Helping Broken Jumpers..

[Kris 0]

Okay, that's still $170,000 dollars. By what I pay, that's still 149 years. Try again.

Sky, Muff Bro, Rodriguez Bro, and
Bastion of Purity and Innocence!™

[flyclearjohn 0]

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You'll pay it yourself? I know someone who has over $680,000 in medical bills that, thankfully, their insurance took care of.

My insurance would, and my premium is only about $95 a month.

By your math, if I pocketed that $95 and put it towards paying off that kind of bill it would only take me, oh, 596 years to make it right.

Wow! That's some insurance ...and for only $95/mo. What policy and who with. I want some!

[flyclearjohn 0]

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For most little injuries I agree with you but say something happens like what happened to one of my good friends two years ago. She didn't even do anything wrong. She hit a dust devil on landing and it picked her up and threw her face first into the ground. She broke a LOT of bones in her face. It was awful. Intensive care, surgeries, etc. cost hundreds of thousands of dollars. Thank god she had insurance to cover most of it. She still had to dish a lot of money out herself.

If you don't have several hundred thousand sitting in the bank in case of emergencies then I'd say please, please get some kind of insurance. There are plans you can get just for emergencies that cost around $50 a month. It's worth it.

Shit I've already had 2 surgeries and an ER visit that total well over 150K. I couldn't have dished that out myself. Luckily I have insurance.

Point us in the direction of the $50/mo plans please.

[Kris 0]

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Wow! That's some insurance ...and for only $95/mo. What policy and who with. I want some!

It's subsidized by my employer. If I had to pay for it entirely it would be closer to $370 a month. I'm with Community Care insurance through them.

Sky, Muff Bro, Rodriguez Bro, and
Bastion of Purity and Innocence!™

[skymama 37]

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I feel the same way about single parents skydiving, but I won't let my narrow (perhaps) way of what I feel is responsible/irresponsible keep me from helping those in need.

Assuming that's directed at me since you replied to my name, my children have a very active father in their lives and we have joint custody.

In addition, nowhere did I ever say I wouldnt help one of my friends in need.

She is Da Man, and you better not mess with Da Man,
because she will lay some keepdown on you faster than, well, really fast. ~Billvon

[skymama 37]

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I admit it. I'm irresponsible. I don't have medical insurance and I skydive anyway. I justify that by flying a conservatively loaded canopy defensively and accept that if I screw up I'll be paying off the bills for the rest of my life.

You know I fly a big canopy also but that didn't help me last year when I rolled my ankle in Sebastian. I certainly didn't think I'd break my wrists on my first run down a mountain. I mean, freakin' 5 year olds were doing it!

With everything that has come up in 2005 alone, I've already had way more medical costs than what I will fork out in premiums this year and it's only April! When the New Year rolled around, I never expected any of it. My point is, you never know when shit is going to happen. Someone could crash into you in your car on your way to work. You could be laid up in the hospital for months and not only would you not have any income but you'd have a heap of bills to pay too!

Car, health and homeowner's insurance take up a huge amount of my income. I just make-do and cut corners elsewhere, like in my jump numbers. It is a choice for everyone and I think this will turn into a debate like the AAD threads. (I think everyone should have one of those too!)

She is Da Man, and you better not mess with Da Man,
because she will lay some keepdown on you faster than, well, really fast. ~Billvon

[skybytch 273]

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I certainly didn't think I'd break my wrists on my first run down a mountain. I mean, freakin' 5 year olds were doing it!

LMAO! Yeah, but they're a whole lot closer to the ground than you are - not as far to fall!

I look at having/not having insurance as a risk management thing - much like skydiving. Assess the risks I'm taking, reduce them where possible and accept those that I'm not willing to reduce/remove. I'm not going to spend damn near a week's take home pay every month on something that I may or may not use when that same amount of money will feed me and get me in the air a few times.

I chose to be poor when I started working in skydiving. It'd be nice if my current employer could offer me medical insurance but he wants the business to be profitable. Unless of course skydivers would be willing to pay more for jumpsuits so those of us who make them can have health insurance...

[skymama 37]

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Unless of course skydivers would be willing to pay more for jumpsuits so those of us who make them can have health insurance...

If all the jumpsuit manufacturers did it then we would have no choice. You should start a union!

She is Da Man, and you better not mess with Da Man,
because she will lay some keepdown on you faster than, well, really fast. ~Billvon

[Thanatos340 1]

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You should start a union!

Great!! Now all Jumpsuits will be made in India or China!!

Seriously, Best way to run a Company out of Business is to start a Union.

Dont like what an Employers is offering in the way of Benifits, Find another Job.

Back on track:
It seems everyone is focusing on Medical Bills and Insurance here..

How about a fundraiser to help someone eat for a while until they can work again??

In my mind that is something completely different.

I was amazed at how many people thought this was a Bad Idea.

[kelel01 1]

If you give them money, they'll do what they want with it.

Like Mary said, take them dinner or something. It's kind of like not giving money directly to the homeless, b/c they might buy booze.

If they run off with that money and pay their hospital bills and then still say, "I'm so hungry, and I don't have any money", then you're just caught in a cycle of helping them pay for everything.

Maybe I'm overanalyzing this, but money is money, and it can be allocated according to a person's wishes. Food is food, and can only be used to nourish a person's body. Take the money, buy him food, and then we're talking.

[slug 1]

Rather than a fundraiser to help pay medical bill why don't we pay a extra $1/jump so the DZ can "afford" to provide health insurance to their employee's.

Never happen the DZ needs the extra $1 to turn a profit

R.I.P.

[Lindsey 0]

I don't think that it's irresponsible for people to jump without insurance. It's a choice that each of us has to make based on our priorities and responsibilities in life. I only find it irresponsible if that person without insurance has some expectation that the rest of us will donate for medical bills when things go awry.

I don't have insurance right now, and I'm not jumping. Mostly that's because I have a young child though. The financial risk, if I were to get hurt, is too big right now. If I didn't have a little one, then I'd probably jump with or without insurance.

As far as paying for hospital bills yourself if you're injured??? That's a great concept, but you're highly unlikely to get the same care as a person with good health insurance.

linz

--
A conservative is just a liberal who's been mugged. A liberal is just a conservative who's been to jail

[kelel01 1]

And I don't think that anyone here thinks these people have an "expectation" that people will pay off their bills for them . . . but I think that's where it would lead.

[skybytch 273]

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but I think that's where it would lead.

What makes you think that? Why not assume that those who are irresponsible by your definition are willing to accept the possible consequences of their choices without expecting anyone to do jack for them?

I'm glad the people who helped me get back to California after I lost most of my stuff (and much of my sanity) in the hurricane last year didn't feel that I expected them to help me. It was my decision to move to hurricane land, it was my decision to live next to a river and not have renter's insurance, it was my decision to try to make a go of a gear store. When I was down to "stems and seeds" I didn't expect anyone to do anything... but they did anyway. And I'll be happily paying it forward for many years to come.

[kelel01 1]

I don't assume that they'd expect help, but I will assume that they will use that help as they please, which could lead to "endless" needing (as outlined in my post 2 prior to this one). It's a lot easier to spend someone else's money than your own.

Give them WHAT they need, not the MONEY TO GET what they need. Because they might use those means for what they WANT. It's the classic issue with charity.

[skybytch 273]

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I don't assume that they'd expect help, but I will assume that they will use that help as they please, which could lead to "endless" needing (as outlined in my post 2 prior to this one). It's a lot easier to spend someone else's money than your own.

I was handed cash so I could buy food and gas and stay in motels on the drive from FL to CA. It was far more difficult to spend that cash than it would have been had I earned it. I ate really cheap, I stayed at cheap motels and I looked for the lowest gas prices; had it been "my" money I'd have eaten better and stayed in nicer places.

If I'm going to help someone, I'm not going to put strings on the gift. They can use that help as they please, and they can define what their "needs" are any way they like. If they feel that they need a sixpack of beer more than a sammich, I hope they'd buy the sixpack.

[cbain 0]

If I was hurt, tons of medical bills and starving and someone gave me money out of the kindness of their heart.

I would eat before paying medical bills. If I don't have squat then they can sue me all they want and all they'll get is squat. But I got have food to survive.

And I'm surprised this hasn't come up but if you have no job, no money, no possessions to be sold for $, and huge medical bills why not file bankrupcty? Even with the bankrupcty laws getting tougher it's still not impossible. Not that it's right but it's a possible solution when there aren't many to choose from.

Christina

[kelel01 1]

Well, then, that's you (in both cases). Some people are not so responsible to spend the money wisely, and some people who give money would also like it to be used wisely.

And if I'm a bad person because I'd rather give my money to disadvantaged children or tsunami victims than someone who hurt themselves by their own accord, warm me up a seat in hell.

I'm HUMAN first, SKYDIVER second. There are PEOPLE with actual needs who should not be counted out just because they're not part of our "family".

[skybytch 273]

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Some people are not so responsible to spend the money wisely, and some people who give money would also like it to be used wisely.

So don't give to those who you don't think will spend it wisely.

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And if I'm a bad person because I'd rather give my money to disadvantaged children or tsunami victims than someone who hurt themselves by their own accord, warm me up a seat in hell.

I'm HUMAN first, SKYDIVER second. There are PEOPLE with actual needs who should not be counted out just because they're not part of our "family".

Didn't say that you're bad or wrong for how you choose to give. We all choose who we want to help and why.

When I needed help it came from people I knew, not from some charitable organization, and it was given out of friendship, not because I jump out of airplanes. In recognition of that, I'd now prefer those I help to be people I know. Whether someone is a skydiver or not has nothing to do with it - other than the fact that I seem to know more skydivers than I do non-skydivers.

[kelel01 1]

Ok, I see what you're saying, and I agree.


And clearly, trusting someone is part of my issue with donating here.

[mouth 0]

I'd heap rather help someone I know that is in need than a total stranger. I also am very cautious about helping someone that I don't feel is at least working to help themselves.

--
Hot Mama
At least you know where you stand even if it is in a pile of shit.

[MakeItHappen 15]

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Now, about donations for JFTC. The money goes to City of Hope. Do you think these women going through breast cancer would have wished that they got cancer? Some of that money also funds research to prevent cancer. The money you donate towards JFTC could save your mom, g/f, wife, aunt, sister, or daughter's life. Besides a warm feeling, what do I get when I donate to a skydiver that wasn't responsible? With JFTC, it's a 501C and I can write that money off on taxes.

SOME of the money donated to JFTC goes to City of Hope. The rest of it goes to pay for jumps, t-shirts, strippers, some bushes that never grew or were mowed over, glossy brochures, $8000 for web design, phone calls and other stuff.

You compare a donation to JFTC, where part of it pays for jumps and other recreational activities, to donating to someone that is injured as a tax break to a warm feeling.

.

.
Make It Happen
Parachute History
DiveMaker

[Thanatos340 1]

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disadvantaged children

Most of the money to any of those organizations NEVER gets anywhere near the Children.

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tsunami victims

Most Charities will not even accept money anymore for that. They ended up with way more than they needed and most of that will get eaten up by corrupt Government officials and Charity Overhead.

I kinda prefer the good old Hand the cash to someone you know truly needs it. If they Blow it something silly like medical Bills or Prescription Drugs or something stupid like that.. Well Never do it again.
But I would think that someone who absolutely NOTHING and cannot walk, muchless work, Might.. Just Might spend the money on Food before they handed it over to the Doctors.

Seriously.. If you have a friend that needs help, Help them if you can, However you can. We all do Stupid Shit. We learn and we move on. Fortunately when things are at their worst, most of us have friends who just might give the boost needed to get going again.

[kelel01 1]

Those were just examples of charities. I gave to the tsunami fund right after it happened.

And FYI, I'm desperately trying not to get personal here, so please don't entice me to.

[Thanatos340 1]

Jan.. Thank you for saying what I didnt have the balls to say.