Motorcycle ?? (Pipes & Fuel Injection Module) Misc. Questions)

[Sebazz1 2]

Is it really bad to run my bike with my after market pipes without the fuel injection module? I got the Vance Hines HS PRO 2 into 1 pipes. I am looking at the dyno jet power commander on-line right now (recomended by Vance Hines). I already have the new pipes on and they definately kick ass but I have concerns about whether it's bad for the engine or not to cruise around right now? Thank you for any advice... Gareth?

[flyingferret 0]

I don't have time for a full lean/rich explanation. But basically, you have just adjusted the air curve of your bike by adding pipes. You want your fuel curve to match your air curve as much as possible. Otherwise, you end up with lean spots and rich spots on the curve. I would speculate, that without adjustment, you are now lean in most of the curve. 2-into-1 move large amounts of air. By running lean you will run hot. In fact, if in doubt it is better to run a little rich than too lean. So....you could ride, but I would not recommend it for long, and I would watch your temp closely.

On a side note, I highly recommend the power commander, and they have a stock map for 2into1 with SE air intake. You can also tweak any existing map you like.

--
All the flaming and trolls of wreck dot with a pretty GUI.

[Sebazz1 2]

Thank you sir, you da man. I thought it was running too lean. Lot's of popping, etc... I am off to make the purchase.

-Seb

[Deuce 1]

Or you could buy a motorcycle that has over a hundred horsepower to begin with...

[sunshine 2]

I have no idea what you just said. Let's talk about sex on a motorcycle instead!!

___________________________________________
meow

I get a Mike hug! I get a Mike hug!

[Sebazz1 2]

Duece, your bike kicks ass no doubt about it! As does mine! Actually I am starting to appreciate all bikes for their uniqueness. They are all fun to ride. Even those 50cc momos that folks zip around on at the DZ. I think that new Buell street fighter bike looks like a lot of fun.

Anyway, Another Harley Question:
Hey if fork braces add so much stability and added performance why don't they just come stock? I am thinking about getting braces too now... For the added performance and cornering stability of course.

[gjhdiver 0]

Quote

Is it really bad to run my bike with my after market pipes without the fuel injection module? I got the Vance Hines HS PRO 2 into 1 pipes. I am looking at the dyno jet power commander on-line right now (recomended by Vance Hines). I already have the new pipes on and they definately kick ass but I have concerns about whether it's bad for the engine or not to cruise around right now? Thank you for any advice... Gareth?

Not really. If you haven't upgraded your fuel and intake, you're basically making more noise than power, although there will be a little increase in delivered horsepower at the back wheel.

A mistake that's often made on normally aspirated bikes is that the air and pipes are done, but the bike isn't rejetted to compensate for the ensuing lean condition. You shouldn't have this problem if you have a properly mapped injection module. There's plenty of easy software upgrades for your module, but to be really sure, you should get it installed and tuned on a dyno by a pro to avoid any nastiness. You can lunch a top end really fast running a hard lean motor.

I personally reccomend you take it to Marin Ironworks/BFD Racing in Novato and have John "The Russian" Federof and Andy Borge work it up on the dyno there. They are the only people I let futz with my motors other than me. These guys have a great in house dyno and know how to use it, which isn't always the case in a lot of shops. The number is (415) 897 0553

[FIREFLYR 0]

Quote

Duece, your bike kicks ass no doubt about it! As does mine! Actually I am starting to appreciate all bikes for their uniqueness. They are all fun to ride. Even those 50cc momos that folks zip around on at the DZ. I think that new Buell street fighter bike looks like a lot of fun.

Anyway, Another Harley Question:
Hey if fork braces add so much stability and added performance why don't they just come stock? I am thinking about getting braces too now... For the added performance and cornering stability of course.

The fork brace only helps when you're going really fast,and it usually dont look that cool. also it's one more aftermarket thing to bump your bill up,thats how your $17k Fatboy turns into a $25k Fatboy before it leaves the store.
cheers
~J

"One flew East,and one flew West..............one flew over the cuckoo's nest"
"There's absolutely no excuse for the way I'm about to act"

[gjhdiver 0]

Quote

Duece, your bike kicks ass no doubt about it! As does mine! Actually I am starting to appreciate all bikes for their uniqueness. They are all fun to ride. Even those 50cc momos that folks zip around on at the DZ. I think that new Buell street fighter bike looks like a lot of fun.

Anyway, Another Harley Question:
Hey if fork braces add so much stability and added performance why don't they just come stock? I am thinking about getting braces too now... For the added performance and cornering stability of course.

Fork braces stop flexing of the front end in turns and under heavy braking, especially if you only have one disc up front. They should be installed with other things that make the front end perform, such as progressive springs, cartridge emulators, and much much heavier oil. HD's come with 10 weight in the front. I change that out to at least 30 weight fork oil.

Also, you'll have to upgrade the units on th back. It's night and day once you do though.

[flyingferret 0]

$17K? Where are you buying one, I want 3.

Mine was $20K (21,400 with TTL).

--
All the flaming and trolls of wreck dot with a pretty GUI.

[AggieDave 6]

Which front end do you have?

Something that a lot of guys with the narrow front end use are dampeners. Fairly cheap and stupid simple to install. Helps with the road bumping your front end around. On the wide front ends it doesn't really matter due to the rolling mass of the larger tire.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[FIREFLYR 0]

I almost bought one at Dudley Perkins a few years back (I worked there)
I decided to stick with my chopper
~J

"One flew East,and one flew West..............one flew over the cuckoo's nest"
"There's absolutely no excuse for the way I'm about to act"

[Sebazz1 2]

There's just so much fa-kin shit... I keep telling myself I wanna keep my bike as stock as possible but I read these bike magazines, watch the build off shows, see others bikes and it's damn near like an addiction. Arrggg.

So one more question about the pipes and power commander. The fact that I put after market pipes on my bike and even with the power commander is this going to shorten the life expectancy of my engine? I mean I plan to keep very good care of it with proper maintenance and such. Also do I have to be really concerned about riding my bike in hot temperatures? Even with the power commander? Should I get a dip stick with a thermometer on it? It's the oil temp I should be concerned with right?

I'm a dude and have little engine knowledge... sad I know.

[flyingferret 0]

Sebazz, there are others here with more knowledge than myself. But I can share my experiences.

I researched the PowerCommander very heavily before I bought it. I don't have any links or anything, but the overall impression was that with a proper map, it would cause me any issues at all. I spoke with owners, mechanics and Dynojet. Give em a call if you want, they were very nice to me, and know their maps inside out. Additionally there is a pretty decent community for user made maps; the sport bike riders in particle tweak the crap out of their rice rockets with these things, including, timing adjustment: which we can do on HDs as well, but I saw no need.

In addition to that, even if you go with Stage 1 stuff from HD, there is an ECM 'remap' or a replacement ECM. Because they have to do the same thing, if they change the engine dynamics too much. The difference is that there is static, the power commander can change. Of course they have to warranty theirs, but typically HD is excellent with warranty stuff, because they know their community survives on customization.

Not connected to that...I would highly recommend getting a dipstick temp gauge. But then I swear by a tach on my fat boy as well. In my opinion, the more I know about that engine the better. If you have a recent HD 88B engine, optimum running temp is 214 degrees farenheit. During traffic in the Texas summer, mine will creep to 275, which is still not drastic unless it is extended. My dad has an 01 heritage carberated, and has more temp issue than mine. The beauty of the fuel injected models is that from 02 on (I think maybe earlier) they incorporated a temp sensor that can adjust the fuel fuel. The rear cylinder is what typically runs hot. So the ECM monitors that temp, and adjusts fuel if it is running hot. A carb bike could never do that. Anyway, get a dipstick temp, I like the analog ones, because a simple glance tells me a lot, just like an altimeter.

You will note that most Powercommander maps if you look at them are more or less innert in the lower corner of the RPM/acceleration matrix. So at idle, they don't make much difference. That is typically when you will run hottest. Also, according to the literature, the map does not kick in until the bike reaches 'operating temp' I am not sure on this or how the determine the temp. But regardless you should be doing 'fin check' for temp before you start riding anyway.

Hope that answered some questions. I put on the SE air intake (highly recommended!), removed baffles, and installed PowerCommander at the same time, so the individual impacts are hard to gauge, but altogether it made a very marked difference.

--
All the flaming and trolls of wreck dot with a pretty GUI.

[skinnyshrek 0]

try the power commander 2 i have it on my CBR 600f4i along with a high mount pipe. But now i see you have a harley so disregard. As above try a jap bike..lol

http://www.skydivethefarm.com

do you realize that when you critisize people you dont know over the internet, you become part of a growing society of twats? ARE YOU ONE OF THEM?