Humor Me - IN YOUR OWN WORDS...

[Unstable 9]

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I agree! Unfortunately, it has been my experience that most skydivers do not keep it in somewhat decent shape.

I agree. "Look, Ron, please get your velcro replaced on your rig - " always get the answer "Okay, next repack cycle..."

=========Shaun ==========

[Guinness_fr 0]

Great answer!
Next time just try to make some paragraphs for better readibility, because freeflyers are never gonna read such a huge block of text.

PS: It's so easy to make fun of freeflyers in the Gear&Rigging forum, they never read it!

PPS: Before being flamed by some humorless freeflyer: I freefly in competition (well ok, I suck, so that probably does'nt count; plus my rig is mostly black so I guess I suck even more)...

[Chubba 0]

My understanding has always been:

Strong covers/flaps, tight BOC pouch and no bridal exposure.

Sounds good to me. I love my Infinity, the thing is bomb proof.

The worn out V2 crowd are quite envious

[lilchief 1]

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I agree. "Look, Ron, please get your velcro replaced on your rig - " always get the answer "Okay, next repack cycle..."

wooot? me? nonono...no velcro here!!!! have you been in my computer?? huh? sniffed the CIA on me have ya? well have ya?

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PS: It's so easy to make fun of freeflyers in the Gear&Rigging forum, they never read it!

bah! I'm a proud Freeflyer rigger form the cold bitter north! And I'll come with my freefly AND vikingfriendly rigg av steal yerr loot and women! arrrgh!

"Once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been and there you long to return." - Da Vinci
www.lilchief.no

[rehmwa 2]

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By far the most important facture in determining whether a rig is "Freefly Friendly" is how shiny it is. How much pollished stainless is there on the rig. How many unnessasary rings does it have. Color is also important. To be "Freefly Friendly" the rig must be built in loud colors. The preffrences in color vary but they must be bright and incorperate the newest exotic fabricks. Shiney and relective siver is always a good choise. White is also a popular option. Keeping in mind that if the rig becomes unexceptably stained it will no longer be safe to "Freefly" in and will have to be replaced. Black a former staple of the skydiveing industry is not "freefly Friendly" and you will NOT be cool with a solid black rig. The most important thing is it must match the rest of your gear. If it does not corordanate with your jumpsuit it is NOT "Freefly Friendly"! This raises the question of which comes first the jumpsuit design or the rig. It has become a chicken or the egg question. Ideally they should be designed togather as a corordonated package. With the rise of Origon as one of the leading "Freefly" jump suit manufacterers The suit has actualy taken presedence over the rig in the disign proccess. It is now easier to corordonate the containor with the jumpsuit then vice versa. The advent of "Freeflying" has been a God send to the gear manufacterers as it now requires any student graduating off AFF to imeadently buy new custom gear, jumpsuit, container, canopy, gearbag, etc. whitch to be "Freefly Friendly" must be totaly unique and custom with all posable new options and mods in order for them to skydive safely. Just remember It must be totaly custom and unique while at the same time being exactly like all of your friends following the latest trends at the drop zone so that you may follow the path of compleat freedom and createtivity which is "Freeflying". I hope I have explained the necasary requirements for a rig to "Freefly Friendly" so that you too can join the sport of compleat acceptance and freedom for otherwise none of your friends will jump with you.

Lee

thank you, a work of art

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[Unstable 9]

I'm pretty sure this guy's on Drugs...

=========Shaun ==========

[hookitt 1]

Here's another serious answer so it may have to be put up somewhere above the not serious answers since that part of questions and answers is over.

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>Velcro though can maintain its "freefly friendliness" if its kept in
>somewhat decent shape. Velcro is strong in many applications.

I agree! Unfortunately, it has been my experience that most skydivers do not keep it in somewhat decent shape.

Natrually velcro is good in many applications. It's a generic statement. "that car is in remarkable condition for it's age" ... same thing. That age may be 28 years with 300,000 miles on it.

Not all small racers are like Jarrett's. SOME velcro closed rigs can be decent freefly friendliness and some will never be freefly friendly. In a head down orientation, It is a fact that a larger velcro closed racer will still allow wind to get into the top of the rig where the side closes. It will peel open no matter how good the velcro is. A Tear Drop tends to stay shut. Almost all Velcro closed Racers do not fit that category.

----
Short answer.

All parts of the rig just needs to stay shut until you open it. The rig must stay secure against the body. and not have easy access handles for others to dislodge.

My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto

[hookitt 1]

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Also a rig that does not rely on velcro for this to happen.

Cool. Thats your obinion. I disagree. but I do agree with most of you in saying freefly friendly is where your shit doesn't come apart in freefall regardless of body position and speed (within reason).

Velcro though can maintain its "freefly friendliness" if its kept in somewhat decent shape. Velcro is strong in many applications.

Jarrett. Your rig is micro. I jumped Levin's rig years ago because it's small and secure just like yours. Air wasn't able to just get in and peel open brand new velcro.

His main flap was modified to stay mostly shut.

My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto

[mcordell 2]

So what gear did the freak brothers jump? I suppose that would be freefly friendly since they started freeflying (freakflying).

How many premature deployments have been caused by a flap coming open while freeflying when the closing loop was appropriately tight in the rig. Just curious

www.facebook.com/FlintHillsRigging

[lilchief 1]

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I'm pretty sure this guy's on Drugs...

nope, but extremely bored at the moment snarf snarf

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How many premature deployments...

This is not reagarding the flap but we had a guy in my club who's BOC was to loose. PC came out in sit, in front of his arm and as the canopy came out it slammed his arm to the helmet. Broke his upper arm and now has neural damage and the arm is somewhat useless BOC are "freefly friendly". But a sad reminder that what's ok in belly flying might not be safe in headup/headdown flying.

"Once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been and there you long to return." - Da Vinci
www.lilchief.no

[hookitt 1]

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So what gear did the freak brothers jump? I suppose that would be freefly friendly since they started freeflying (freakflying).

How many premature deployments have been caused by a flap coming open while freeflying when the closing loop was appropriately tight in the rig. Just curious

Sincere question: Do you think that past butt flying on whatever gear was available has any bearing on the reason better gear has come to market? Is butt flying anything like what people are capable of doing today?

I would butt fly in a Vector 2 however I won't freefly or do freestyle in it. I've witnessed plenty of premature openings and malfunctions on Vector2, Javelin, Racer velcro rigs. Bruised and broken body parts went along with a few of those. We, learned quickly that certain configurations are not safe.

So, Is it relevant to what is safe now? Are those rigs appropriate for how people fly now? That's a rhetorical question by the way since the answer is no.

My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto

[mcordell 2]

wow, ok. Well, if you'll notice, i was actually asking a question about the frequency of premature deployments due to freeflying. Though you tried hard NOT to answer my question and attack me instead, you did actually provide some useful information regarding premature deployments so thank you.

It's really not surprising that the use of an old rig could cause a premature deployment with copious amounts of exposed bridal velcroed to the outside of the rig. I was just curious how often this has actually led to premature deployments. Obviously the gear we use today is technologically superior to the gear used in the 80s. I wouldn't advocate the use of military surplus rounds for modern sport parachuting any more than I would advocate the use of a wonderhog for freeflying. I wasn't ACTUALLY saying that the gear used by the freak brothers would be appropriate for this use today, it was meant more as a sarcastic comment followed by a sincere question.

Way to help someone out that is seeking information

www.facebook.com/FlintHillsRigging

[RMURRAY 1]

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By far the most important facture in determining whether a rig is "Freefly Friendly" is how shiny it is....

best post I have read in some time!

[mcordell 2]

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How many premature deployments...

This is not reagarding the flap but we had a guy in my club who's BOC was to loose. PC came out in sit, in front of his arm and as the canopy came out it slammed his arm to the helmet. Broke his upper arm and now has neural damage and the arm is somewhat useless BOC are "freefly friendly". But a sad reminder that what's ok in belly flying might not be safe in headup/headdown flying.

It's interesting how something like a loose BOC can cause problems so quickly. Just goes to show how drastically things can change from belly flying to freeflying.

www.facebook.com/FlintHillsRigging

[hookitt 1]

Woops, let's try again. Actually that wasn't meant to attack. Sorry about that. I've been known to sound that way if I am in a hurry and don't proof read... see sigline, not only do I have refrigerator poetry grammar, but insults as well!

Seriously wasn't meant to attack. I also mis-read your post. Here's a better answer

I have no Idea how many but just a couple years in the mid 90's I watched a few, saw video of a few, just at my usual dropzone. It happened quite a bit as people progressed to faster and more *out of the ordinary* flying.

Some Javelins would let pilot chutes escape pretty easily. Vector riser covers would open and let toggles fly freefly... Javelins did that too but the riser covers are short so much less riser was exposed.

Racer: If the sides come open, the entire riser is exposed plus it will pull some lines from the main pack tray really causing a mess. I person viewed 1 extremely intense bag lock. The next was a video 5 minutes after it happened. If I recall, he did a double weedeater and the sides blasted open. Hmmm... If Rob Welts still has that video, maybe I can get it uploaded? No promises but I'll give it a shot. I can assure you the velcro was in perfect condition because it was changed the week prior.

One girl at our dz broke her arm and messed up her shoulder when a Javelin Pilot chute went under her arm during a sit.

I started with a 1990 talon classic. Freestyle and standing was my thing right off student status. By number 20, could hold it and keep it. Probably back slid but it was still a stand. It had a leg pouch. The PC NEARLY escaped so I had it changed to BOC. It would have sucked badly.

Freakbrothers jumped whatever they had. It's just what people did until an occasional problem was not occasional anymore.


Hopefully that is a much better answer. :)

My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto

[mcordell 2]

I never thought of the fact the risers could be exposed and start pulling lines out. That makes sense now that you say it. Also, with some of the higher performance canopies on the market, I can only imagine how bad it could be if one of the toggles came loose before opening and put someone into a hard spin with line twist etc.

I've never seen video of someone deploying prematurely because of freeflying an old rig but I have heard of it happening. I know speeds can get pretty high but I have no idea of exactly how high. I know that I have gone about 155 on my motorcycle and could feel a vast difference in wind pressure compared to the 130 or so I do in freefall so I can only imagine the pressure increases exponentially as speed increases.

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