Any Veterinarians out there? I could use some advise

[Keith 0]

Sorry for the very long post. If you want to skip all the detail just read the last paragraph.

One morning, two weeks ago, Scooter, one of my 5 ½ year old cats seemed a little groggy when he got up and didn’t want breakfast which was odd for him. I checked him out and he seemed fine, his nose was wet, but he just seemed groggy. I had some errands to run so I did them and came home to check on him. He was lying on the floor breathing very heavily so I rushed him in to his doctor. She examined him and immediately put him in an oxygen chamber. She told me his symptoms were indicative of congestive heart failure, pneumonia, or one other thing I don’t recall. She his condition was not good. She said she wanted to do some x-rays, a blood panel and CT scan. I told her he had a history of severe allergies. She said that was good to know because he had also considered the possibility of a severe asthma attack. The CT scan revealed a normal heart as best she could tell, but his lungs were full of fluid. She decided to treat him as though he were having an asthma attack, gave him an injectable steroid and monitored him for the rest of the day. She called to say he was ready to be picked up and said he seemed to be responding to the steroids, but was still very sick. When I went to pick him up she showed me before and after x-rays of his chest which showed his lungs were starting to clear. She gave me some prednisone tablets to give him starting that evening and recommended I keep a close eye on him that night and if his breathing did not improve to take him to a local ER she recommended (that’s another story I’ll share in another thread). A few hours later he was still having a difficult time breathing so I took him to the ER and explained the situation. The ER doctor wanted to run all the same tests Scooters primary doctor ran but I consented only to the x-rays since his heart looked normal in the earlier CT scan, and the blood panel results wouldn’t be back until after the results from the earlier blood draw. I asked that he be put in an oxygen chamber to help his breathing which they did right away. The ER doctor suggested an injectable bronchodilator which I agreed to. I called around 12 midnight to check on Scooter and the doctor told me he was in guarded condition and his chances were 50/50. I got a call at 6:30 the next morning saying Scooter didn’t make it that he had just passed away. When I told the doctor I’d be over right away to pick Scooter up and the Doctor seemed to discourage me saying they could make any arrangements I wanted. I said No I’d come pick him up. I was at the ER 15 minutes later with a quilt for them to place him in. I waited for about 15 to 20 minutes before they brought him out in the quilt. I took him out to my truck uncovered him hugged him and cried for a while. I noticed that full rigor had already set in which I thought was strange since he had passed only about an hour before. Being suspicious I went back that evening and picked up his e-rays and brought them to his primary care doctor for review. She said the latest x-rays were normal and seemed perplexed. I went home, called the ER doctor and told him I was suspicious of Scooter’s time of death. The ER doctor assured me that Scooter had indeed died when stated and that rigor can set in with in 5 minutes of death when an animal dies during respiratory distress.

The next day when Scooter’s blood results came back there were no white blood cells to speak of so his primary care doctor sent the results to a pathologist for review. The pathologist’s report stated that the probable cause of death was anaphylactic shock due to a severe allergic reaction. She, Scooter’s primary care doctor, posted the results on the internet asking for additional advice. All opinions came back the same as the first pathologist report. She told me they were confused because he was apparently responding to the steroid treatment and didn’t know why Scooter died.

After I got off the phone I reviewed the bill I received from the ER and noticed they had given Scooter a Furosemide injection so I got on line and found that Furosemide is given to treat, among other things, congestive heart failure. What? I thought the doctor was going to give Scooter a bronchodilator? During my research I found that too large a dose of Furosemide can cause heart palpitations and irregular pulse. When I brought Scooter to the ER a dog in very serious condition was brought in right after, and another was on its way suffering from an apparent poisoning – I overheard the nurse talking to the owner on the phone.

My question is, if the ER doctor was overwhelmed with patients all needing immediate care and had inadvertently given Scooter too large a dose of Furosemide could that have killed him?

Keith

Don't Fuck with me Keith - J. Mandeville

[mnealtx 0]

First off, let me say that I'm sorry you lost your cat... I know how devastating that can be.

Secondly, I'm not a vet - however, a side affect of a Lasix (Furosemide) overdose is hypotension - a dangerous lowering of blood pressure.

As much as I hate to say it, it *is* possible....

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[Michele 1]

Oh, Keith, how sad I am and how sorry I am for your loss. First, though, know that Scooter is not far away; look inside your heart and you'll feel his purr again and again, forever. What a hard loss.

Tron, a male cat I had for 19 years, passed away while I was bringing him into the vets office; literally as I removed him from the car, he passed. The vets did everything they could to revive him, but he was gone. They left the room and allowed me all the time I needed with my lovely Tronster Monster, to say good bye and I love you.

After I had been there about 10 minutes, I noticed that his body had entered a significant rigor state. I kissed him one last time, and left his body...because his heart had joined mine.

Rigor can happen that fast; I never would have thought it could, unless I had experienced it myself. Tron died from Congestive Heart Failure, even though his heart was all right; it was a buildup of fluid in the heart sac which prevented his heart from beating. I was torn apart; he was my buddy, nursing on my hand until the day he died...

I don't know what to tell you, other than emergency vets are emergency vets; and I'd rather never use them (although I've had to, many times). There's something about going to the regular vet that I prefer...

I don't know what happened to Scooter, but I do know that what happened is sad, and that you're hurting so badly right now. Whatever the result of your investigation, know that me and my (now)6 cats send our love and our purrs...and know also that Scooter is still living in your heart. PM me if you need to; my internet connection has been spotty at best, but I'll do my famdamnedest to get back to you ASAP.

Much love, my friend. Much, much love.

Ciels-
Michele

~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek
While our hearts lie bleeding?~

[tigra 0]

But Lasix is a diuretic, right? Wouldn't they use that for the fluid around the lungs? I had a cat with cardiomyopathy and when he showed signs of congestive heart failure (very similar to what Keith described, but I KNEW Milo had a bad heart) they treated him in an oxygen chamber and gave him lasix fpr the fluid around his heart. It did bring him around, but he was never able to bouce back (I think the meds were just too hard on his already weakened system) and I had to have him put down about a week after I took him home. Heartbreaking to say the least.

Keith, I am so sorry for your loss. I don't know what to say about the vet- if you've got a bad feeling you might be right OR it could be your grief talking. I know its hard to find someone you really like and trust for your pets and when you bring them for emergency care, sometimes you have to hand them over to strangers.

Sorry again, and I hope you find some answers.

maura

edited after re-reading Keith's post..........

[Keith 0]

Thanks everyone for the kind words and advise. The kind words bring comfort and the advise has given me something to think about.

Keith

Don't Fuck with me Keith - J. Mandeville

[NtheSeaOrSky 0]

Keith I am so sorry for your loss, but you gave Scooter the best possible chance with all you did for him, please trust in that.

The reason Furosemide works in heart failure is it makes the body clear the fluid that has acummulated in the lungs due to the heart's lack of ability to clear it itself with normal circulation. So while he was not 'in heart failure' the only way to clear the fluid (and quickly provide relief) would be to either draw it off physically (thoracentesis-which presents a WHOLE bunch more complications in an already compromised patient) or give the drug to make the body clear it (the safest option). It is highly effective, I have seen it help thousands of patients, and never had an adverse reaction to it (just makes them urinate A LOT more).

As for the details of rigor, I can explain that to you if you need to know via PM, just tell me. The time of death would be totally accurate, and you are correct in your thinking about the time it takes to set in, it has to do with the handling of the body (as required by law in most states) that, while not bad at all, would be hard for the average person upset at the loss of their friend to think about while dealing with the initial shock of learning he didn't make it.

Life is not fair and there are no guarantees...

[IanHarrop 43]

Sorry man, I can't offer any advise but I do want to say that I am sorry for your loss.

It sucks when you lose a friend. Be sure to get out with your other friends during this time to help the healing.

"Where troubles melt like lemon drops, away above the chimney tops, that's where you'll find me" Dorothy

[Gawain 0]

Sorry for your loss. Pets are great until you have to say goodbye to them.

Did they do an FIP test with the blood sample? I'm not 100%, but fluid build-up, runny nose are two symptoms. Was Scooter sneezing at all? I ask because we were doing stuff with out cat and these questions came up too. FIP is easily diagnosed as other illnesses.

This may not be an issue if they are indoor cats, but indoor/outdoor...

So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!

[Keith 0]

I can't remember if FIP was part of the blood panel done, but it was considered because we recently adopted a new cat from the pound. He didn't have a fever nor fluid build up in the abdomen so the doctor discounted it.

Keith

Don't Fuck with me Keith - J. Mandeville

[Nightingale 0]

OMG... Keith, I'm so sorry! ((((((((HUGS)))))))