kallend 2,156 #1 March 18, 2004 www.ajc.com/opinion/content/opinion/0304/18medicare.html "Actuaries calculate the costs of insurance and the reserves needed to meet insurance requirements, and Foster was the chief actuary for Medicare. Well before the new prescription drug benefit passed last fall, Foster had submitted reports to the Bush administration that showed the costs of the new program would be between $500 billion and $600 billion through 2013. This was contrary to the $400 billion trumpeted by the administration, evidently just to line up with the target set by Congress. According to Foster, Medicare administrator Thomas Scully, who rode herd over the legislation for the White House, ordered Foster not to talk to members of Congress without his authorization. If he revealed the high figures, he risked losing his job, according to reports. Foster was barred from giving the real numbers not only to Democrats but also to Republicans such as Rep. Bill Thomas, a Californian who chairs the powerful tax writing Ways and Means Committee. The purpose of withholding the information, clearly, was to keep lawmakers in the dark. Several Republicans, especially, had expressed reservations about the proposal when the Bush administration told them it would cost $400 billion over 10 years. They might not have given it their votes had they known the real costs. As it happened, the legislation squeaked by in the House in a 220-215 predawn vote. On Tuesday, Secretary of Health and Human Services Tommy Thompson announced that he will conduct an internal investigation. But the real problem -- the implication that the White House may have intervened to cover up the high figure for political purposes -- clearly needs to be addressed more broadly. A congressional investigation is needed."... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,156 #2 March 18, 2004 Come on, Bush supporters, rally to his side. (Or are you still waiting for the official spin from Rush or Ann?)... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChasingBlueSky 0 #3 March 18, 2004 The deception and lies from this administration know no bounds._________________________________________ you can burn the land and boil the sea, but you can't take the sky from me.... I WILL fly again..... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vallerina 2 #4 March 18, 2004 Quote Come on, Bush supporters, rally to his side. You know chief actuaries...they're always screwing up their numbers! There's a thin line between Saturday night and Sunday morning Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #5 March 18, 2004 What is an additional 100 to 200 billion dollars? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
meltdown 0 #6 March 18, 2004 I don't think ANY Republican thought this piece of shit legislation would cost what Bush said. That's why every Republican I know was against it. Just another expansion of our already out of control government. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Remster 30 #7 March 18, 2004 QuoteQuote Come on, Bush supporters, rally to his side. You know chief actuaries...they're always screwing up their numbers! I'd extend that to all actuaries... all crooks I tell you! ALL OF THEM! Remster Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
goose491 0 #8 March 18, 2004 Liar liar pants on fire. Hey! Let's set his pants on fire! My Karma ran over my Dogma!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,156 #9 March 18, 2004 More: www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A3758-2004Mar18.html... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vallerina 2 #10 March 18, 2004 QuoteI'd extend that to all actuaries... all crooks I tell you! ALL OF THEM! Actuaries already have to follow enough silly laws. I wonder if states will start implementing a "Follow George's Math" law?There's a thin line between Saturday night and Sunday morning Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #11 March 18, 2004 Well, they didn't include the costs of the faked news stories the administration produced to tout the benefits of the program. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,156 #12 March 18, 2004 QuoteWell, they didn't include the costs of the faked news stories the administration produced to tout the benefits of the program. The administration doesn't lie or deceive. It's just that the truth changes according to their needs.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #13 March 18, 2004 QuoteQuoteWell, they didn't include the costs of the faked news stories the administration produced to tout the benefits of the program. The administration doesn't lie or deceive. It's just that the truth changes according to their needs. True..."Karen Ryan reporting live..." was a real person's voice. It just wasn't anyone named Karen Ryan, and wasn't a reporter. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,156 #14 March 18, 2004 Still no reaction from the Bush supporters. I guess they are waiting for Ann Coulter to finish working on the spin official party response.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tunaplanet 0 #15 March 18, 2004 Quote(Or are you still waiting for the official spin from Rush or Ann?) Oh, maybe they mistook this thread for the 462,017 other ones just like it. Here you go. Forty-two Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,156 #16 March 18, 2004 QuoteQuote(Or are you still waiting for the official spin from Rush or Ann?) Oh, maybe they mistook this thread for the 462,017 other ones just like it. Not my fault if the administration lies and deceives 462,017 times. I'm glad you're keeping count.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,121 #17 March 18, 2004 >Still no reaction from the Bush supporters. I guess they are waiting >for Ann Coulter to finish working on the spin official party response. Or people are getting sick of these threads. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rainbo 0 #18 March 18, 2004 Jeez, a liberal that is upset about excessive tax burden for a social program. what is the world coming to?Rainbo TheSpeedTriple - Speed is everything "Blessed are those who can give without remembering, and take without forgetting." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,156 #19 March 18, 2004 Quote>Still no reaction from the Bush supporters. I guess they are waiting >for Ann Coulter to finish working on the spin official party response. Or people are getting sick of these threads. Selective sickness - they are still active on Kerry bashing threads today.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
newsstand 0 #20 March 18, 2004 QuoteLiar liar pants on fire. Hey! Let's set his pants on fire! Already been done here "Truth is tough. It will not break, like a bubble, at a touch; nay, you may kick it about all day like a football, and it will be round and full at evening." -- Oliver Wendell Holmes Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Remster 30 #21 March 18, 2004 QuoteOr people are getting sick of these threads. [point at Bill and then touches nose]Remster Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,156 #22 March 18, 2004 QuoteJeez, a liberal that is upset about excessive tax burden for a social program. what is the world coming to? Hey Kevin - did you see Steve Chapman's column in today's Chicago Tribune? He's their token Libertarian on the editorial board. Link: Here... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gawain 0 #23 March 18, 2004 Can you tell me how much a bottle of aspirin will cost in 2007, 2010, 2013? If Viagra costs $6/pill now, how much will it cost in 2007, 2010, 2013? How much will a doctor make this year? How much will he/she make in 2007, 2010, 2013? I have no doubts that the Administrations numbers (projections) will not be the "actual". I also know that actuaries' numbers (also projections) will not be actual.So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright 'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life Make light! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #24 March 18, 2004 QuoteCan you tell me how much a bottle of aspirin will cost in 2007, 2010, 2013? If Viagra costs $6/pill now, how much will it cost in 2007, 2010, 2013? How much will a doctor make this year? How much will he/she make in 2007, 2010, 2013? I have no doubts that the Administrations numbers (projections) will not be the "actual". I also know that actuaries' numbers (also projections) will not be actual. Ummm...that's not the point. The point is that the directory of Medicaire was ordered not to disclose that he thought the projected costs were incorrect until after the bill was passed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,156 #25 March 19, 2004 QuoteCan you tell me how much a bottle of aspirin will cost in 2007, 2010, 2013? If Viagra costs $6/pill now, how much will it cost in 2007, 2010, 2013? How much will a doctor make this year? How much will he/she make in 2007, 2010, 2013? I have no doubts that the Administrations numbers (projections) will not be the "actual". I also know that actuaries' numbers (also projections) will not be actual. That's what actuaries do. They make projections for action by policymakers. What Bush did was prevent the policymakers in Congress from getting the data by threatening to fire the chief actuary if he told anyone. Sounds remarkably like contempt of Congress to me.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
