riddler 0 #1 March 17, 2008 Ever wonder why a decent salad costs $6-$8, when you can get a Bic Mac for $1? See the attached pic. The pyramid on the right shows the FDA recommendations for a balanced diet (grains and veggies taking up most of the pyramid, while proteins and sugars make up the top part). The pyramid on the left shows government subsidies for agriculture from 1995 to 2005. The US government gave most of it's cash subsidies to meat and dairy (73.8%), and vegetables got a measly 0.37% of the funds. So now you know.Trapped on the surface of a sphere. XKCD Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #2 March 17, 2008 No. THAT isn't why a salad costs more. A salad costs more than a Big Mac because some jackass out there is willing to pay for it at that price.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PLFXpert 0 #3 March 18, 2008 QuoteWhy a salad costs more than a Big Mac by quade Post: No. THAT isn't why a salad costs more. A salad costs more than a Big Mac because some jackass out there is willing to pay for it at that price. Oy vey. Strike that; reverse it.Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riddler 0 #4 March 18, 2008 That was interesting - I was replying to your text about the bread in the Big Mac making up for the meat, and the message completely changed. First time I've seen that on a reply. Anyway, the new reply is also interesting, so I'll respond to that instead. I'm not convinced that the cost of a salad is entirely market-driven. Buy the ingredients for a salad from the grocery store, and you won't find an astronomical price difference from buying a salad from a store or restaurant. Sure, there's a markup, and it may be 100% (or only 50%) increase, but the cost of the ingrediants are also high. It would still be $4-$5 for ingrediants, vs the $1 Big Mac. Why is the cost of vegetables, which take far less time, far fewer resources and maybe even grown just a few miles away from you significantly higher than something that has parts manufactured in eight different cities (meat, cheese, bread, oil, salt, et al), shipped by truck halfway across the country, cooked by teenagers and advertised to death? Who really pays for your Bic Mac? It's likely that taxpayers put more money into it than you did.Trapped on the surface of a sphere. XKCD Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflybella 0 #5 March 18, 2008 Quote That was interesting - I was replying to your text about the bread in the Big Mac making up for the meat, and the message completely changed. First time I've seen that on a reply. Anyway, the new reply is also interesting, so I'll respond to that instead. I'm not convinced that the cost of a salad is entirely market-driven. Buy the ingredients for a salad from the grocery store, and you won't find an astronomical price difference from buying a salad from a store or restaurant. Sure, there's a markup, and it may be 100% (or only 50%) increase, but the cost of the ingrediants are also high. It would still be $4-$5 for ingrediants, vs the $1 Big Mac. Why is the cost of vegetables, which take far less time, far fewer resources and maybe even grown just a few miles away from you significantly higher than something that has parts manufactured in eight different cities (meat, cheese, bread, oil, salt, et al), shipped by truck halfway across the country, cooked by teenagers and advertised to death? Who really pays for your Bic Mac? It's likely that taxpayers put more money into it than you did. woo hoo! Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #6 March 18, 2008 QuoteQuoteWhy a salad costs more than a Big Mac by quade Post: No. THAT isn't why a salad costs more. A salad costs more than a Big Mac because some jackass out there is willing to pay for it at that price. Oy vey. Strike that; reverse it. I 100% guarantee that if nobody ever bought the $8 salad that they would no longer exist at that rate. 100% absolutely positive.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RkyMtnHigh 0 #7 March 18, 2008 I think that a salad is more than a BigMac because salad ingredients dont have a long shelf life and a BigMac is like a Twinkie, you can put it in jar and 10 yrs later it looks the same! _________________________________________ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riddler 0 #8 March 18, 2008 Quotewoo hoo! I agree. The government should subsidize food for it's people. It worked for the Romans, and it works today. But I gotta wonder, since they spend 250 times more on meat and dairy than on veggies, if they spent the money on vegetables instead, how much more food could we make available for the people? 100 times more? At least.Trapped on the surface of a sphere. XKCD Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PLFXpert 0 #9 March 18, 2008 Or a Big Mac cost less than a salad because some jackass out there is willing to pay for it (and eat it) at that price. It baffles me some people don't question why their burgers cost $1. The answer is pretty fucking gross.Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lauraliscious 0 #10 March 18, 2008 Quote I 100% guarantee that if nobody ever bought the $8 salad that they would no longer exist at that rate. 100% absolutely positive. Yeah, it probably wouldn't exist at all, would likely be struck from the menu entirely. Then McDonalds could say they tried to offer a healthy alternative, but no one was buying it. It is an interesting phenomenon. Has anyone else read Animal, Vegetable, Miracle by Barbara Kingsolver? I just got done with it and it's a very interesting read. Enemiga Rodriguez, PMS #369, OrFun #25, Team Dirty Sanchez #116, Pelt Head #29, Muff #4091 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
futuredivot 0 #11 March 18, 2008 Quotevegetables, which take far less time, far fewer resources Have you ever farmed? Raised cattle? I've done both on a small to moderate scale and farming involved much more hard work. Heck, the hardest part about cattle was cutting and bailing hay, which is, in essence, farming.You are only as strong as the prey you devour Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thanatos340 1 #12 March 18, 2008 Cause Salad is Murder. As a founding member of the Vegetation Liberation Front, Let me just say for all to hear... Lettuce be Free!! Vegtables have Rghts Too!! Eat more Meat!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
futuredivot 0 #13 March 18, 2008 QuoteCause Salad is Slaughter. Gotta be catchy to get attention these daysYou are only as strong as the prey you devour Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
futuredivot 0 #14 March 18, 2008 Say No To The HoeYou are only as strong as the prey you devour Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
icevideot 0 #15 March 18, 2008 Quote ... a BigMac is like a Twinkie, you can put it in jar and 10 yrs later it looks the same! Now that is funny!! I love vegetables...they are what food eats. "... this ain't a Nerf world." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SpeedRacer 1 #16 March 18, 2008 Quote I think that a salad is more than a BigMac because salad ingredients dont have a long shelf life and a BigMac is like a Twinkie, you can put it in jar and 10 yrs later it looks the same! Actually, yes, this is a good point: You can freeze hamburger meat & keep it frozen for a long time. Salad ingredients, on the other hand, must be fresh & have a much more limited shelf life. Speed Racer -------------------------------------------------- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
futuredivot 0 #17 March 18, 2008 QuoteSalad ingredients, on the other hand, must be fresh & have a much more limited shelf life. You never saw my fridge whae i was singleYou are only as strong as the prey you devour Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #18 March 18, 2008 The sammiches are salty and also align with people that buy a lot of soda and fries - grazers don't buy the sodas and fries as readily soda and fries are VERY high profit margin McD actually sells the double cheeseburger at a loss. of course, government conspiracies are more interesting than just profit margin discussions ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NWFlyer 2 #19 March 18, 2008 Quote Why is the cost of vegetables, which take far less time, far fewer resources and maybe even grown just a few miles away from you significantly higher than something that has parts manufactured in eight different cities (meat, cheese, bread, oil, salt, et al), shipped by truck halfway across the country, cooked by teenagers and advertised to death? You're pretty out of touch with the current state of the United States food production system if you think there's much of a chance that the average vegetable you buy in your grocery store was grown a few miles from you. Ironically, the direct cost of the salad to you is actually much lower because it is probably produced a great distance from you as part of the massive agro-industrial complex that produces vast quantities of cheap produce and transports it great distances rather than producing food locally to feed local populations. The indirect cost ... well, that's a whole other discussion."There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RevJim 0 #20 March 18, 2008 Quote Quote I think that a salad is more than a BigMac because salad ingredients dont have a long shelf life and a BigMac is like a Twinkie, you can put it in jar and 10 yrs later it looks the same! Actually, yes, this is a good point: You can freeze hamburger meat & keep it frozen for a long time. Salad ingredients, on the other hand, must be fresh & have a much more limited shelf life. This is exactly correct, up to a point. I drive for a major corporation delivering food from a distribution center in WI to a supermarket chain in MN, usually. My shift, which starts at 10pm or midnight, depending on the day, is what we call a perishable run. I am almost always hauling produce, but on occasion will have a load of meat, frozen, and/or dairy. These stores get a load of m-f-d anywhere from 2 to 4 times a week, depending on volume and current sales. These same stores get a truck with produce every day! These may be light loads. I usually have 2 to 4 stops for a load. The reason is the extremely limited shelf life. Standard groceries, frozen, and to some extent, meat and dairy, can sit and wait to be sold. Produce has to hit the shelf a very, very short time after being picked or it's going to go bad. Considering that this time of year much of the produce we consume cannot be grown here (it IS winter, after all), it is shipped from (again, mostly) South America. Knowing the limited shelf life, and astronomical transportation costs, the answer to why salads are expensive should be obvious. Of course, if we changed our eating habits to seasonable vegetables, this price would come down but this is America. We know what we want and despite the season, we are willing to pay to get it.It's your life, live it! Karma RB#684 "Corcho", ASK#60, Muff#3520, NCB#398, NHDZ#4, C-33989, DG#1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
elias123 0 #21 March 18, 2008 A Big Mac for 1 Dollar ?! Damn that's cheap. Over here a Big Mac costs like 4 Euros."In a mad world, only the mad are sane" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riddler 0 #22 March 18, 2008 ***You're pretty out of touch with the current state of the United States food production system if you think there's much of a chance that the average vegetable you buy in your grocery store was grown a few miles from you.*** Well, I'm not an expert in this area for sure, but no I don't think the average vegetable is grown close to the consumers. I do actually talk to the grocers that stock the fruits and veggies - the one two days ago was telling me about his grandchildren and what color they painted the baby room Frequently, the people that stock the produce can tell you exactly where it came from. But you have to take a minute to ask them. Fruits in Colorado almost always come from another state or country (tha labels usually say where), although we do make some good citrus here. And most of it gets shipped to other states. There's beginning to be some attention paid to where the ingrediants come from in hamburgers sold at fast food restaurants. It's true for food in general - most people don't care where it comes from. Trapped on the surface of a sphere. XKCD Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riddler 0 #23 March 18, 2008 QuoteOver here a Big Mac costs like 4 Euros. \ A previous poster had the theory that they sell the burgers in the US at a loss to bring people in, while at the same time marking up the fries and drinks. But this is the same company - just in a different country. Why don't they use the same marketing? Maybe a better explanation is that Europe doesn't subsidize ingredients made in the US.Trapped on the surface of a sphere. XKCD Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NWFlyer 2 #24 March 18, 2008 Quote It's true for food in general - most people don't care where it comes from. True. I admit I'm one of those. I'm trying to pay more attention too. I'm reading a fun book right now called Plenty, about a couple in Vancouver, BC who try for a year to eat locally (which they define as food grown/produced within a 100-mile radius of their home). Since it's much the same region as my own, it's been quite an eye-opener about how much is no longer produced at all in this area. "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SpeedRacer 1 #25 March 18, 2008 QuoteA Big Mac for 1 Dollar ?! Damn that's cheap. Over here a Big Mac costs like 4 Euros. No, a Big Mac costs $2.71. The "dollar menu" applies to a small cheeseburger. Here is the Big Mac Index for different countries. http://www.angelfire.com/id/SergioDaSilva/bigmacppp.html Speed Racer -------------------------------------------------- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
