'ers do.. like back in's, mirror pieces, 15 point skydives Lets see, 2 point 28 way, lots of 15+ ways, 4 point 3 way sit from 8500 last weekend.. yeah, the 28 way was way harder then that sit fly was. Even freefliers are now getting into the points and preset formations so look for a change in thinking for serious freefliers here soon too. Lots of freefliers are already doing complete dirt dives and debriefs for things larger then 4 ways, who does that sound like? hmm i seem to remember watching (with my jaw on the floor!) a simply stunning 19 point (was 20 but the camera guy was too close!!) FF dive during the money meet and oh yea the intermediate class was simply torched by a highly experienced RW type with a fairly low number of FF jumps.. there are advantages to both, and everyone should learn both and switch it up sometimes... honestly i need to break out 'my' I dont think its really 'mine' till i have more jumps than it, if then.. RW suit and play on my belly..i'm current on my FF (althought not quite back to where i was before) but havent really done anything other than a few 'low altitude' cessna 4 way launchs on my belly recently ____________________________________ Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
happythoughts 0 #39 March 4, 2004 QuoteWeather is good, and we are jumping any weekend its above -10 celcius... I think its around 7-10 F <- what I looked like this weekend with a slightly sunburnt nose. If people ask around, they will find that a lot of the FFers with large jump numbers also have a bunch of RW jumps. Last weekend, some of the FFers were jumping on the big-ways with the RW people. A good time was had by all. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Jumpmunki 0 #40 March 4, 2004 the main reason i changed to freeflying is because i get alot of stress at work, the RW / FS jumps i've done i'd say 80% were highpressure MUST achive this or you've failed... i achieved my FS1 then started to freefly, yeah i'm shit but the people i've met are MUCH more open armed and relaxed, yeah if your dangerous theres something said .. but just coz you stayed in a ball all the way down to keep up doesn't mean that you dodn't achieve your aim, the aim is to have fun it only gets serious when your at competition level where as all the FS i've done has been "funish" yet never been a laugh.... my take on it anyways... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Vertifly 0 #41 March 4, 2004 QuoteMy question is how many of you fre-flyer only people actually have done any successful RW dives? I'm sorry. What is it, exactly, that constitutes a successful RW dive again? I always thought that a successful skydive was exiting a plane and walking away uninjured. And whatever happens in-between was ALL-GOOD. For me, there isn't a choice really. My way of enjoying freefall or expressing my abilities on a jump was doing whatever I felt; as long as I was in control and safe to the other jumpers on the dive. RW, being that it fits into this category, is a way of freeflying. This is why I think that 3D dives are soooo cool. However, vice-versa, we'll never be able to say that. I'm not trying to propogate this opinion upon anyone. You asked, so I will say that this is my own perspective; which, it turn, allows me to be a better freeflyer. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites dropoutdave 0 #42 March 4, 2004 The thing with FF also is that it has much more potential for the individual/group to be creative than RW. ------------------------------------------------------ May Contain Nut traces...... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Zenister 0 #43 March 4, 2004 very true... most RW people blow a gasket when you throw an unplanned back flip or carve around the formation before docking ____________________________________ Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites TribalTalon 0 #44 March 5, 2004 to me, i'm not worried about pissing the other rw guys off. i know that they know i'm a noobie and am most likely gonna suck anyway. I'm just the type of person that has a very hard time dealing with failure. with rw, you are either IN the slot, or you are OUT. one or the other. with freeflying, there's no such IN or OUT unless you are really horrible and go back sliding about 5 miles away. but anyway i feel that with freeflying the criteria for a sucessful jump are much more flexible and easier to accomplish, especially for a fledging skydiver such as myself. However, this weekend i will be doing mostly belly flying as today i got my RW suit in!! HOORAY! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites sdgregory 0 #45 March 5, 2004 Wow! I posted this on my lunch break and just now got back to it! I agree that skydiving is about fun and that you should do what you find fun. I know that there are many divers out there in every disciplin (sp?) that just do not want to jump with newbies because they want their dive to go perfect. I have jumped with one or two. But I have jumped with quite a few (Phreezone for one) who love the sport and want very much to help hungry new jumpers. I like freefly, honestly I love it. My post was started because I see so many new jumpers go right into free fly and they seem to be ani-RW. I wondered why. Because I have 11 RW jumps of my last 16 jumps (the previous 24 were AFF and coach jumps) . Only one was perfectly successful (the one I mentioned). Mostly we had (or I in some cases) a terrible time just hooking up. But no matter how bad it went off plan, every jump was fun. And the jumps that were partially successful were loads of fun. We hit the ground and got excited about what went right and only mentioned what went wrong. I guess feel that too many go to freefly because they think it is cooler than RW without giving RW a chance and I think they miss out on something spectacular. I have the same attitude with skydiving that I had with motorcycles. I ride Harleys and choppers, but as long as you are on two wheels you are cool in my book. Right now I RW, but as long as you are in the sky, you are cool in my book, even if we disagree on other things(politics, faith, etc.) It is all about the sky and what we do that 99 percent of the world will never do. But I will say, if you don't RW, your just faking it! Bwahahahaaaaa Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kallend 2,148 #46 March 5, 2004 Just thought I'd mention here that Rook Nelson, 4 times World Champion freeflier, has a Nationals RW gold medal and was on the world record 246 way too (1998), exiting as last diver from his plane. And anyone that hasn't tried 10-way speed RW (no points turned, just an all out sprint to the formation) doesn't know what fun they're missing.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Kat1221 0 #47 March 5, 2004 Quoteto me, i'm not worried about pissing the other rw guys off. Quote Aww... you should have done some RW with me when I was down. I never get pissed off - if you go low or something, I'm just glad it wasn't me! Most people are like that - all jumps are fun, regardless of if you screw up or not! Competition of course is different... However, this weekend i will be doing mostly belly flying as today i got my RW suit in!! HOORAY! Congratulations! Oh yeah - I think you owe beer SDH is a great place to learn RW - there are lots of cool people who probably wouldn't mind helping you, and jumping with you. Have fun and funnel an exit for me! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites PlayDough 0 #48 March 5, 2004 QuoteQuote Some of the same social conflicts are developing. Experienced people want to jump with their experienced friends in order to do more challenging stuff. This may exclude newbies. Be careful, give back to the sport. My dropzone is quite good at giving back. Since I've been flying... I've gotten a great deal of support and feedback for little to no cost. I have felt the difficulties still of trying to learn and find people for which to jump with. This is great advice!!! Also those of us who are still new and learning... don't forget to give back to those that have helped us too. Signing up for courses, and coaching is a great way to do so... and is benificial to you and the friends that have been there teaching you all along. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mrhoop 0 #49 March 5, 2004 At least get proficient at "belly to earth" flying skills before you start learning to freefly. RW is much more than falling "belly to earth". I would pick one and stick with one for awhile. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites flyhi 24 #50 March 5, 2004 Most of the hybrid "attempts" I've been on which ended up not completing occurred because the FF's couldn't get in, or if they did, they backslid out as soon as they attempted to transition. I also remember a FF who wanted to get into a video with a friend doing a tandem. Never made it. Went low and never got back. Not learning even a little RW could limit your options down the road.Shit happens. And it usually happens because of physics. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 Next Page 2 of 3 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0 Go To Topic Listing
Jumpmunki 0 #40 March 4, 2004 the main reason i changed to freeflying is because i get alot of stress at work, the RW / FS jumps i've done i'd say 80% were highpressure MUST achive this or you've failed... i achieved my FS1 then started to freefly, yeah i'm shit but the people i've met are MUCH more open armed and relaxed, yeah if your dangerous theres something said .. but just coz you stayed in a ball all the way down to keep up doesn't mean that you dodn't achieve your aim, the aim is to have fun it only gets serious when your at competition level where as all the FS i've done has been "funish" yet never been a laugh.... my take on it anyways... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vertifly 0 #41 March 4, 2004 QuoteMy question is how many of you fre-flyer only people actually have done any successful RW dives? I'm sorry. What is it, exactly, that constitutes a successful RW dive again? I always thought that a successful skydive was exiting a plane and walking away uninjured. And whatever happens in-between was ALL-GOOD. For me, there isn't a choice really. My way of enjoying freefall or expressing my abilities on a jump was doing whatever I felt; as long as I was in control and safe to the other jumpers on the dive. RW, being that it fits into this category, is a way of freeflying. This is why I think that 3D dives are soooo cool. However, vice-versa, we'll never be able to say that. I'm not trying to propogate this opinion upon anyone. You asked, so I will say that this is my own perspective; which, it turn, allows me to be a better freeflyer. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dropoutdave 0 #42 March 4, 2004 The thing with FF also is that it has much more potential for the individual/group to be creative than RW. ------------------------------------------------------ May Contain Nut traces...... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zenister 0 #43 March 4, 2004 very true... most RW people blow a gasket when you throw an unplanned back flip or carve around the formation before docking ____________________________________ Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TribalTalon 0 #44 March 5, 2004 to me, i'm not worried about pissing the other rw guys off. i know that they know i'm a noobie and am most likely gonna suck anyway. I'm just the type of person that has a very hard time dealing with failure. with rw, you are either IN the slot, or you are OUT. one or the other. with freeflying, there's no such IN or OUT unless you are really horrible and go back sliding about 5 miles away. but anyway i feel that with freeflying the criteria for a sucessful jump are much more flexible and easier to accomplish, especially for a fledging skydiver such as myself. However, this weekend i will be doing mostly belly flying as today i got my RW suit in!! HOORAY! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sdgregory 0 #45 March 5, 2004 Wow! I posted this on my lunch break and just now got back to it! I agree that skydiving is about fun and that you should do what you find fun. I know that there are many divers out there in every disciplin (sp?) that just do not want to jump with newbies because they want their dive to go perfect. I have jumped with one or two. But I have jumped with quite a few (Phreezone for one) who love the sport and want very much to help hungry new jumpers. I like freefly, honestly I love it. My post was started because I see so many new jumpers go right into free fly and they seem to be ani-RW. I wondered why. Because I have 11 RW jumps of my last 16 jumps (the previous 24 were AFF and coach jumps) . Only one was perfectly successful (the one I mentioned). Mostly we had (or I in some cases) a terrible time just hooking up. But no matter how bad it went off plan, every jump was fun. And the jumps that were partially successful were loads of fun. We hit the ground and got excited about what went right and only mentioned what went wrong. I guess feel that too many go to freefly because they think it is cooler than RW without giving RW a chance and I think they miss out on something spectacular. I have the same attitude with skydiving that I had with motorcycles. I ride Harleys and choppers, but as long as you are on two wheels you are cool in my book. Right now I RW, but as long as you are in the sky, you are cool in my book, even if we disagree on other things(politics, faith, etc.) It is all about the sky and what we do that 99 percent of the world will never do. But I will say, if you don't RW, your just faking it! Bwahahahaaaaa Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,148 #46 March 5, 2004 Just thought I'd mention here that Rook Nelson, 4 times World Champion freeflier, has a Nationals RW gold medal and was on the world record 246 way too (1998), exiting as last diver from his plane. And anyone that hasn't tried 10-way speed RW (no points turned, just an all out sprint to the formation) doesn't know what fun they're missing.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kat1221 0 #47 March 5, 2004 Quoteto me, i'm not worried about pissing the other rw guys off. Quote Aww... you should have done some RW with me when I was down. I never get pissed off - if you go low or something, I'm just glad it wasn't me! Most people are like that - all jumps are fun, regardless of if you screw up or not! Competition of course is different... However, this weekend i will be doing mostly belly flying as today i got my RW suit in!! HOORAY! Congratulations! Oh yeah - I think you owe beer SDH is a great place to learn RW - there are lots of cool people who probably wouldn't mind helping you, and jumping with you. Have fun and funnel an exit for me! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites PlayDough 0 #48 March 5, 2004 QuoteQuote Some of the same social conflicts are developing. Experienced people want to jump with their experienced friends in order to do more challenging stuff. This may exclude newbies. Be careful, give back to the sport. My dropzone is quite good at giving back. Since I've been flying... I've gotten a great deal of support and feedback for little to no cost. I have felt the difficulties still of trying to learn and find people for which to jump with. This is great advice!!! Also those of us who are still new and learning... don't forget to give back to those that have helped us too. Signing up for courses, and coaching is a great way to do so... and is benificial to you and the friends that have been there teaching you all along. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mrhoop 0 #49 March 5, 2004 At least get proficient at "belly to earth" flying skills before you start learning to freefly. RW is much more than falling "belly to earth". I would pick one and stick with one for awhile. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites flyhi 24 #50 March 5, 2004 Most of the hybrid "attempts" I've been on which ended up not completing occurred because the FF's couldn't get in, or if they did, they backslid out as soon as they attempted to transition. I also remember a FF who wanted to get into a video with a friend doing a tandem. Never made it. Went low and never got back. Not learning even a little RW could limit your options down the road.Shit happens. And it usually happens because of physics. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 Next Page 2 of 3 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0
PlayDough 0 #48 March 5, 2004 QuoteQuote Some of the same social conflicts are developing. Experienced people want to jump with their experienced friends in order to do more challenging stuff. This may exclude newbies. Be careful, give back to the sport. My dropzone is quite good at giving back. Since I've been flying... I've gotten a great deal of support and feedback for little to no cost. I have felt the difficulties still of trying to learn and find people for which to jump with. This is great advice!!! Also those of us who are still new and learning... don't forget to give back to those that have helped us too. Signing up for courses, and coaching is a great way to do so... and is benificial to you and the friends that have been there teaching you all along. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrhoop 0 #49 March 5, 2004 At least get proficient at "belly to earth" flying skills before you start learning to freefly. RW is much more than falling "belly to earth". I would pick one and stick with one for awhile. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flyhi 24 #50 March 5, 2004 Most of the hybrid "attempts" I've been on which ended up not completing occurred because the FF's couldn't get in, or if they did, they backslid out as soon as they attempted to transition. I also remember a FF who wanted to get into a video with a friend doing a tandem. Never made it. Went low and never got back. Not learning even a little RW could limit your options down the road.Shit happens. And it usually happens because of physics. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
