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sundevil777

Baseball rules question

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it seems like the answer would be 3, but it's actually unlimited, since the pitcher gets credit for a K even if the strike gets past the catcher and the batter gets to base. The pitcher can get "strikeout" credit even if the batter isn't really out.



If first base is occupied with fewer than two outs, the uncaught third strike rule isn't in effect, so you have to come up with ways of advancing them. A dropped-third-strike followed by a home run could be continued ad infinitum.

Blues,
Dave
"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!"
(drink Mountain Dew)

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How many ways can a runner advance to second base from first?



What is this? Try to stump Nightingale with random baseball questions?

Off the top of my head:

1. being forced from first by a base hit
2. being advanced by a walk
3. being advanced by a balk
4. stealing
5. if a runner is hit by a ball
6. some cases of dead ball
7. being illegally interfered with during a steal
8. if a fielder tries to catch the ball with his hat

I don't have time to think anymore... there's probably some I've missed, but I gotta log off.

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it seems like the answer would be 3, but it's actually unlimited, since the pitcher gets credit for a K even if the strike gets past the catcher and the batter gets to base. The pitcher can get "strikeout" credit even if the batter isn't really out.



Wouldn't that be an error? I'd think errors would encompass a whole variety of ways a runner could advance from 1st to 2nd...

Enemiga Rodriguez, PMS #369, OrFun #25, Team Dirty Sanchez #116, Pelt Head #29, Muff #4091

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I once read somewhere that there is a circumstance under which it is possible to steal "FIRST BASE" anyone know how much, if any truth there is to that?
I'm trying to remember specifically what the claimed circumstance was. Or where I read it.
You're as wonderful as a slinkie!! NOT REALLY GOOD FOR ANYTHING BUT THEY BRING A SMILE TO YOUR FACE WHEN PUSHED DOWN THE STAIRS.

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it seems like the answer would be 3, but it's actually unlimited, since the pitcher gets credit for a K even if the strike gets past the catcher and the batter gets to base. The pitcher can get "strikeout" credit even if the batter isn't really out.



Wouldn't that be an error? I'd think errors would encompass a whole variety of ways a runner could advance from 1st to 2nd...



Passed ball, Wild pitch and error are three different things to a baseball scorer, and yes they are three distinct ways a runner can advance to second.
To do with the strikeout question, it must be a passed ball.

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AHEM------->:(

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I once read somewhere that there is a circumstance under which it is possible to steal "FIRST BASE" anyone know how much, if any truth there is to that?
I'm trying to remember specifically what the claimed circumstance was. Or where I read it.


You're as wonderful as a slinkie!! NOT REALLY GOOD FOR ANYTHING BUT THEY BRING A SMILE TO YOUR FACE WHEN PUSHED DOWN THE STAIRS.

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There's a bunch more.



Hit
Sacrifice fly
Fielder's choice
Walk
Balk
Steal
Error
Defensive indifference
Catcher's interference
Umpire's interference
Spectator's interference
Obstruction
Dropped third strike (with two outs)

There are probably more. :D

Edit: I can't believe I forgot hit batter. I think wild pitch and passed ball would be recorded as steals, wouldn't they?

Blues,
Dave
"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!"
(drink Mountain Dew)

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AHEM------->:(

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I once read somewhere that there is a circumstance under which it is possible to steal "FIRST BASE" anyone know how much, if any truth there is to that?
I'm trying to remember specifically what the claimed circumstance was. Or where I read it.


I have heard of taking first on a passed ball on the third strike referred to as stealing first. It is, in fact, not a stolen base.

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Umpire's interference


That's a new one on me. Have you ever seen that one called?
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I think wild pitch and passed ball would be recorded as steals, wouldn't they?


Nope. A steal is an achievement by the runner over the skills of the battery. A wild pitch or PB are mistakes by the battery just as an error is a mistake by the fielders and the batter does not get a hit (and his average goes down as if he made an out).

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Umpire's interference


That's a new one on me. Have you ever seen that one called?



Yep, that's the only reason I knew it existed. If a batted ball hits the umpire in the infield (before passing an infielder now that I've looked it up), play is dead, the batter is awarded first base and other runners advance if forced.

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I think wild pitch and passed ball would be recorded as steals, wouldn't they?


Nope. A steal is an achievement by the runner over the skills of the battery. A wild pitch or PB are mistakes by the battery just as an error is a mistake by the fielders and the batter does not get a hit (and his average goes down as if he made an out).



If a runner attempts to advance on a passed ball and is thrown out, is he not caught stealing? I suppose in general lingo, I do usually hear "advanced to second on a wild pitch" versus "stole second on a passed ball". Perhaps my confusion lies in a possible difference between a dropped pitch and a passed ball (is there a difference)?

Blues,
Dave
"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!"
(drink Mountain Dew)

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If a runner attempts to advance on a passed ball and is thrown out, is he not caught stealing? I suppose in general lingo, I do usually hear "advanced to second on a wild pitch" versus "stole second on a passed ball". Perhaps my confusion lies in a possible difference between a dropped pitch and a passed ball (is there a difference)?

Blues,
Dave


Yes. A passed ball by definition has someone gaining a benefit i.e. a base.
If the runner is thrown out it cannot be a passed ball, therefore he must have been stealing. If the runner is safe it is the scorekeeper's decision as to whether it is a passed ball or a stolen base. The general rule is if the runner was off before the ball was dropped then it was a stolen base, if he took off because he saw the ball being dropped then it is a passed ball.
If the catcher misses the ball and there is no-one on base it is not a passed ball; no harm, no foul.
Likewise if the pitcher hits the mascot in the head, unless there is a runner to benefit it is not a wild pitch, it's juuust a bit outside.:P

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an error is a mistake by the fielders and the batter does not get a hit (and his average goes down as if he made an out).



I would think that it would not count as an at-bat, in the same way that getting a walk is not an at-bat, so it doesn't change the batting average. That would be my intuition, without looking it up.
People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am

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it seems like the answer would be 3, but it's actually unlimited, since the pitcher gets credit for a K even if the strike gets past the catcher and the batter gets to base. The pitcher can get "strikeout" credit even if the batter isn't really out.



If first base is occupied with fewer than two outs, the uncaught third strike rule isn't in effect, so you have to come up with ways of advancing them. A dropped-third-strike followed by a home run could be continued ad infinitum.



After the runner gets to first on a dropped 3rd strike, they could steal bases to continue it forever, correct?
People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am

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it seems like the answer would be 3, but it's actually unlimited, since the pitcher gets credit for a K even if the strike gets past the catcher and the batter gets to base. The pitcher can get "strikeout" credit even if the batter isn't really out.



If first base is occupied with fewer than two outs, the uncaught third strike rule isn't in effect, so you have to come up with ways of advancing them. A dropped-third-strike followed by a home run could be continued ad infinitum.



After the runner gets to first on a dropped 3rd strike, they could steal bases to continue it forever, correct?



Yeah, there's a wide variety of ways that the runner could advance to leave first base open without recording an out. Any extra base hit, an error, a balk, etc.

Blues,
Dave
"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!"
(drink Mountain Dew)

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an error is a mistake by the fielders and the batter does not get a hit (and his average goes down as if he made an out).



I would think that it would not count as an at-bat, in the same way that getting a walk is not an at-bat, so it doesn't change the batting average. That would be my intuition, without looking it up.


If you hit the ball on the ground right at the second baseman, you deserve to be out. The fact that he fucked up and booted it changes nothing; the pitcher won that battle between you, the error let you get to first, and your average goes down.

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How many ways can an Out be made?


The Batter can be called out due to:
Strikeout
Called out for arguing with the umpire.
Foul tip caught by the catcher on the third strike (really just a variant on the K).
A line or fly (same thing really) caught by any one of nine fielders.
Tagged out by any one of nine on the base paths.
Forced out at first.
Called out upon appeal for advancing to a base without first touching a previous base.
A Runner can be called out due to:
Being forced out at any base.
Being tagged out on the base paths.
leaving the base path to avoid a tag.
Interfering with the fielder's ability to play the ball.
Making contact with a hit ball in fair territory while on the base paths.
Caught stealing.
The Infield Fly Rule.
Called out upon appeal for advancing to a base without first touching a previous base.
Called out upon appeal for returning to a base without first returning to a foreward base previously passed.
Being passed by another runner or the batter on the base paths.
Failing to return to the base he was stationed on after a fly-out (this looks like a race back to the bag or an appeal to the ump that he left too early to take the next base).

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an error is a mistake by the fielders and the batter does not get a hit (and his average goes down as if he made an out).



I would think that it would not count as an at-bat, in the same way that getting a walk is not an at-bat, so it doesn't change the batting average. That would be my intuition, without looking it up.


If you hit the ball on the ground right at the second baseman, you deserve to be out. The fact that he fucked up and booted it changes nothing; the pitcher won that battle between you, the error let you get to first, and your average goes down.



I see your point. Usually that would be the case - if not for the error, the defense would have gotten the out. I wonder if the scorekeepers consider if the runner might have beaten the throw anyway when they decide an error. That would be hard to judge.
People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am

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I see your point. Usually that would be the case - if not for the error, the defense would have gotten the out. I wonder if the scorekeepers consider if the runner might have beaten the throw anyway when they decide an error. That would be hard to judge.


Yes, they do it all the time. Often a middle infielder gets to a ball that his colleagues would not have. Even if he does not field it cleanly the scorer will award a base hit.
Often there is a little prejudice shown; If there is a no hitter going, it is an error, if the fielder is a gold glove contender, it is a hit.

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