Do you think the video footage of Irwin's death should be shown?

[PLFXpert 0]

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I'm not going to aruge with someone who has no clue.

I find it sad when people in a debate feel the need to resort to such things.

My time spent in this discussion with you has obviously been wasted. I will not make such mistakes again.

Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back.

[turtlespeed 226]

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the video footage of someone dying is a completely different thing

What IS and what IS NOT appropriate to present to the public was the original question. My photo example is relevant.

Good Lord.

By your logic, photos must "imply" everything. The photo, was in fact, taken during the execution. It doesn't "imply" anything. It is a freeze frame of a factual moment in time; not an implied one.

Some photos can be making an implication. The example I used was not.

I'm not going to aruge with someone who has no clue. the fact the the picture was taken during an execution is irelivant, the picture IS nothing more than a captured instance in time that can be inturpreted in many ways.
That is infact the beauty of still images. Once the image is captured the author (i.e. photographer) has lost the meaning to the viewer.
That same image could have well been captioned man almost shot in the head. From the image this CAN be implied.
THAT IS MY POINT

The picture is appropriate BECUASE it implies.
thank you for your time I'm now done

So - a person doing a tandem and exiting a plane didn't neccessarily exit the plane - it just implies that they did.

Even when subsequesnt pictures shown in a sequential time line, show the person in freefall, and then landing. But they actually never jumped - they just implied that they did.

right.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[turtlespeed 226]

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I'm not going to aruge with someone who has no clue.

I find it sad when people in a debate feel the need to resort to such things.

My time spent in this discussion with you has obviously been wasted. I will not make such mistakes again.

Awwwe, Poor Bobbi . . .

Let me make it better . . .

"BOOBIES!" "Tits" "Melons"

Is that better?

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[ImGunnaJump 0]

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They post accidents on Americas Worst Police Chases where bodies are flung from cars off bridges and overpasses. They show terrorists beheading people. The news shows provide coverage of blood stains all over the sidewalk during the OJ trial. And they show burned and crispified flesh at the scenes of bombings and plane crashes.

Why is this any different?

The difference is that the Viet Nam photo, the beheadings, the results of bombings, and even of plane crashes, though ghastly, will all cause our society to think and then act according to what their conscience tells them is right - should we continue our participation in this war or not? Should I vote for that senator or this one? Do I want congress to enact a new law to prevent this from happening again? This reevaluation that a photo (or video) can bring has value to the world because it can create change for the better.

Showing car crashes of bank robbers and drunks dying while evading the police does not create change for the better. O.J. Simpson's case, though it could be argued that it had at least a little redeeming value by highlighting domestic violence, appealed to those with a morbid fascination of other people's lives/deaths for entertainment. These types of shows/cases are aired and re-aired on T.V. by unscrupulous Hollywood producers who want to make money on someone else's death - it's not personal to them so who cares, right??

Irwin's death, though very tragic, will not cause someone to be voted out of office, or cause protest marches to ensue, change foreign policy, change environmental policy... will not really even educate the public about stingrays, etc., so airing his death video will not edify the public in any way.

And by the way, his death will also not cause anyone with a brain to go out and start killing all the stingrays.

"...I've learned that while the "needs" in life are important (food, water, shelter), it's the "wants" in life (ice cream, chocolate, sex) that make it worth the effort." Kbordson

[PLFXpert 0]

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Awwwe, Poor Bobbi . . .

Ehhhh. Emmmmm.

I bet this isn't the first time this has happened to you, huh?

Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back.

[turtlespeed 226]

So you missed the sarcasm then.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[PLFXpert 0]

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So - a person doing a tandem and exiting a plane didn't neccessarily exit the plane - it just implies that they did.

I think a better/more clear example would be:

In my avatar, is it safe to conclude I am descending or is it simply implied?

Certainly some photos make implications. And I support the whole "question everything" philosophy. In the case of the Vietnam execution photo and my avatar, however, knowledge ceases to make these photos implications. Instead one can view them w/ certainty.


Edit: Of course none of this has anything to do w/ my original point. Instead this was the detail that apparently was concentrated on; and I decided to refute. And so we are way off topic.

Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back.

[PLFXpert 0]

I must still be missing it.

<---doesn't get it.

Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back.

[turtlespeed 226]

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So - a person doing a tandem and exiting a plane didn't neccessarily exit the plane - it just implies that they did.

I think a better/more clear example would be:

In my avatar, is it safe to conclude I am descending or is it simply implied?

It would be implied, unless your feet aren't actually on the sears tower.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[PLFXpert 0]

Bang. Dead.

Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back.

[steveorino 7]

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Though it was surely very difficult for John F. Kennedy's family when the footage of his death was released, that footage is of such historical significance that I believe there was merit in making it public

I was thinking of using that as an example, too, but it doesn't quite illustrate my point that sometimes such footage or photos are merited.

During the Vietnam war, the attached photo was published publicly and became almost instantly famous.

I'd be curious to know what people's thoughts are on it and other examples of that nature.

That Pulitzer Winning photo was instrumental in changing public opinion of the war. Of course what wasn't said was this Police Chief was executing a Vie Cong man who raped and killed members of the Police Chief's family. There is a video of the execution, little hole, little blood sputing out and the prisoner falling to the ground. IMHO the photo said more than the video.

steveOrino

[PLFXpert 0]

Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back.

[SkydiveStMarys 0]

I was wondering...does this friend have small kids? Are the kids really upset with what happened? I mean I could understand his reaction if the kids are struggling with the "understanding of the situation". But as a parent canceling the trip because of this is only feeding the fear of his family. I think that is just really really sad. People who are "ignorant" to the facts of the situation, ie..string rays "flee rather then fight" and let fear run their lives, well they are just stupid.

There I said it.

Bobbi

A miracle is not defined by an event. A miracle is defined by gratitude.

[jimmytavino 16]

I never knew there to be a 'video' of this incident.. but I do seem to recall seeing the Photograph back when it was first printed,,,and seem to remember that a slight puff of smoke was captured on film....coming from the handgun. (tough to see in PLFXperts attachment)
THAT was what was so impacting to anyone who saw the image... back in the days before "frame grabs"...
jmy

[selbbub78 0]

i just read about this, and can't believe this! I used to love watching him on TV when I had the chance. As for the video... i dunno. I have mixed feelings about it. Why do people want to see something as morbid as the last minutes of someone before they die? I dunno. What are they going to do with it in time? Show it to his kids? I seriously don't think I'd want that to happen.


CReW Skies,
bubbles

"Women fake orgasms - men fake whole relationships" – Sharon Stone
"The world is my dropzone" (wise crewdog quote)
"The light dims, until full darkness pierces into the world."-KDM

[PLFXpert 0]

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THAT was what was so impacting to anyone who saw the image

Exactly. The point (my original one before the tangent) is desired impact; be it a photo or video published publicly. (I myself have not seen the video, either. But there was, in fact, video footage.)

Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back.

[Douva 0]

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"Now that this has happened, more and more people are going to feel that the stingray is a deadly animal that should be feared, hunted as a prize or just killed for "safety". "

I think you are "reaching" with that comment. I have no little knowledge about sting rays but after hearing about this incident, I don't want to go out and kill every one I see and I see quite a few when I head to the beach on the weekends. There is risk in everything that one does.

I think it was what is was described as being a freak accident. The Ray was startled and when it went to swim off it thrusted its tail upward. Steve's shadow could have spooked it.

Bobbi

LOL

Think again - a friend of mines family, after hearing the news just this morning, cancelled their beach vacation because there are Rays that are known to frequent the area. It has already started.

I told him I thought he was over reacting, but it's his family.

I bet your friend is one of those people who drives five hours one way and waits in line for ninety minutes to buy Power Ball lottery tickets, isn't he?

I don't have an M.D. or a law degree. I have bachelor's in kicking ass and taking names.

[PLFXpert 0]

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after hearing the news just this morning, cancelled their beach vacation because there are Rays that are known to frequent the area.

There's a thread here somewhere where you and I were just discussing the clearness of the water and the more frequent visits of the rays.

I see them all the time. I love seeing them. I love to watch them ride the waves.

Of course, that's just me.

Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back.

[turtlespeed 226]

I'm not disagreeing - I like feeding them - it's fun and entertaining.

No, Douva, he's not one of those - it ends up that it was placating his wife and she was the one that didn't want to go any more.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[SkydiveStMarys 0]

Me too...I am alittle farther up from you on the beach!

I saw a mom freaking out, yanking her kids out of the water, told two teenagers to go get the lifegaurds. I asked the two teens what was going on and they said that she found two sting rays in the water. The lifegaurd told her to go back to her beer. She was on the phone to her husband, crying afraid that she would get bit.

I just don't get that reaction, UNLESS she has never saw one, knows nothing about them, which COULD BE a possiblity, but still

Bobbi

A miracle is not defined by an event. A miracle is defined by gratitude.

[shropshire 0]

NO...No...No... Death is NOT an spectator sport. There is nothing to be gained from watching anyone die.

.

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[masterrig 1]

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No! I can see no good, from watching someone die! Maybe, executions should be held in giant stadiums and sell popcorn and cotton-candy! I wish too, the media would show some different footage of him, other than the footage with he and his son and the crocodile. JMO!


Chuck

Isn't that exactly how executions are still being done in some parts of the world?

Not that I think the video should be shown, but I wouldn't be at all surprised if it was- either publicly or through some sort of internet "leak". And I also wouldn't be surprised if that's something he would have wanted. But that doesn't mean I think it would be a good thing.

_____________________________________

Well, we may never know what he had in mind. Only he can say and he's not talkin'!


Chuck

[shropshire 0]

<> -

There's lots of shite on t'interweb, that doesn't mean that I have to search it out and watch it.... Now, boobies on the other hand.

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[PLFXpert 0]

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Me too...I am alittle farther up from you on the beach!

You mean Georgia is NORTH of Florida???

That's just crazy.

Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back.

[SkydiveStMarys 0]

Yeah BUT I go to the beach in Florida!

Don't get smart with me Missy!






Bobbi

A miracle is not defined by an event. A miracle is defined by gratitude.