What caused this mal?

[Bill_K 0]

Clicky

I have a speculation at this point, but nothing more.

A little background; normally, I only pack for myself. I make 6-10 video jumps a day, normally all on this canopy. A Spector 150 loaded at 1.4ish. This day however I'd been jumping the 182 and doing back to back's using two rig's and letting the TI's and a new young packer pack for me.

Our primary pilot got back and we did this jump from the King Air. Spot was long and left so we dumped high as per the TI's indications, and glad that we did.

Line twists on this canopy are no big deal. Kicked out of those and then the fun began. If you look at 25-27 seconds you can see that the left break line is wrapped around the toggle on the other side, ~I think~ somehow. Next thing I know the canopy is diving and turning hard on it's face and see that line across the middle so I chopped it.

When we got the canopy back, the breaks where still stowed, the top right keeper on the right toggle was the only thing not stowed, but there was NO damage and the break was still set. Had that line be caught there it would have torn that keeper out coming loose.

Thoughts, ideas, speculation's?

BTW, I do NOT us an RSL anymore, it had just been removed 3 weeks prior with my last repack. Sigh... did not find the free bag or pilot chute either.

[yeyo 1]

Are the tabs or rings of your slinks tucked inside the risers? Looks like a line from the the left side was caught on something at the top of the left side risers. So it wasnt caught on the guide ring or the toggle.
And this happened when the line twist reached the risers.
So my guess is line trapped in slink tab/ring with slider helping to keep it trapped?

HISPA #93
DS #419.5

[buff 0]

That's my guess too. I thought that maybe a line from the left side was trapped unter the toggle tab but going back to the slider earlier in the sequence it looks like the slider is keeping it over there. Possibly the tab on you slider kill line has it wrapped.

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[SimonBones 1]

One line got wrapped around your dbag when your canopy was in it. I had something similar some years ago. If might not have been there while flaking at all so it would not have been visible. Once the canopy got put in the bag and the lines stowed, at some point a line went around the bag. This causes a single line to be wrapped around the other line groups on opening.

How much unstowed line is left when the bag is going into the container? If you usually only have a couple stows and then a lot of leftover line that gets coiled into the bottom of the pack tray, your packer may have accidentally rolled the bag through a single line.

If you stow more of your lines, it minimizes the chance of a malfunction like this.

Does your packer frequently just do a couple stows and then coil the rest of the lines to save time packing? When people do this, it wouldn't be hard to get a single line wrapped around and not even know it unless you pulled the canopy out again.

Most manufacturers have a packing recommendation for the amount of excess unstowed lines.

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[tdog 0]

I vote 100% packing error/user error.

As you are kicking out, the lines are separated below the slider and the risers are independent. The slider never had a chance to come down at this point.

The second the slider opens up after the last linetwist is done, and the lines separate, you can see one line goes around the other riser, not caught on the toggle or hardware, but completely around. (Why not caught? Well, the risers never touch as you are kicking out, so a line cannot just jump over and get caught on the other riser. Plus, the amount of force required to hold it would require a knot, not just being under a ring or tab as it would have rotated the riser to self release with that much pressure.)

Why did you not see it after the chop? It came down probably in a ball of crap after cutaway and any continuity issues in the lines were attributed to that, not pre-cutaway issues.

The reason the canopy was not diving at first, all of this mess was in the line twists, thus the canopy was inflated evenly. The second the line twists came out, and the risers could separate, the offending stepthru line was pulled hard around the other riser and deflected the canopy causing a dive. Notice the slider at 26 seconds is not open, it is the offending line keeping the risers closer together, thus all that force was on that line causing a dive.

So the cause... On the last jump before this, did you land with any tangled mess, where you accidentally stepped over a single line, thus doing a single line step thru? This is commonly seen when the canopy lands on top of you or you have a bad landing.

Or, did you throw this rig down when doing the back to backs, such that the packer/DZ staff could have picked it up by the container pulling the container thru one line? This is common when the container is thrown on top of the canopy then the entire wad of stuff is moved around so the container gets deep in the fabric.

The stepthru likely came from handling the rig after the previous jump, although it could be possible that once the canopy was in the bag one line got around the mess. Solution - always daisy chain your lines before taking off the rig when others will be transporting it, moving it, etc.

This step thru would have been identified in a good "run up" of the lines, if the person would have known what they are looking for. I have seen step thrus before with novice packers where they say, "something does not feel right here, can't tell what it is"... Unless they know what they are looking for, it blends in, and the stepthru that likely started at the container is pushed all the way into the canopy when the lines are run up.

[Bill_K 0]

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Are the tabs or rings of your slinks tucked inside the risers?

I will have to look this weekend, I can't remember right now.

[Bill_K 0]

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One line got wrapped around your dbag when your canopy was in it. I had something similar some years ago. If might not have been there while flaking at all so it would not have been visible. Once the canopy got put in the bag and the lines stowed, at some point a line went around the bag. This causes a single line to be wrapped around the other line groups on opening.

I had not thought of that and it was a tangled mess when we got it back to clean it up later.

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How much unstowed line is left when the bag is going into the container? If you usually only have a couple stows and then a lot of leftover line that gets coiled into the bottom of the pack tray, your packer may have accidentally rolled the bag through a single line.

When I pack myself, 18-24" tops is left. I don't know in this case as somebody else packed it.

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If you stow more of your lines, it minimizes the chance of a malfunction like this.

Great lesson to be learned here and I normally do all my own packing.

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Does your packer frequently just do a couple stows and then coil the rest of the lines to save time packing? When people do this, it wouldn't be hard to get a single line wrapped around and not even know it unless you pulled the canopy out again.

Most manufacturers have a packing recommendation for the amount of excess unstowed lines.

In this case they did stow it all, I bet the single line roll through happened... sounds very plausible to me.

[BrianM 1]

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the risers never touch as you are kicking out

See attached.


Hard to tell from the video quality if the line goes around the riser or not - could be a step-through, or a snag.

"It's amazing what you can learn while you're not talking." - Skydivesg

[iowa 0]

Looks to me like like the right side of your collapsible slider caught your left toggle/riser just as the line twist was coming out. ymmv.

Keith

''Always do sober what you said you would do drunk. That will teach you to keep your mouth shut.'' - Ernest Hemingway

[Amazon 7]

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Looks to me like like the right side of your collapsible slider caught your left toggle/riser just as the line twist was coming out. ymmv.

That is what I thought too.. like the pull line got between a line on the right and tangled into one of the lines on the left pulling the line over to the left. THe slider just looks too wonky too me being pulled over to the left lines... like ist partially inverted that direction.

[monkycndo 0]

Around 26-27 seconds, you can see the right side rear riser is spun around and pulled in front of the front riser by one of the lines. The line goes around the left side risers and back underneath the slider to the right side. The slider kill line wouldn't do this. You can see the left kill line pull tab and a slack rear edge of the slider. Looks like a single line step through. The risers are being pulled together by that line.

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[airtwardo 7]

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Around 26-27 seconds, you can see the right side rear riser is spun around and pulled in front of the front riser by one of the lines. The line goes around the left side risers and back underneath the slider to the right side. The slider kill line wouldn't do this. You can see the left kill line pull tab and a slack rear edge of the slider. Looks like a single line step through. The risers are being pulled together by that line.

Yeah that's what I thought....it's a loose nut behind the pull up cord!

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[jurgencamps 0]

Have not seen the video, but I had a mal like that on my stiletto. Spinning linetwist and a line over at the same time. First I did not notice the line over due to the spinning linetwist. After clearing the linetwist, I noticed that one stearingline was "misrouted". I think that I had a lineover which cleared, but to the wrong side. Have to admit that I was rushed and did a sloppy packjob.

[hookitt 1]

That won't happen after the canopy is in the bag. Can it? Sure but it's a lot of unusual clumsy manipulation that I would simply rule it out.


That was caused prior to packing and a line check wasn't performed.

My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto

[timmyfitz 0]

screen capture picture attached

[Bill_K 0]

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screen capture picture attached

LOL, yes, I know that was the cause. My question was the ideas on how it got that way. After reading through all the great feedback here, I'm betting single line step through while the rig was being moved. My son and another younger packer where doing the moving while I was gearing up for another load. Lesson learned on my part.

[Andy9o8 2]

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....it's a loose nut behind the pull up cord!

Easily tightened with a crowbar.

[fcajump 164]

I would have to agree with the single line step through.

At one point in the 25ish second range, the trail edge of the slider is in full view, both kill lines accounted for.

This frame grab (similar to one already posted) shows the risers of each side unable to separate (front to back) below the slider, and the line clearly going left to right (or r to l). I would agree that the rig was flipped through, catching one line on the way over before packing.

Assuming I am correct, this should have been caught during repack when the slider is moved up the lines IFF the packer ran the line groups up (each group separated - front/rear/steering).

Just what I see...

JW

Always remember that some clouds are harder than others...

[irishrigger 32]

hi,
looking at the video and pics,i also think that it was a step through,i have seen it before.
cause i would say without a doubt was packing.i be very suprised if the step through wasnt spoted when doing a 4 line check.my suspicion would be after teh canopy was packed one line somehow went around a line causing this.
bummer that you lost your freebag and pc.
i would say,that the packer owes you a few beers!
rodger

[pjc 0]

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That won't happen after the canopy is in the bag. Can it? Sure but it's a lot of unusual clumsy manipulation that I would simply rule it out.

I agree - You'd have to pull the whole bridle & PC through too!!

[JohnRich 4]

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...you can see that the left break line...
...the breaks where still stowed...
...there was NO damage and the break was still set...

They are brakes, not breaks.