Unstable 9 #126 March 3, 2004 Bumpity Bump bump bump..... Amazing video - I like the Editing too, congrats on saving your own lives to the both of you....=========Shaun ========== Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skydivexxl 0 #127 March 3, 2004 QuoteQuoteI'm thinking of something green, smelly, fat, lazy, slow and ugly - what can it be, what can it be.... Anybody says Turtle and it's gonna be LIGHTS OUT! [GREEN]T U R T L E ! ! ! ! ! ! Blog Clicky Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #128 March 3, 2004 OK...I finally got to watch it. Since you guys are OK I can laugh hysterically. The "Oh FUCK!" from Brit and the "SHIIT!!!" from Hookitt were simultaneous I'm sure. Nice video! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ifics 0 #129 March 3, 2004 Once again I will say that I am glad you both are ok and we can laugh at the video!! and it was good to meet you Tim.. See ya when I see ya Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ACMESkydiver 0 #130 March 3, 2004 QuoteQuoteI'm thinking of something green, smelly, fat, lazy, slow and ugly - what can it be, what can it be.... Anybody says Turtle and it's gonna be LIGHTS OUT! BWAHAHAHAHAAAA!!!!!! It's too easy, I'm wellll out of reach now.....TURTLE!!!! Yeah slow....everyone knows the tortise beat the hare....oh shit, wait a minute...~Jaye Do not believe that possibly you can escape the reward of your action. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites faulknerwn 38 #131 March 3, 2004 Wow. I'm glad you two are alive but geez..... I've gotta ask - how many CRW jumps on real CRW canopies do you have? I'm not talking about throwing a 2-stack together after freefall, but true actual CRW jumps? From the video, it looks like you weren't controlling your canopy when you snagged her. I mean - if I'm catching someone - doesn't matter the speeds or what type of canopy - if I catch with one line I'm always weight-shifting in my harness to keep myself flying straight as well as being extremely aware on the toggles. From the video, it looked like you were flying on the verge of a stall anyway, and when you grabbed her you didn't weight-shift and with a radical canopy like what you were jumping, its instantly bad. That's why I was wondering how many real CRW jumps on real CRW canopies you have. That's one of the first things I teach my students is always keep your canopy flying straight when accepting a dock - that awareness of what your canopy is doing before it does it is important for any CRW pilot - even more so for this kind of CRW. But that needs to become so ingrained in you up high on docile canopies. Making that kind of mistake on radical ones down low will likely kill you. Yowsa. I'm glad you're still alive. Wen Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites skydivegirl 0 #132 March 3, 2004 Hey Brittany, it looks like you had some problems getting your reserve toggles unstowed. What was going on there? I'm assuming you finally got them... I'm glad you two are ok.Pink Mafia Sis #26 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites DShiznit 0 #133 March 3, 2004 Holy Shit!!! Glad you two are alright. Quick thinking. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Aviatrr 0 #134 March 3, 2004 I couldn't tell for sure by the videos....but did either of you have your slider secured to your rig in any way(such as a velcro strip no your rig)? It looks like Brit's is just collapsed and not stowed...but I'm unable to tell for sure...and there's no view of yours in the video at all...was it stowed? If so, what do you use to retain the slider and any problems when you chopped? Mike Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites brits17 0 #135 March 3, 2004 Yeah, not a prob, the velcro over the guide rings and securing the excess lower control lines was snug (but thats not a bad thing ) _______________________ aerialkinetics.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites relyon 0 #136 March 3, 2004 This incident shows exactly why I don't do offset CRW with high aspect ratio and/or elliptical canopies at any wingloading (I don't really like to do any sort of CRW with these canopies, but stack docks can be managed depending on who's flying). Regardless of how it happens, an end cell collapse while docked/docking is almost guaranteed to produce a wrap that happens in a split second. That and microline can produce some very nasty results. Rule of thumb: if the canopy has a reputation for line twist spinning malfunction cutaways do NOT attempt offset CRW with it. Congrats to you both for performing the correct emergency procedures in a timely fashion. It could have been much worse. Bob Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites TribalTalon 0 #137 March 3, 2004 btw the song in the video is a remix by Fat boy slim of Wipe-Out by the beach boys. Jammin' song, fo sho its kinda cool how the song starts off and goes WIPE OUT!!! when they first hit each other. hehe Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites hookitt 1 #138 March 3, 2004 Looks like there are a a few questions to answer. Both of our sliders were simply collapsed and pulled down the risers. The slider was not a problem at all. That pesky parachute I was tangled in was though. To exacerbate the problem, I had failed to recognize that my own main began to fly soon after Brit cutaway. I scrambled to get clear of the lines but a few lines were still under my right arm. The cutaway handle was pulled while my hand was grasping the reserve handle. As I fell away from my own main, my right arm pulled the canopy along with me. You gotta look close to see that on the video. My right arm was pointed toward the sky to allow the canopy to slide off. My left hand fired off the reserve before I was clear of the mess. You can see the exact moment the pilot chute was launched. To address Wendy's (faulknerwn) post: Thanks for taking time to post on this thread. The real reason we posted the pictures and video were to show anybody who would like to know, how radical something can become. It was a major blunder but we got away with it. Neither one of us took it lightly. Every thing you said in your post is something I'm aware of. The real cause of the wrap was complacency on my part. I've always tried to be on top of my actions by paying attention, listening to self reason and common sense and my peers ---------WELLLLLLLL=====>>> that was kinda tossed out the window. I wasn't actually going for a dock and wasn't attempting to grab her parachute. My feet came out in front of me to attempt to just sit on the parachute and roll off the side. We were flying too slowly but rather than aborting contact, I decided to lightly walk on the left side of the canopy. You can see how well that went. My parachute had zero range remaining, so I simply sunk down into her lines to watch the right side of her canopy, fly around and engulf the dumbfounded man in black... and red.. with a hint of neon yellow. Several mistakes before and after the wrap were made. We really are aware of what happened and I'm personally aware of the fact I dropped the ball and was complacent. We got away with it and wanted to share in hopes it makes a difference. relyon: thanks for piping in. I hope every one understands I really wasn't going for offset CRW or any real docking efforts. It was a plain and simple screw up. Now believe me, I'll absorb all the words you real CRW dawgs have to say. I certainly appreciate it. I'll be hearing about it when I get back to My home DZ this weekend. Any way I hope this explains the mess a little better.My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites bodypilot90 0 #139 March 3, 2004 QuoteOk. finally watched it. WOW!! That was incredible that you guys both escaped that mess. I really liked the video itself too... definitely worth the wait. some guys will do anything to get hooked up with a girl that skydives....but she got away loved the video...glad you two are ok crw skies Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites raftman 12 #140 March 3, 2004 "Hey Ya'll, hold my beer and watch this!" WOW! Looks like you 2 are lucky to be alive! Scary at any alt. especially that low. The dogs at our DZ have crew camps sometimes and talk about this kind of stuff, interesting and informative. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites relyon 0 #141 March 3, 2004 QuoteI hope every one understands I really wasn't going for offset CRW or any real docking efforts. It was a plain and simple screw up. I'd assumed that based on what I thought I was seeing in the video. My bad. I've seen a number of photos in Parachutist and elsewhere depicting CRW using high performance canopies. While it can be done, there is considerable additional risk involved and the results of things going wrong can get very bad very quickly as this video shows. Thanks for setting things straight. Bob Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Zennie 0 #142 March 3, 2004 Really good job editing guys! You should have included some of the clips of Hookitt trying to fish his canopy out of that tree. LOL - Z "Always be yourself... unless you suck." - Joss Whedon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Zennie 0 #143 March 3, 2004 Oh and the other thing y'all don't see is about 5 seconds after Hookitt gets under his reserve, Ramon comes swooping in and grabs the freebag with his feet. It was a beautiful save. - Z "Always be yourself... unless you suck." - Joss Whedon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites TribalTalon 0 #144 March 3, 2004 BTW Tarek Maalouf (sp) was the one who edited the video, he owns Flying Arab productions www.flyingarab.com he ROCKS at making and editing vids. (shameless plug) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites relyon 0 #145 March 4, 2004 I've done a more complete read of this thread and have a few more observations to add: Quotethe top may just have to slide off the jetissoned canopy off him and just land his/her main normally. Possibly, but only if the cutaway main clears itself from the wrapped jumper pretty much right away. It often does, but plenty of times the wrapped jumper is best cutting away too even though they have a functioning main. The danger is the cutaway main reinflating while they're trying to get it off. I've seen a number double cutaways of this nature and been in two myself. QuoteKnowing what I know now, I would be able to evaluate and determine that my parachute began to fly again. I think that I could have completely removed her canopy from my person and land the main. ThCan't be sure though. I obviously wasn't the one in your predicment, but based on what I saw in the videos, I wouldn't rush to this conclusion. If you had tried this and Brit's canopy had snagged on your arm, leg, and/or head (camera!) and then reinflated, it would have been real ugly. The resulting downplane could have been nearly impossible to clear and may well have killed you. A good friend of mine nearly bought it this way. The trailing cutaway main that was wrapped around his ankle deflated just enough at treetop height to allow his main enough control for a crash and burn landing. He was very lucky to walk away with just scrapes and bruises. (Both canopies were Lightning 176s, not HP.) QuoteEnsured that I fell away from the mess then pulled the reserve. Good plan, and really the only thing I'd have done differently had it been me. Remember that connected RSL's are very much a disadvantage in this situation. Bob Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites hookitt 1 #146 March 4, 2004 Thanks Bob... that was a good write up.My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites riddler 0 #147 March 4, 2004 QuoteThe "Oh FUCK!" from Brit and the "SHIIT!!!" from Hookitt were simultaneous I'm sure. Exactly what I was thinking Good video guys, and I like how quickly you both reacted. I hope if that ever comes up for me that I'll react as quickly with the correct procedure.Trapped on the surface of a sphere. XKCD Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ChasingBlueSky 0 #148 March 4, 2004 Quotebtw the song in the video is a remix by Fat boy slim of Wipe-Out by the beach boys. Jammin' song, fo sho its kinda cool how the song starts off and goes WIPE OUT!!! when they first hit each other. hehe I thought it was the remake from the late 80s by a group called "The Fat Boys"_________________________________________ you can burn the land and boil the sea, but you can't take the sky from me.... I WILL fly again..... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SuZQflies 0 #149 March 4, 2004 Quote You're sorta correct We (my brother and I) have a tendency toward radical behavior. As far as the wrap, that was just me being stupid. Tim-may!! You soooo do NOT have permission to do that again!! I'm glad you can dissect this and LOL... Thank God you're Ok Q ________________________________________________ Dr. "Q" PMS#151Shugah,Shugah,How'd Ya Git So Fly? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ACMESkydiver 0 #130 March 3, 2004 QuoteQuoteI'm thinking of something green, smelly, fat, lazy, slow and ugly - what can it be, what can it be.... Anybody says Turtle and it's gonna be LIGHTS OUT! BWAHAHAHAHAAAA!!!!!! It's too easy, I'm wellll out of reach now.....TURTLE!!!! Yeah slow....everyone knows the tortise beat the hare....oh shit, wait a minute...~Jaye Do not believe that possibly you can escape the reward of your action. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
faulknerwn 38 #131 March 3, 2004 Wow. I'm glad you two are alive but geez..... I've gotta ask - how many CRW jumps on real CRW canopies do you have? I'm not talking about throwing a 2-stack together after freefall, but true actual CRW jumps? From the video, it looks like you weren't controlling your canopy when you snagged her. I mean - if I'm catching someone - doesn't matter the speeds or what type of canopy - if I catch with one line I'm always weight-shifting in my harness to keep myself flying straight as well as being extremely aware on the toggles. From the video, it looked like you were flying on the verge of a stall anyway, and when you grabbed her you didn't weight-shift and with a radical canopy like what you were jumping, its instantly bad. That's why I was wondering how many real CRW jumps on real CRW canopies you have. That's one of the first things I teach my students is always keep your canopy flying straight when accepting a dock - that awareness of what your canopy is doing before it does it is important for any CRW pilot - even more so for this kind of CRW. But that needs to become so ingrained in you up high on docile canopies. Making that kind of mistake on radical ones down low will likely kill you. Yowsa. I'm glad you're still alive. Wen Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skydivegirl 0 #132 March 3, 2004 Hey Brittany, it looks like you had some problems getting your reserve toggles unstowed. What was going on there? I'm assuming you finally got them... I'm glad you two are ok.Pink Mafia Sis #26 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DShiznit 0 #133 March 3, 2004 Holy Shit!!! Glad you two are alright. Quick thinking. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Aviatrr 0 #134 March 3, 2004 I couldn't tell for sure by the videos....but did either of you have your slider secured to your rig in any way(such as a velcro strip no your rig)? It looks like Brit's is just collapsed and not stowed...but I'm unable to tell for sure...and there's no view of yours in the video at all...was it stowed? If so, what do you use to retain the slider and any problems when you chopped? Mike Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
brits17 0 #135 March 3, 2004 Yeah, not a prob, the velcro over the guide rings and securing the excess lower control lines was snug (but thats not a bad thing ) _______________________ aerialkinetics.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
relyon 0 #136 March 3, 2004 This incident shows exactly why I don't do offset CRW with high aspect ratio and/or elliptical canopies at any wingloading (I don't really like to do any sort of CRW with these canopies, but stack docks can be managed depending on who's flying). Regardless of how it happens, an end cell collapse while docked/docking is almost guaranteed to produce a wrap that happens in a split second. That and microline can produce some very nasty results. Rule of thumb: if the canopy has a reputation for line twist spinning malfunction cutaways do NOT attempt offset CRW with it. Congrats to you both for performing the correct emergency procedures in a timely fashion. It could have been much worse. Bob Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TribalTalon 0 #137 March 3, 2004 btw the song in the video is a remix by Fat boy slim of Wipe-Out by the beach boys. Jammin' song, fo sho its kinda cool how the song starts off and goes WIPE OUT!!! when they first hit each other. hehe Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hookitt 1 #138 March 3, 2004 Looks like there are a a few questions to answer. Both of our sliders were simply collapsed and pulled down the risers. The slider was not a problem at all. That pesky parachute I was tangled in was though. To exacerbate the problem, I had failed to recognize that my own main began to fly soon after Brit cutaway. I scrambled to get clear of the lines but a few lines were still under my right arm. The cutaway handle was pulled while my hand was grasping the reserve handle. As I fell away from my own main, my right arm pulled the canopy along with me. You gotta look close to see that on the video. My right arm was pointed toward the sky to allow the canopy to slide off. My left hand fired off the reserve before I was clear of the mess. You can see the exact moment the pilot chute was launched. To address Wendy's (faulknerwn) post: Thanks for taking time to post on this thread. The real reason we posted the pictures and video were to show anybody who would like to know, how radical something can become. It was a major blunder but we got away with it. Neither one of us took it lightly. Every thing you said in your post is something I'm aware of. The real cause of the wrap was complacency on my part. I've always tried to be on top of my actions by paying attention, listening to self reason and common sense and my peers ---------WELLLLLLLL=====>>> that was kinda tossed out the window. I wasn't actually going for a dock and wasn't attempting to grab her parachute. My feet came out in front of me to attempt to just sit on the parachute and roll off the side. We were flying too slowly but rather than aborting contact, I decided to lightly walk on the left side of the canopy. You can see how well that went. My parachute had zero range remaining, so I simply sunk down into her lines to watch the right side of her canopy, fly around and engulf the dumbfounded man in black... and red.. with a hint of neon yellow. Several mistakes before and after the wrap were made. We really are aware of what happened and I'm personally aware of the fact I dropped the ball and was complacent. We got away with it and wanted to share in hopes it makes a difference. relyon: thanks for piping in. I hope every one understands I really wasn't going for offset CRW or any real docking efforts. It was a plain and simple screw up. Now believe me, I'll absorb all the words you real CRW dawgs have to say. I certainly appreciate it. I'll be hearing about it when I get back to My home DZ this weekend. Any way I hope this explains the mess a little better.My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bodypilot90 0 #139 March 3, 2004 QuoteOk. finally watched it. WOW!! That was incredible that you guys both escaped that mess. I really liked the video itself too... definitely worth the wait. some guys will do anything to get hooked up with a girl that skydives....but she got away loved the video...glad you two are ok crw skies Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
raftman 12 #140 March 3, 2004 "Hey Ya'll, hold my beer and watch this!" WOW! Looks like you 2 are lucky to be alive! Scary at any alt. especially that low. The dogs at our DZ have crew camps sometimes and talk about this kind of stuff, interesting and informative. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
relyon 0 #141 March 3, 2004 QuoteI hope every one understands I really wasn't going for offset CRW or any real docking efforts. It was a plain and simple screw up. I'd assumed that based on what I thought I was seeing in the video. My bad. I've seen a number of photos in Parachutist and elsewhere depicting CRW using high performance canopies. While it can be done, there is considerable additional risk involved and the results of things going wrong can get very bad very quickly as this video shows. Thanks for setting things straight. Bob Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zennie 0 #142 March 3, 2004 Really good job editing guys! You should have included some of the clips of Hookitt trying to fish his canopy out of that tree. LOL - Z "Always be yourself... unless you suck." - Joss Whedon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zennie 0 #143 March 3, 2004 Oh and the other thing y'all don't see is about 5 seconds after Hookitt gets under his reserve, Ramon comes swooping in and grabs the freebag with his feet. It was a beautiful save. - Z "Always be yourself... unless you suck." - Joss Whedon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TribalTalon 0 #144 March 3, 2004 BTW Tarek Maalouf (sp) was the one who edited the video, he owns Flying Arab productions www.flyingarab.com he ROCKS at making and editing vids. (shameless plug) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
relyon 0 #145 March 4, 2004 I've done a more complete read of this thread and have a few more observations to add: Quotethe top may just have to slide off the jetissoned canopy off him and just land his/her main normally. Possibly, but only if the cutaway main clears itself from the wrapped jumper pretty much right away. It often does, but plenty of times the wrapped jumper is best cutting away too even though they have a functioning main. The danger is the cutaway main reinflating while they're trying to get it off. I've seen a number double cutaways of this nature and been in two myself. QuoteKnowing what I know now, I would be able to evaluate and determine that my parachute began to fly again. I think that I could have completely removed her canopy from my person and land the main. ThCan't be sure though. I obviously wasn't the one in your predicment, but based on what I saw in the videos, I wouldn't rush to this conclusion. If you had tried this and Brit's canopy had snagged on your arm, leg, and/or head (camera!) and then reinflated, it would have been real ugly. The resulting downplane could have been nearly impossible to clear and may well have killed you. A good friend of mine nearly bought it this way. The trailing cutaway main that was wrapped around his ankle deflated just enough at treetop height to allow his main enough control for a crash and burn landing. He was very lucky to walk away with just scrapes and bruises. (Both canopies were Lightning 176s, not HP.) QuoteEnsured that I fell away from the mess then pulled the reserve. Good plan, and really the only thing I'd have done differently had it been me. Remember that connected RSL's are very much a disadvantage in this situation. Bob Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hookitt 1 #146 March 4, 2004 Thanks Bob... that was a good write up.My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riddler 0 #147 March 4, 2004 QuoteThe "Oh FUCK!" from Brit and the "SHIIT!!!" from Hookitt were simultaneous I'm sure. Exactly what I was thinking Good video guys, and I like how quickly you both reacted. I hope if that ever comes up for me that I'll react as quickly with the correct procedure.Trapped on the surface of a sphere. XKCD Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChasingBlueSky 0 #148 March 4, 2004 Quotebtw the song in the video is a remix by Fat boy slim of Wipe-Out by the beach boys. Jammin' song, fo sho its kinda cool how the song starts off and goes WIPE OUT!!! when they first hit each other. hehe I thought it was the remake from the late 80s by a group called "The Fat Boys"_________________________________________ you can burn the land and boil the sea, but you can't take the sky from me.... I WILL fly again..... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SuZQflies 0 #149 March 4, 2004 Quote You're sorta correct We (my brother and I) have a tendency toward radical behavior. As far as the wrap, that was just me being stupid. Tim-may!! You soooo do NOT have permission to do that again!! I'm glad you can dissect this and LOL... Thank God you're Ok Q ________________________________________________ Dr. "Q" PMS#151Shugah,Shugah,How'd Ya Git So Fly? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chopchop 0 #150 March 5, 2004 So.. where was the little girl screaming cutaway.. cutaway? was she under another canopy nearby? That couldn't have been the most macho Timmae screaming like that.. J/K.. glad you guys are still around to talk about it. chopchop gotta go... Plaything needs a spanking.. Lotsa Pictures Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
