Gear questions

[RB_Hammer 0]

Can someone tell me about a some gear here? I would like to know about the Vector Wonderhog harness, a PD-230 9-cell Main canopy, and a ParaFlite R4 square reserve.

"I'm not lost. I don't know where I'm going, but there's no sense in being late."
Mathew Quigley

[mark 107]

Not a bad set of starter equipment for your museum.

I'm going to guess you're hooked on skydiving, starting to look for gear, and this stuff caught your eye because of the startlingly low price. There's a reason the price is low. It's a reflection of the rig's value. I'd suggest continuing to search.

Here's my rule of thumb:
-- if it's old enough to get a learner's permit, probably ought to keep looking.
-- if it's old enough to vote, abstain from buying it.
-- if it's old enough to go out drinking with, time to retire it to a spot on the wall in the bar.

It's okay to rent gear a little longer. In the early stages of their skydiving careers (0 to 50 or 100 jumps), most folks learn so much so fast that they are really better off renting gear than they are bearing the expenses of buying, maintaining, and selling equipment several times before they get to the equipment they're going to be jumping for several years.

It's fun too look and imagine, I know. Happy hunting!

Mark

[councilman24 37]

The vector has been in production for more than 20 years and has went through several iterations. You need to be much more specific if your talking about a used rig. It could be a Vector I, II, III or Micron. The Date of Manufacture (DOM) would help. Vector I's and II are not "freefly friendly". Do a search to see what that means. But the Vector II was and is a suitable rig for relative work and is widely jumped and copied. The Vector I lacks some of the more modern features of the II and I wouldn't consider. edit, There was an even earlier rig that was called a Wonderhog, no Vector in the name. All of the Vectors up to brand new ones are labeled with the Wonderhog name. IF it is a Wonderhog, not a Vector Wonderhog, it is relic not worthy of consideration

The PD canopy is a NON zero porosity nine cell canopy. Most non student jumpers no longer jump non zp mains except for special circumstances. Greater performance, even for new jumpers, and greater service life are two reasons. Even for new jumpers or jumpers not interested in high performance canopy flight, smaller ZP mains can be used than non zp canopies. The 230 PD is similar to a canopy I would have jumped as a main at 180 lbs as a new jumper before zp canopies. A somewhat smaller zp main can be used to provide the same and better performance and landings. That being said a non zp main at an appropriate price may be suitable for a first canopy, depending on age (mainly number of jumps) and the suspended weight. Most appropriate if your learning on a non zp canopy. IF your learning on a ZP canopy I would not recommend going "backward" to a non zp canopy for your first.

The Paraflite reserve depends on model again and size. I don't remember exactly which one the R4 is but I believe it's the Swift. There was an earlier 5 cell version that I wouldn't recommend. The later 7 cell version came in three sizes, IIRC. An appropriate size (suspended weight not more than 1lb per square ft. or the max recommended weight, which ever is less) would be fine. It's no longer sold and when competition came on the market became a less popular choice. But the seven cell version is fine. I have one given to me that I plan on putting in a rig.

Several years ago I purchased a Vector II, a PD 9 cell main, and a reserve for $1100 or $1200 dollars. I really wanted the rig to put a CREW canopy in it as a third rig.

Many more details about the rig and about your weight, experience and training are needed to know if this would be appropriate for you. Talk to your instructors.

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[mark 107]

The R4 is the Cirrus reserve, designed in 1982, almost 25 years ago. 5 very wide (4 feet!) cells, span constructed, measures to 231 square feet but performs much, much smaller since the wide cells are not very efficient. Not in production very long; superseded by the Swift Plus 7-cells. I couldn't recommend it as a reserve these days.

Mark

[councilman24 37]

Thanks Mark. I couldn't remember whether the R4 was the Swift 7 cell or the Cirrus. I agree not recommend as a reserve. I had a Cirrus main and was one of the few people who could land the thing. We called it the mattress. I only stoped jumping it when I had a non canopy malfunction, reserve hesitation, and busted up my leg real bad. Moved to a Raven IV and then a Manta for awhile.

Actually I still have the Cirrus main. I ought to jump it sometime but I weigh about 30 lbs more than the last time I jumped it in 1987.

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[3331 137]

Look here for gear

I Jumped with the guys who invented Skydiving.

[skydiverek 63]

Quote

It could be a Vector I, II, III or Micron

Or Vector 3-M .

[RB_Hammer 0]

I have seen a picture of the reserve, it has 7 cells. The container has a picture of a gorilla upside down holding a barbell and says, "Vanilla Gorilla".

"I'm not lost. I don't know where I'm going, but there's no sense in being late."
Mathew Quigley

[councilman24 37]

If the reserve has 7 cells it isn't a R4. Mark is right. I looked it up also. An R4 is a 5 cell Cirrus reserve. R3 is the old 5 cell swift. Neither are recommended due to design age and likely canopy age.

Gorilla stuff is somebodies aftermarket decoration and doesn't mean anything about what the gear is.

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[RB_Hammer 0]

Jeez, I am really new at this, as you can see from my profile. I am attaching pictures of the canopy and the label. Does it look like 7 cells?
Thanks for all of your replies.

"I'm not lost. I don't know where I'm going, but there's no sense in being late."
Mathew Quigley

[icevideot 0]

This takes us back to marks' response near the beginning. Jun 85 would make it old enough to go drinking. I will occasionally jump a main older than that but would try to avoid it as a reserve. You can do much better than that.

I didn't really try to count the cells. One of the riggers would do a much better job anyway

"... this ain't a Nerf world."

[GravityGirl 0]

IMHO, that is an old POS.

You are jumping out of an airplane. Hurling your body at the ground at 120+ MPH. Your actions and your gear are the only things that can save your life. Don't second guess yourself. Don't jump gear that you will be second guessing.

Besides the safety factor, lets talk economics.

If you buy a POS for $900, you will likely be the last guy holding the bag. i.e. you'll have one hell of time selling it. When you upgrade to newer gear, you have lost $900.

If you buy more modern sport gear for around $3,000, you can put 100 - 200 jumps on it and sell it for slightly under (if not the same price) as what you spent. Trade straight across or within a couple hundred dollars.

Even if you don't have the money now, it makes sense to rent a little longer, save money and buy something that is both safe and a good value for your money.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Peace and Blue Skies!
Bonnie ==>Gravity Gear!

[councilman24 37]

Because of the construction technique it's very difficult to count the cells in that picture. It actually looks like more than 5 if you try to count lines. Don't feel bad about not being able to count the cells in that picture. BUT the label tells all. Note the first line, CIRRUS RESERVE.

This was never a popular main, let alone a popular reserve and it's only value is as a wall hanger. In fact, the last time I packed one of these was in the mid 90's and even then I didn't want to. Today I wouldn't pack it. Many riggers (most?) would refuse to pack this. The design is too out of date and the individual canopy is too old. There are riggers who would pack it, but they'll pack anything.

Forget about it.

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[mark 107]

Quote

Does it look like 7 cells?

It looks like 7 cells because it is hung with 8 clamps. If it were a 7-cell canopy, it would droop evenly between the evenly spaced clamps. It doesn't, so it isn't.

Mark