turtlespeed 226 #26 March 15, 2004 Thanks - I'll met you over here in the gun thread.I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflybella 0 #27 March 15, 2004 I'm not a Christian. My reference to 'GOD' was in a higher power, general sense. I tried to use terms that had a commonly understood meaning. My feelings on this issue are personal and not based on any sort of religion. If I had the ability to stop the practice of corporate farming - I would. I would make it so every single meat eater had to hunt and kill his own food. If then, you still choose to eat meat, I might not agree but I would respect your choice. I did read what you posted and, as with many biblical references, found that it could be used to support either side of the discussion. I'll say again, It's not about what's 'rightfully' ours to take. It's about how we take it. And what we nurture and what we destroy as a result. All this talk about our "rights" and our place in the food chain. None of us has to fight for our food anymore. We've evolved. But we're still citing neanderthal practices as our reasons. Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnRich 4 #28 March 15, 2004 QuoteIn fact, once we realize we have such GOD-like power over animals - doesn't it require that we offer GOD-like care and mercy? Um, God is the one that gave us all this control over animals, and the ability to use them for our own purposes, and urged us to eat meat: Genesis 1 26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth. 27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. 28 And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth. Genesis 9 2 And the fear of you and the dread of you shall be upon every beast of the earth, and upon every fowl of the air, upon all that moveth upon the earth, and upon all the fishes of the sea; into your hand are they delivered. 3 Every moving thing that liveth shall be meat for you; even as the green herb have I given you all things. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnRich 4 #29 March 15, 2004 QuoteAre you saying all the mass produced cows are part of an eco system? I say Mass produced because there's nothing natural about the way cows are raised. There are too many people these days to live a "natural" life as a hunter-gatherer. Are you in favor of killing off a few billion people in order to return to ancient ways? Domesticated livestock have been around for thousands of years... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kennedy 0 #30 March 15, 2004 Tigers and sharks may get the occasional human, but humans eat them far more often. References to "the food chain" mean the food web, where things eat other things, and it's one big happy go lucky circle. Now who wants to sing Kumbya? ps - some humans are destined to be fish food. Look at the idiot who was featured on "Anatomy of a Sharkbite."witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1* Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jlmiracle 7 #31 March 15, 2004 Quote Put a child in a room with a banana and a bunny. The child will eat the banana and pet the bunny every time. ... so many more... off to work... c-ya What if the child was starving? JudyBe kinder than necessary because everyone you meet is fighting some kind of battle. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kennedy 0 #32 March 15, 2004 QuoteQuoteFACT: Humans are predatory by nature, much like the lion and the tiger. Remove all clothing and drop all the weapons. Walk out to an area with lots of edible fruits and other vegitation. It's also full of predatory animals. Go attack the lion or other beast with your claws and teeth. You miss one important fact - nature gave me the ability to reason and decide. Put in that situation, I would find a few stout sticks, fashion some spears, maybe a hammer or axe, a knife if I'm lucky, and then be able to take the beasts for food and have the fruits as a side dish. You also conveniently left out any sort of prey animal, such as deer and herd mentality herbivores. QuotePut a child in a room with a banana and a bunny. The child will eat the banana and pet the bunny every time. What if the child has been raised other than in your societal norms? Suppose he has been raised in a tribal situation where rabbits are seen as a food source, and he has never seen a banana. He might taste the banana, but will hate it (he doesn't know to peel it). He will then chase down the rabbit and have himself some chow. He may even know enough to get a good fire going. Do not think a "natural" state requires us to dispense with the brain power we were given at birth. Do not mistake learned norms with what nature has provided us.witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1* Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,116 #33 March 15, 2004 >Um, God is the one that gave us all this control over animals, and > the ability to use them for our own purposes, and urged us to eat > meat: God also urges us to kill all the gays. It also teaches that all races of humanity descended from one guy (Noah) and his wives, and that all land animals - every single one, from microscopic insects to elephants - once lived on a little boat. The bible, as a codified history of a people and the basis of a religion, is a good foundation for a church. It's a lousy ecology reference. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
benny 0 #34 March 15, 2004 QuoteQuote Put a child in a room with a banana and a bunny. The child will eat the banana and pet the bunny every time. ... so many more... off to work... c-ya What if the child was starving? Judy He'd eat the banana, wait, get hungry again, try to kill the bunny, get bitten by the bunny, pick up a stick and beat the bunny over it's cute little ears until it stopped shreaking and then the kid would get fur stuck in his teeth. MMM, fur. Never go to a DZ strip show. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hookitt 1 #35 March 15, 2004 Quote Are you in favor of killing off a few billion people in order to return to ancient ways? Of course not but that's definately not the point. People don't even consider any of the ramifications of the way animals are raised. They are blind to it. Sure, there's articlels here and there but for the most part, the cattle industry amongst others puts up a smoke screen. Another thing is, people just don't want to know what goes on. Out of sight, out of mind. Quote Domesticated livestock have been around for thousands of years... Very true. However, drive by Harris Ranch in california. It's pretty horrible. Lets just say those are not HAPPY cows. There's nothing good about the way the cattle are raised. If people actually cared about their food intake, the methods of which domestic farm animals are raised would be a whole lot different. The Cattle industry and many others are the way they are as a direct result of Vanity, gluttony and greed. Here's what's funny... This thread began by capping on the PETA organization on a thread in the BASE forum and it was moved. I'm not apposed to meat intake but my eye is not blind to the destruction caused by that organization alone. It's not the only one. Seriously though, the very airplanes we jump out of burn fossil fuels and I'm not going to quit. My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
beowulf 1 #36 March 15, 2004 I once worked at Rochelle Foods Inc. in Rochelle, IL for a year. It is a hog slaughter house. They killed about 7,000 hogs a day. I had no trouble watching the hogs get killed and turned into hotdogs, ham and every thing else that most people eat. Its not that big of a deal. food is food. by the way I worked in the rendering dept. if any of you know what that is you know that I have a pretty strong stomach. Not a job I really want to do for the rest of my life. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflybella 0 #37 March 15, 2004 QuoteThere are too many people these days to live a "natural" life as a hunter-gatherer. QuoteAre you in favor of killing off a few billion people Do you have any idea how much more food would be available if we stopped feeding our grain to cattle? For every 7 pounds of grain we feed to a cow, we yield less than 1 pound of meat. Not a very strong return on our crop. Doesn't sound like a system based on feeding the most people. I don't know who your God is but I hope he's dismayed at the merciless treatment of production livestock. Does being 'given dominion' over animals switch off any sense of responsibility toward fellow man, the longevity of our land and ecosystems, and ultimately your compassion to the suffering of creatures that share your life? I hope he's looking down and thinking that he created us in his image - full of love and mercy - and wondering once again what went wrong. Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnischalke 0 #38 March 15, 2004 And Saint Attila raised the hand grenade up on high, saying, "O Lord, bless this Thy hand grenade that, with it, Thou mayest blow Thine enemies to tiny bits in Thy mercy." And the Lord did grin, and the people did feast upon the lambs and sloths and carp and anchovies and orangutans and breakfast cereals and fruit bats and large chu-- Skip a bit, Brother. And the Lord spake, saying, "First shalt thou take out the Holy Pin. Then, shalt thou count to three. No more. No less. Three shalt be the number thou shalt count, and the number of the counting shall be three. Four shalt thou not count, nor either count thou two, excepting that thou then proceed to three. Five is right out. Once the number three, being the third number, be reached, then, lobbest thou thy Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch towards thy foe, who, being naughty in My sight, shall snuff it." mike Girls only want boyfriends who have great skills--You know, like nunchuk skills, bow-hunting skills, computer-hacking skills. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DrunkMonkey 0 #39 March 15, 2004 I like Steak. Medium rare. I also like other animals, dead, cooked, and on my plate. I've been to Korea--dog is actually pretty good. I've been to many Chinese restaurants, so chances are I've eaten housecat... I don't really care about the life of the cow. I'm hungry, I'll pay a rancher for a steak. Not my concern, keeping livestock happy. I've only got to worry about feeding me and my family. 3rd world countries are starving because they've got shitty climates, no agricultural technology, and myopic farmers who don't realize that they need to grow plant first, then consider going into livestock. We give away billions of tons of free grain to 3rd world countries yearly...I think we can all sleep with a clear conscience... As far as grain-meat ratio--once the govt stops paying farmers to not grow crops, we'll talk. Besides, tofu tastes like ass. Gimme the beef jerky to go. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kennedy 0 #40 March 15, 2004 QuoteGimme the beef jerky to go. Elk jerky is so much more tasty though. Venison jerky (aka deer jerky) is a close second.witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1* Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflybella 0 #41 March 15, 2004 Quote I like QuoteI don't really care QuoteNot my concern QuoteI've only got to worry about feeding me and my family QuoteI think we can all sleep with a clear conscience You sound sweet. Anyway, I've seriously considered both sides of the argument and this is the choice I make. We each have to live with our own choices and pick what 'battles' are most important to us. Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #42 March 15, 2004 Quote, pick up a stick and beat the bunny over it's cute little ears until it stopped shreaking and then the kid would get fur stuck in his teeth. MMM, fur. "eat it, it is tasty, it is juicy, it is cruncheously crunchable" "Stop it, you'll make him sick you will. There's only one way to eat a brace of coneys." "Wha, what's chips, precious?" ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hookitt 1 #43 March 15, 2004 QuoteI don't really care about the life of the cow. I'm hungry, I'll pay a rancher for a steak. Not my concern, keeping livestock happy. And now read what I wrote.... QuoteOf course not but that's definately not the point. People don't even consider any of the ramifications of the way animals are raised. They are blind to it. ... Another thing is, people just don't want to know what goes on. Out of sight, out of mind. You've proven my statement. You could care less. I know the same arguments as freeflybella... there are SOOOoo many more but very few people care any way. You guys certainly aren't hunters... you're gatherers. You gather your meat at a store or a restaraunt. You gather the power bars and Soda at the same place. You gather the Steak sauce to disguise the taste of the meat. Coat something with sugar and heat it up. Hunters indeedMy grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hookitt 1 #44 March 15, 2004 Quote "eat it, it is tasty, it is juicy, it is cruncheously crunchable" "Stop it, you'll make him sick you will. There's only one way to eat a brace of coneys." "Wha, what's chips, precious?" What the f*** ???My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #45 March 15, 2004 Movie quote - you figure it out (hint - 11 academy awards) ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
beowulf 1 #46 March 15, 2004 Quote the Steak sauce to disguise the taste of the meat. Coat something with sugar and heat it up. Hunters indeed STEAK SAUCE we don't need no stinkin steack sauce if its a good steak it doesn't need steak sauce! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zenister 0 #47 March 15, 2004 QuoteMr. Rifle sais otherwise....ever see a tiger fire a rifle? until you run out of ammo....90% of humanity is prey without the industrial complex to support them... if you can kill it with a spear, you deserve to eat it...otherwise...____________________________________ Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AdD 1 #48 March 15, 2004 QuoteSharks eat humans thus are higher above us in your 'food chain'. Would you be happy throwing a human to a shark? No. Deal with it. Depends on who I was throwing...Life is ez On the dz Every jumper's dream 3 rigs and an airstream Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kennedy 0 #49 March 15, 2004 what land animal alive today couldn't be killed with a spear?witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1* Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zenister 0 #50 March 15, 2004 have you ever even seen a tiger (or any large cat) without bars between you? heard that low growl that raises the hair on the back of your neck and reminds you of exactly how defenseless you really are? how about a bear? wolf? in fact have you ever killed anything with a handheld weapon? powered by your own muscle? most havent.. most "hunters" are simply prey without the tools they bought from the gun store...____________________________________ Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites