mnealtx 0 #26 January 19, 2005 Good point!!!Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jumper03 0 #27 January 19, 2005 QuoteQuoteWhich most truck owners never do. Maybe around Chicago they don't...I use my truck as a truck more often then you would probably think. That's why I got a truck in the first place. *high five* what the hell good is a truck if you don't use it as a truck? P.S. I always thought the best reason for getting a hybrid was to stick it to the oil companies...Scars remind us that the past is real Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChasingBlueSky 0 #28 January 19, 2005 QuoteQuoteWhich most truck owners never do. Maybe around Chicago they don't...I use my truck as a truck more often then you would probably think. That's why I got a truck in the first place. I have friends that own trucks and use them all day long for their construction company or other work related stuff. So us city folk know what they are used for as well.....but most people do just jack them up, pimp em out, whatever....seems like a total waste to me. Then I have to listen to them bitch that it costs $50 to fill them up btw - I've been to Texas and seen that everyone owns a truck there. I doubt with all the trucks I saw that they get used like you used yours. Just go to downtown Fort Worth on a Friday night and you will see what I mean._________________________________________ you can burn the land and boil the sea, but you can't take the sky from me.... I WILL fly again..... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 10 #29 January 19, 2005 QuoteThe Prius is on backorder pretty much everywhere. You cannot get it for a discount, and often find a markup. Also, to get one, you need to put down a decent down payment to get hold of it. The Prius will run you anywhere from $21k to $30k depending on the options you get. The new Acura starts at $29k and goes up from there - it will be a V6 and the mileage will be the same as a typical Civic or Corolla. Good info, but not really what I asked for. Thanks anyway. My question was this....Say you have a Prius. What other (normal) car would be the same type of car? How much less would the normal car cost, and WHEN would the gas savings be greater than the initial extra cost of the car. The Tax break is now 1500, not 2 grand. So lets say the Hybrid costs 21,000. The same type of normal car with about the same equipment might cost 13,000. I am making numbers up here since I don't know what the level of the car is...Does it have leather seating? Does it have a good sound system...ect. 21,000 - 1500 for taxes. 19500 19,500-13,000 = 6500.00 One person claims that they are saving 100/mth. That means it would be 65 mths before the cost of ownership between these two cars would be the same. At 66 mths it would start getting better and better to own the hybrid. That is assuming that the cost of maintenance is the same for both cars. So does anyone know what the cost of a comparable regular car would be?"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gerrcoin 0 #30 January 19, 2005 Quote> I got a 2005 VW Jetta TDI Diesel 5 speed. I might consider a diesel after 2007, when the new emissions laws for diesels come into place. Currently a TDI pollutes about as much as 1500 SULEV cars like the Prius (depending on pollutant.) Once the 2007 rules kick in, this will be reduced by a factor of 100, and using biodiesel will reduce it even further. About 40% of the car market in Ireland is now diesel due to the extortionist fuel prices. The best engine size is around 2.0 lt, with a turbo if you must. Most of these are knocking out over 65mpg. Also diesels last much longer than similar petrol engined models. My fathers old 89 Toyota Carina II 2.0D is at 250,000 miles and still going strong, and it seems that the harder you run them the more reliable they become. The newer diesel technology appearing over here is CommonRail Diesel injection - similar to the petrol fuel injection system whereby the fuel is taken from a pressurised fuel rail and the injectors just act as a metering system. This is much more efficient and does away with the black exhaust clouds that were common under acceleration. Also the newer diesels are relatively quiet. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChasingBlueSky 0 #31 January 19, 2005 When I went to the dealership looking to buy one last month, they tried to sell me on the Corolla, Matrix and the Camry...then they showed me the new Scion line as well. Since they were out of stock, they figured these cars were in the same category. They let me know that most people in the market for this car tend to buy midsize cars (like me) but there is also big demand in Hollywood for them as the "it/now" thing to have. As you know, the pricerange on midsize can go from $11-$30k, so it is a large group to choose from depending if you want American or import. There is no direct comparison to another car, not even the original Prius since this is a new design altogether. At least with Honda you can compare the cost of the Civic to the Civic Hybrid. The Prius is not big on options. You have to use very specific tires, there is no sunroof to help keep drag down and mileage up, an only cloth seats (IIRC) for it. Most likely they are going to save the luxury upgrades for their Camry Hybrid when/if it hits the market....expect to see it if the Accord Hybrid takes off. There are some cool "geek" items like bluetooth, DVD navigation and 6-disc in dash CD changer. The sound system is middle of the road. Toyota has a calculator on their Prius page so you can get an idea of how much you would save in gas. However, do not buy this car if you are looking to save money over a typical midsize...there are cheaper options. It will take about 10 years or more of these cars being mainstream before they are competitive in price....they are trying to recoup some of the R&D cost by taking advantage of the hype._________________________________________ you can burn the land and boil the sea, but you can't take the sky from me.... I WILL fly again..... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quattro4Life 0 #32 January 19, 2005 in case no one mentioned it, the major advantage of a hybrid car is for city driving. most hybrids average almost the same city mileage as they do for highway. if you do lots of city driving, the hybrid is the way to go. mostly highway driving? get a diesel. vw's TDI's are among the best out there. not to mention interior quality is much higher in a golf/jetta tdi than most of the entry hybrid vehicles. -bI'm not the percent you think survives, I need sanctuary in the pages of this book... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mx757 4 #33 January 19, 2005 The newer diesel technology appearing over here is CommonRail Diesel injection - similar to the petrol fuel injection system whereby the fuel is taken from a pressurised fuel rail and the injectors just act as a metering system. This is much more efficient and does away with the black exhaust clouds that were common under acceleration. Also the newer diesels are relatively quiet. the new 2004 / 2005 VW TDI's diesel are not common rail, but rather "pump duse" which means each cylinder has its own high presser injector and pump. its made by bosch which also makes te common rail set up. I'm pleased with my 2005 TDi I fill it up about every 3.5 weeks nice Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #34 January 19, 2005 Quotebtw - I've been to Texas and seen that everyone owns a truck there. I doubt with all the trucks I saw that they get used like you used yours. Actually, if everyone in TX owned a truck then the parking spaces at Home Depot would be bigger... Ok, seriously, sure there's folks that don't use a truck for the use of a truck all that often, that's the same everywhere; however, it seems to me outside of the major cities (DFW, Houston, austin, San Antonio) that a lot of the trucks get used as trucks. That's just what I've seen and by no means qualifies as an imperical study. QuoteJust go to downtown Fort Worth on a Friday night and you will see what I mean. Yup, I was in Ft. Worth just a couple of months ago infact. Parked my motorcycle infront of 8.0's in line with all the other motorcycles. The time before that a buddy of mine that someone was gonna try to fight me because I kept yelling "yuppy" every time a H2 went by (it was right after they first came out, the same one went by about 8 times).--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 10 #35 January 19, 2005 QuoteThe Prius is not big on options. You have to use very specific tires, there is no sunroof to help keep drag down and mileage up, an only cloth seats (IIRC) for it. Most likely they are going to save the luxury upgrades for their Camry Hybrid when/if it hits the market....expect to see it if the Accord Hybrid takes off. There are some cool "geek" items like bluetooth, DVD navigation and 6-disc in dash CD changer. The sound system is middle of the road. See here are a few problem already. How much are the tires? I did some checking a few mths ago for a class I was in. I compared a Civic Hybrid with a standard Civic. I found that you had to own the Hybrid for 54 mths before the cost of ownership was the same. That is assuming that nothing broke that didn't cost more than noramal. I like the hybrid concept. But some think that they will save money in gas...And they will, but the higher cost of purchase means that it will be 40-60 mths down the road. One could also factor in the extra cost of financing the extra cost of the hybrid and the fact that gas prices may rise or fall. All in all I like the hybrid idea, but it is not the most economic choice like many think."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,114 #36 January 19, 2005 >most hybrids average almost the same city mileage as they do for highway. Most hybrids actually do better in city driving, since they can leave the gas engine off for much of the time. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ltdiver 3 #37 January 20, 2005 Quote>most hybrids average almost the same city mileage as they do for highway. Most hybrids actually do better in city driving, since they can leave the gas engine off for much of the time. Thanks for correcting my incorrect hypothesis at the start of this thread. Interesting. ltdiver Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quattro4Life 0 #38 January 20, 2005 Quote>most hybrids average almost the same city mileage as they do for highway. Most hybrids actually do better in city driving, since they can leave the gas engine off for much of the time. in EPA tests, yes. in real life.....not so much. i suppose it can depend on the nature of the city driving, and whether there is some highway mixed in. but in general, most hybrids will average slightly better on the highway. but you are correct about them shutting off the gas engines much of the time in the city. another interesting emissions technology is the selective cylinder control found on the chrysler 300 (i believe only on the v8 model), where on the highway it runs on only 4 cylinders, since a car at highway speeds needs so much less power to maintain speed. it increases highway mileage by at least 5mpg i think. nice to see one of the 'big three' actually doing something about emissions rather than just focusing on making bigger and bigger SUVs (although technically, the 300 is a sight closer to a mercedes than a chrysler). -bI'm not the percent you think survives, I need sanctuary in the pages of this book... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #39 January 20, 2005 QuoteThanks for correcting my incorrect hypothesis at the start of this thread. Interesting. Naw, the new Honda is stated at getting 47 in the city and 48 on the highway. So I would say according to the factory its about the same.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
