Seriously folks, do your own research on meds!

[Muenkel 0]

Many of you know that I had a serious brain injury 3 years ago in which I am still in recovery. I am on a number of neurological medications. For quite a while I have been having problems sleeping. Everytime I get into the R.E.M. stage of sleep I have extremely vivid dreams that always involve really frustrating and exhausting situations. I wake up with a pounding headache. This has left me completely exhausted. I called my internist and he has no clue. I called my neurologist and she has no clue. I deduced that maybe it had to do with medication interaction. I did my own research on the internet and did not find anything that answered this particular question. However, I did learn that a specific medication I am on has some pretty severe side effects, namely extreme weight gain, increase in cholesterol and episodes involving loss of consciousness. Over the past two years, I have lost consciousness over 100 times and have been rushed by ambulance to the ER 12 times. Last July I spent 2 nights in ICU. Neither of my doctors connected the dots and figured that maybe this was due to the medication. None of the ER docs connected these dots either. I have been gaining weight at a very rapid pace, despite the fact that I never had a weight problem, and I have been watching everything I eat. I will be having my cholesterol checked on Monday and I am also seeing my neurologist. I'm going to find out how I can come off this medication safely. I always read the printout the pharmacy provides, but that didn't mention these side effects at all. I am enormously pissed right now. The last 3 years have been extremely difficult and now I'm dealing with these issues.

My point of this whole thread is to encourage all of you to do your own research when it comes to meds. Check www.webmd.com or some other medical website. In my case, it seems that none of my doctors took the time to do their homework. This is not a slam on doctors. I know there are some really great ones out there...my cousin is one of them. When it comes to your health, you got to take control for yourself.

Chris

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Chris

[freeflir29 0]

Wow..............I think I would be calling a lawyer if I was you.

[Squeak 17]

With each set of med that you're on were to told the SEs or were you given the Drugs Info sheet?
We have a duty of disclosure here Doc have to privde you with the possible implcations of the meds they prescribe

You are not now, nor will you ever be, good enough to not die in this sport (Sparky)
My Life ROCKS!
How's yours doing?

[mnealtx 0]

I hope you can get things straightened out with that med and that it improves things for you... stay strong, buddy!!

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[Muenkel 0]

Quote

Wow..............I think I would be calling a lawyer if I was you.

I haven't thought of that because I am too involved in getting this resolved. I'm not sure this would be considered malpractice as there has been no permanent damage...as of yet. Although there has been a hell of a lot of pain and suffering.

Chris

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Chris

[Muenkel 0]

Quote

With each set of med that you're on were to told the SEs or were you given the Drugs Info sheet?
We have a duty of disclosure here Doc have to privde you with the possible implcations of the meds they prescribe

Squeek, here in the U.S. the doc can just prescribe a med with just giving you basic information; ie: what they are prescribing the med for. You can ask all the questions you want, but if the doc hasn't studied the med you may not get all the answers. The pharmacist does provide an info sheet with info about drug interactions and side effects. However, in the case of this particular med, these side effects were never provided.

Chris

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Chris

[Squeak 17]

Quote

Quote

With each set of med that you're on were to told the SEs or were you given the Drugs Info sheet?
We have a duty of disclosure here Doc have to privde you with the possible implcations of the meds they prescribe

Squeek, here in the U.S. the doc can just prescribe a med with just giving you basic information; ie: what they are prescribing the med for. You can ask all the questions you want, but if the doc hasn't studied the med you may not get all the answers. The pharmacist does provide an info sheet with info about drug interactions and side effects. However, in the case of this particular med, these side effects were never provided.

Chris

Damn Chris, that's fucked up man. Hope it works out ok for you

You are not now, nor will you ever be, good enough to not die in this sport (Sparky)
My Life ROCKS!
How's yours doing?

[Muenkel 0]

Thanks. And thanks to Mike as well.

Chris

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Chris

[freeflir29 0]

Quote

Although there has been a hell of a lot of pain and suffering.

BINGO$$$$

Quote

there has been no permanent damage

All that passing out and weight gain haven't done anything permanent? Ummm............I think I would get a second opinion on that one.

[sunshine 2]

Sorry for all the crap you've been through. I'm just glad you're still with us buddy.

___________________________________________
meow

I get a Mike hug! I get a Mike hug!

[SkydiveStMarys 0]

Aaaah ChrisI am sorry to hear about this. I hope it all gets straightened out ASAP. With those types of Doctors, who needs enemies??

I have always said that the patient is the best advocate when it comes to YOUR OWN health care!


Bobbi

A miracle is not defined by an event. A miracle is defined by gratitude.

[NWFlyer 2]

Chris, first of all, sorry to hear that you've been through so much, and I hope that you do find that it is the meds causing the problem.

I also appreciate you not doing a blanket "doctor slam" because they are in a very tough position when it comes to evaluating medications. There are a lot of factors involved...

1) as you found out, the information that *is* out there is often incomplete. Clinical trials are an inexact science to start, and all possible side effects may not have even been discovered.

2) Docs are amazingly busy and there's lots of new drugs coming out every year - it would be damn near impossible to be fully versed on everything. Often the only info they get is from the drug rep who comes by and brings free pens and post-it pads and presents the drug in its most flattering light.

It's a tough balance. I'm all for patients educating themselves and it sounds like you did it in the best possible way. Of course, the negative flip side of that is someone seeing an ad in Readers Digest, self-diagnosing, and badgering the doc till they get the "miracle drug."

"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

[Squeak 17]

Quote

2) Docs are amazingly busy and there's lots of new drugs coming out every year - it would be damn near impossible to be fully versed on everything. Often the only info they get is from the drug rep who comes by and brings free pens and post-it pads and presents the drug in its most flattering light.

if they dont have a good understanding of the drug they should NOT be prescribing it. Pure and simple ,

Australia, does thier own trials on drugs before releasing them even if they are available in places like the sates. From your description, I can see why

You are not now, nor will you ever be, good enough to not die in this sport (Sparky)
My Life ROCKS!
How's yours doing?

[NWFlyer 2]

Squeak, you are amazingly naive if you believe that every doc in Australia is more informed than docs in the US.

Physicians are human. Some probably cut corners and go with the drug whose rep has the best pens (yes, even in Australia). But I believe that most docs try to process all the information available the best they can and make the best choices for their patients.

Even the most perfect drug trial is not going to account for every possible drug interaction and the impact a drug will have on every patient given that patient's unique physiology and combination of illnesses. I am NOT an expert on this - I'm sure others like micro could shed a lot more light on this. But the fact is, even the most extensive clinical trials are going to end up with a very limited set of data from which doctors make the choices to prescribe or not.

Is the US's clinical trial system perfect? Nope. But I doubt yours is, either.

"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

[NWFlyer 2]

Quote

However, in the case of this particular med, these side effects were never provided.

Again, I'd have to defer to the experts on this, but I believe that if a side effect is not disclosed in the specific patient information, it means that it wasn't discovered in the clinical trial process.

I am not naive enough to believe our clinical trial process is perfect, or that it is not influenced by politics and money. But if you have searched extensively and can't find any documented evidence of side effects, it seems reasonable that your physician wouldn't be able to, either.

I'm sorry for what you're going through, and I commend you for doing that research and for "thinking out of the box" to consider that the meds might be causing your problems rather than treating them. I hope that when you are able to taper off the meds that your side effects go away. But if the information about these side effects doesn't exist anywhere in the scientific / professional literature, I think anyone calling "Malpractice" is being reactionary. (I just reread and it's not clear where you got the info about the possible side effects, so this previous statement may be an incorrect assumption).

If I'm missing something in your story, let me know.

"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

[bloody_trauma 2]

muenkel if you wouldnt mind could you pm me the meds you are on, i've got a drug book on hand and can look at the hard facts on these meds, mebmd is great but not overly thorough. also i recommend giving the patient privacy act statement a read, the hospital should advise you of your rights to medical information when you come to them. you can view it here
http://www.hhs.gov/news/facts/privacy.html

but yeah its your medical history and if your not comfortable sharing that info thats your right, so if you need it i got tons of medical texts... i'm not a doctor but in the army i fall somewhere between a PA and an RN with my level of training, certifications and experience.

Fly it like you stole it

[Muenkel 0]

Krisanne,

I can see where you're coming from in regard to this issue. The only reason I am posting this is to help someone. Remind people to take their own medical safety into their own hands. I have no plans to take this to a lawyer. I could put some blame on myself. I could have done this research before I put any of this medication in my system instead of postwhoring on dz.com.

But, consider this: You have a patient who has been brought to the ER on an average of once every other month. He's in and out of consciousness. You know he is gaining weight rapidly. You know that in the 13 years of treating him prior, he has never gained weight like this. It is my opinion that a good doctor, busy or not, would research this. Hell, I found this information in about 10 minutes on the internet and I have no medical training. It is my opinion that my doctor is asleep on the job. And right now I am really concerned as to how high my cholesterol might be.

Chris

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Chris

[jojo69 0]

I am sorry to hear of your injury. I can tell you from experience that all meds have side effects. However, when a drug has a side effect of nausea, and you have nausea, that does not mean that that particular drug gave it to you. With your history, you should consult your doctor.

I work in a nursing home and the residents there have thier meds reviewed by thier doctor and a licensed pharmacist every 30 days. That does not promise that the residents will not have side effects. Every person is special and meds react differently in every one.

Good luck and keep up the great spirits.

[Muenkel 0]

David, I appreciate your offer to help. I had a long talk with my pharmacist yesterday and I am pretty confident that I know what the culprit is. She gave me more info on my meds than any of my doctors. On monday I am planning to ask my neurologist to take me off one particular med. I have hope that in time I will see the extra weight drop off me. I am most concerned about the cholesterol. I really don't need a premature heart attack or stroke at this time.

Chris

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Chris

[NWFlyer 2]

Chris - I hope that I'm not coming off as unsympathetic to your situation. It sounds like your doctor did miss something obvious and you of course have every right to be frustrated and angry, especially given how long you've been dealing with this.

And I absolutely agree that we should not be blindly obedient to what our doctors suggest. There really is an enormous amount of information out there, and I TOTALLY believe that patient care has to be a partnership. I'm not going to go to any doctor (for long, anyway) who isn't willing to work with me. When I was in rehab after my accident (not nearly as long and grueling a process as yours, but it's the closest thing I can approximate) I pushed back on my whole medical team all the time. My regular primary care doc didn't seem to think I needed much PT. I disagreed and worked with a sports medicine doc who put me on aggressive PT. That aggressive PT helped identify a previously-undiagnosed shoulder injury related to the accident. Had I accepted my first doc's approach, I might still be dealing with that pain. Am I angry with her? Not really - I just took my business elsewhere for acute rehab needs. I stuck with her for the routine stuff - something her practice does very well.

So I am totally with you on that, believe me. I just get frustrated with the rush to "Sue 'em" that seems to be prevalent in any issue where a doctor performs less-than-perfectly. Malpractice is malpractice and it most certainly exists. But the vast majority of stuff resides in that big-old gray area where we have humans being human. That was more frustration at other posters, not you.

"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

[Muenkel 0]

Krisanne,

Good on you for getting that shoulder taken care of.

I think we're on the same page in regard to this issue. Like I said before, I have no plans on suing anyone. The only reason I have for posting this is in hopes that maybe I can help someone else. Meds can be extremely dangerous and I believe a vast majority of people just blindly trust their docs and put these chemicals into their mouths.

My pharmacist was a huge help to me and I'm sending her a gift basket as a thank-you.

Chris

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Chris

[NWFlyer 2]

Quote

My pharmacist was a huge help to me and I'm sending her a gift basket as a thank-you.

That's awesome! So many people don't take advantage of the knowledge that pharmacists have (I know I don't do it often enough). They have so much knowledge and lots of them never get a chance to really share it. I know I'm guilty of "yeah yeah just give me my meds" when I pick up stuff at the pharmacy, but that's because I rarely start anything new or that has particularly complex instructions and/or side effects. It's still good to know they're looking out for me and other patients and reminding them "hey, take this with food" or "this is a narcotic, you might want to grab a stool softener to go with it" or "remember, take the full course of antibiotics and don't drink."

They really can be a font of wisdom - use them.

"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

[Lindsey 0]

Most medicines have a long, long list of possible side effects. I don't go through all of them with every patient. I do go over common side effects and serious (no matter how uncommon) side effects. I agree that when you showed up in the ER, the medication list and possible side effects and interactions should have been reviewed. Maybe they were.... I don't know. Glad you're getting to the bottom of it though.

linz

--
A conservative is just a liberal who's been mugged. A liberal is just a conservative who's been to jail

[Squeak 17]

Quote

Squeak, you are amazingly naive if you believe that every doc in Australia is more informed than docs in the US.

Not evey Doc no, but ALL meds I have ever been prescribed have had the possible side effect explained to me, moreover they ALL came with detailed information on the product with a list of all known side effects, and contra-indications. One of the main reason Doctors should know more about what they push is that some drugs in combination with other drugs have devastating results.
SO BTFU
Thank you for reading

You are not now, nor will you ever be, good enough to not die in this sport (Sparky)
My Life ROCKS!
How's yours doing?

[kbordson 8]

Quote

Remind people to take their own medical safety into their own hands. I have no plans to take this to a lawyer. I could put some blame on myself.

Chris, I wish more patients had this level of personal responsibility and interest in his/her health. I'm always a bit saddened when patients come in and don't even know what meds they're on.

Squeak... sometimes doesn't matter how much you "teach" someone about their meds when all they hear is "Blood pressure medicine" and "Diabetes medicine." Luckily now... I'll just mainly be limited to drugs "safe" in pregnancy.

Quote

But, consider this: You have a patient who has been brought to the ER on an average of once every other month. He's in and out of consciousness. You know he is gaining weight rapidly. You know that in the 13 years of treating him prior, he has never gained weight like this. It is my opinion that a good doctor, busy or not, would research this. Hell, I found this information in about 10 minutes on the internet and I have no medical training. It is my opinion that my doctor is asleep on the job. And right now I am really concerned as to how high my cholesterol might be.

Chris

Sorry you had to experience all that.

Karen