2shay 0 #26 March 10, 2007 simple, i have seen a hard pull and the guy almost died because he was jumping soft housing risers and could not cut away. This is one of those things that is an easy fix. They will not hurt you to jump with them, they only prevent a possible catastrophe. When you get line twists the cable can be twisted so hard that it is pinched together which creates a hard cutaway or no cutaway, the hard housings have been proven to prevent this. Why risk it is my question to all? Joeldon't try your bullshit with me!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RMURRAY 1 #27 March 10, 2007 Quotebecause he was jumping soft housing risers Quote where is the proof... rm Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites 2shay 0 #28 March 10, 2007 first it will reduce the risk, correct myself there. second, type "hard housings skydiving" on google and click on the first article you come to this proves the cutaway force is less with the hard housings. Third, type "hard housings preventing hard pull skydiving" in google and click the red zone the second article in that search, and it will tell you in the 7th line of hard cutaway section that it will reduce the risk. Joeldon't try your bullshit with me!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites RMURRAY 1 #29 March 10, 2007 Quotefirst it will reduce the risk, correct myself there. second, type "hard housings skydiving" on google and click on the first article you come to this proves the cutaway force is less with the hard housings. Third, type "hard housings preventing hard pull skydiving" in google and click the red zone the second article in that search, and it will tell you in the 7th line of hard cutaway section that it will reduce the risk. Joel that first article is about soft vs hard housings in the rig not in the risers. I want to see independant test results of that "2 bloke test". 2 extra guys hanging from a hanging harness, type 17 twisted risers, with and without a properly cleaned and lubed yellow cable. Also, throw in a racer with racer risers (no hard housings) and with the red cable to prove they are not necessarily needed. rm Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Hooknswoop 19 #30 March 10, 2007 QuoteI want If you think that riser inserts aren't needed, that's OK. I am not going to waste my time trying to convince you. The information is out there. You can find it, or not. You are not hurting anyone else if you don't have riser inserts. Derek Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites RMURRAY 1 #31 March 10, 2007 fair enough. one last point, according to john s at jumpshack the root cause of the problem is increased friction between yellow cable and loop caused by the increased g loading and especially by the side loading of the 3 ring. trapping of the cable in the channel was minor. This was tested by conducting the 2 bloke test with the cutaway cable bypassing the loop but routed into the channel. The best solution is to use a CLEAN and LUBED yellow cable or (for a racer) use the red teflon cable. cutaway forces will be high but managable. rm Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites 2shay 0 #32 March 10, 2007 the guy who had the hard cuutaway was jumping a velo a lttile but smaller than your vx and he really could have died. WHY take the risk? Anyway whatever you decide I really hope that you are careful. Joeldon't try your bullshit with me!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites hookitt 1 #33 March 10, 2007 Having been the recipient of a nearly impossible cutaway, I would not be willing to take the chance of jumping without them anymore. Specifically, the risers were twisted enough to pin my head down. That made it rather easy to see the cutaway and reserve handle which was nice. The handle was already peeled from the Velcro, so that had nothing to do with it. It took both hands and a huge portion of adrenaline enhanced strength to finish the cutaway. If that same thing happened to a person of similar weight and low upper body strength, the following options would have been available 1) Pass out. Body goes limp. Damage from impact might be lessened due to the relaxed state. The impact site was not very cushy so major debilitating injuries or death caused by impact trauma was probable. 2) Pull the reserve ripcord and cross your fingers.My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites hookitt 1 #34 March 10, 2007 Quotethe guy who had the hard cuutaway was jumping a velo a lttile but smaller than your vx and he really could have died. WHY take the risk? Anyway whatever you decide I really hope that you are careful. Joel I was under a Stiletto at approximately 1.4 wingload. That was nothing compared to being spun up under something smaller and faster.My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites 2shay 0 #35 March 10, 2007 thanks man this whole thread really bugged me from what I was seeing being posted.don't try your bullshit with me!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 Next Page 2 of 2 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. 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2shay 0 #28 March 10, 2007 first it will reduce the risk, correct myself there. second, type "hard housings skydiving" on google and click on the first article you come to this proves the cutaway force is less with the hard housings. Third, type "hard housings preventing hard pull skydiving" in google and click the red zone the second article in that search, and it will tell you in the 7th line of hard cutaway section that it will reduce the risk. Joeldon't try your bullshit with me!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RMURRAY 1 #29 March 10, 2007 Quotefirst it will reduce the risk, correct myself there. second, type "hard housings skydiving" on google and click on the first article you come to this proves the cutaway force is less with the hard housings. Third, type "hard housings preventing hard pull skydiving" in google and click the red zone the second article in that search, and it will tell you in the 7th line of hard cutaway section that it will reduce the risk. Joel that first article is about soft vs hard housings in the rig not in the risers. I want to see independant test results of that "2 bloke test". 2 extra guys hanging from a hanging harness, type 17 twisted risers, with and without a properly cleaned and lubed yellow cable. Also, throw in a racer with racer risers (no hard housings) and with the red cable to prove they are not necessarily needed. rm Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hooknswoop 19 #30 March 10, 2007 QuoteI want If you think that riser inserts aren't needed, that's OK. I am not going to waste my time trying to convince you. The information is out there. You can find it, or not. You are not hurting anyone else if you don't have riser inserts. Derek Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RMURRAY 1 #31 March 10, 2007 fair enough. one last point, according to john s at jumpshack the root cause of the problem is increased friction between yellow cable and loop caused by the increased g loading and especially by the side loading of the 3 ring. trapping of the cable in the channel was minor. This was tested by conducting the 2 bloke test with the cutaway cable bypassing the loop but routed into the channel. The best solution is to use a CLEAN and LUBED yellow cable or (for a racer) use the red teflon cable. cutaway forces will be high but managable. rm Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
2shay 0 #32 March 10, 2007 the guy who had the hard cuutaway was jumping a velo a lttile but smaller than your vx and he really could have died. WHY take the risk? Anyway whatever you decide I really hope that you are careful. Joeldon't try your bullshit with me!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hookitt 1 #33 March 10, 2007 Having been the recipient of a nearly impossible cutaway, I would not be willing to take the chance of jumping without them anymore. Specifically, the risers were twisted enough to pin my head down. That made it rather easy to see the cutaway and reserve handle which was nice. The handle was already peeled from the Velcro, so that had nothing to do with it. It took both hands and a huge portion of adrenaline enhanced strength to finish the cutaway. If that same thing happened to a person of similar weight and low upper body strength, the following options would have been available 1) Pass out. Body goes limp. Damage from impact might be lessened due to the relaxed state. The impact site was not very cushy so major debilitating injuries or death caused by impact trauma was probable. 2) Pull the reserve ripcord and cross your fingers.My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hookitt 1 #34 March 10, 2007 Quotethe guy who had the hard cuutaway was jumping a velo a lttile but smaller than your vx and he really could have died. WHY take the risk? Anyway whatever you decide I really hope that you are careful. Joel I was under a Stiletto at approximately 1.4 wingload. That was nothing compared to being spun up under something smaller and faster.My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
2shay 0 #35 March 10, 2007 thanks man this whole thread really bugged me from what I was seeing being posted.don't try your bullshit with me!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
