Have you ever fired a flare gun for survival?

[Guru312 0]

March 7th marked my 66th birthday. Having that birthday made me reflect on stuff and think about some things I've designed or co-designed over the years. What I describe here is a favorite.

Many years ago I was co-designer, along with Barry and Allan Rothman, of a hand-held signal flare device known in the military as: Illumination Signal Kit, Mk 79 Mod 0. The device sold commercially as the Survival 7. We went on to form a company, PyroDynamics, Inc. which was finally sold and became a division of Colt Fireams known as Colt-PyroDynamics.

You can see a picture taken from a U.S. Navy equipment manual:

http://www.aicommand.com/SURVIV_7.jpg

The unit was a pen-sized, hand-held, launching device with a thumb activated trigger and seven flare cartridges. The user held the launcher over their head and flicked the trigger. A brilliant red flare was shot 250 feet into the air. The incredibly bright light burned for about 5 seconds and could seen for a hundred miles.

It made for great fireworks at parties. During our deveopment and testing I shot many thousands of flares into the air while we tested for maximum brilliance, maximum height and burn longevity. I set many fires.

One of the coolest things was to see our signal flare device save the life of James Bond in the movie ThunderBall. 007 saved himself by shooting one of our flares through a hole in a cave ceiling and being wenched into a hovering helicopter.

We designed the system during the Viet-Nam war. I served with the 82nd Airborne Division and, because of that, felt a real sense of purpose during design and testing for the guys who would carry the flares on a mission.

Bond was cool but it was really wonderful knowing how many downed pilots were saved and how many Special Ops team members where rescued by our devices. At the time I left the company we were working an AR-15 caliber, smoke, flare and sound-producing shell.

An ex-SEAL skydiver friend of mine told of how team members would shoot the flares when drunk for any reason when not on a mission...but obviously never on a mission unless really needed.

I was told that legislation exists in many states to prohibit the firing of the flares unless there is a real emergency

What stories can you tell about the Mk 79 Mod 0 and how you used it?

Guru312

I am not DB Cooper

[warpedskydiver 0]

Are speaking about pilot flares?

Yep Mk79 Mod 0

BTW great stuff, and I appreciate them greatly.

Besides it's fun to use them to get tailgaters to back off.

Did you know that it takes a while to pump off quite a few of them?

[airtwardo 7]

I want one!

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[LouDiamond 1]

Quote

Many years ago I was co-designer, along with Barry and Allan Rothman, of a hand-held signal flare device known in the military as: Illumination Signal Kit, Mk 79 Mod 0.

Just let me say thank you and if there is anything I can ever do in this world for you, let me know.

"It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required"
Some people dream about flying, I live my dream
SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING

[ACMESkydiver 0]

Not me, but I think I do know a couple that did.

Thank you...I kinda like having those guys still with us.

~Jaye
Do not believe that possibly you can escape the reward of your action.

[SARLDO 0]

February 22, 1996, I was a U.S. Navy Rescue Crewman on an UH-1N out of Fallon, NV (yes, the Navy has a base in NV.). We were assisting in the search of two lost individuals in the mountains south of Lake Tahoe when we lost tail rotoright drive at about 300' and crashed into a heavily wooded and snow covered area. All five of us on board suffered injuries from broken backs to legs and arms. I was the least injured with a dislocated right femur at the hip. After calling out a may-day on my hand-held radio to other units assisting in the search, I, along with my corpsman, launched a series of pencil flares to indicate exactly where we were to the CHP helicopter looking for us. We were all rescued within 30 minutes of the crash.

Thank you is all I can think of to say for.

"Always do right. This will gratify some people and astonish the rest" ~Samuel Clemens

MB#4300
Dudeist Skydiver #68

[Guru312 0]

Quote

We were all rescued within 30 minutes of the crash.

Thank you is all I can think of to say for.

Wow! Thank you!. That story gave me chills.

It really is wonderful knowing we helped with things like that.

Guru312

I am not DB Cooper

[ryoder 1,590]

Well, I'll be damned. I owned one of those when I was a kid, but it only came with a couple tear-gas cartridges, not flares. After I fired the cartridges, (just out of curiosity of course), I figured out the active ingredient was an ordinary shotgun primer, so I swiped some from my old man's reloading supplies, and after that just used is as a blank gun for pulling pranks on unsuspecting friends.

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[Amazon 7]

Looks a lot like what we called the Gyro-Jet in the USAF.

http://www.soldusa.com/detail.asp?id=3708

I got to shoot a hell of a lot of those at the USAF Survival School...never had to use one for an actual situation though. The students managed to start a LOT of grass fires with them during the summer months out by the Obstacle Course...little suckers come down HOT.

On my boat I carry the little 12 gauge size flare gun... never had to use it either. I also have some of the old school mortar tube signal flares in my raft kit.

They are fun on the 4th of July... fire off all the old ordinance that is out of date by USCG Standards.

[Guru312 0]

Quote

Well, I'll be damned. I owned one of those when I was a kid, but it only came with a couple tear-gas cartridges, not flares.

You are right on...The original device was a tear gas unit which sold with two cartridges. The 'gun' , more correctly launcher portion, was used for tear gas, flares and smoke generators.

When we adapted the tear gas unit to flares we kept the same system with a shot gun primer, as you correctly point out. With tear gas cartridges the tear gas--not really a gas, in the literal chemical sense-- was put into the cartridges over top of the primer. The gaseous force generated from the primer was sufficient to expel the 'gas' into the face of a mugger or attacking dog.

The flares were slightly different. An aluminum cup, actually an extruded cylinder with one end close, was filled with a composition of 4 chemicals in a 3-4 step fill/compress under very great pressure. A pyrotechnic mix referred to a 'first-fire' was then pressed onto the flare mix. The cup was pushed into the cartridge--very close fit!--with the first-fire, open end toward the primer. When the primer fired the first-fire composition was ignited and the gaseous discharge from the primer created enough internal pressure to push the cup and chemical mix to 200-250 feet. It took a second or two for the major portion of the aluminum cup and the mix to be burning completely and to reach maximum height.

Aluminum, particularly powered aluminum, burns VERY hot which is why the students in the survival class described by Amazon in her reply started a lot of fires. And why I set so many fires during our testing.

The red color of the flares is caused by the burning of strontium nitrate in the flare mix. Other chemicals, like in standard fireworks, create different colors with blue being the most difficult to reproduce.

One thing we played around with was shooting the flares into water. Because of the chemical composition of the mix the flares would burn under water. Very cool to see at night...surreal, sci-fi look.

Guru312

I am not DB Cooper

[ExAFO 0]

No, but I've flared a Safire for survival, and then shotgunned a beer.

Illinois needs a CCW Law. NOW.

[FlyingJ 0]

Speaking of starting fires...we use flare guns all the time in prescribed fire and wildfire fighting. Most often it is the larger gun type but I know a handful of guys that carry this smaller version. Obviously it wasn't designed specifically for starting fires, but it does a darn good job!

Oddly enough, though I've probably fired upwards of a thousand or so rounds I've never seen one explode in the air - we always fire them with a trajectory so that they explode on or very near the ground.

Killing threads since 2004.