next tandem passenger harness... no back band can i lose a customer?

[rhys 0]

i jump Next tandem and the passenger harness has no back or belly band. i really like the harness though because no matter how chunky the passenger is they can lift thier legs for landing (unlike the strong) in fact their knees automaticly lift while riding the parachute. all the recent concerns of falling out of a harness has me worried?

am i unessecarily worried?

can i se the vector passenger harness on the next (legally)?

i dont want to lose a passenger.

"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

[NickDG 23]

I've never see a Next system, it's a British or German system isn't it?

I'd say hang it in a suspended harness with an experienced jumper up front and see if he can come out the hole. Having one's legs come up seems to be part of the chain of events so a pax harness that facilitates this might be a problem.

Some are saying, and I even said it myself, not to worry too much as this is a rare occurrence. However, since I've been thinking about it I can now see almost every trend in accidents started out as rare.

A good friend of mine was one of the first to spin in under a Stiletto and we thought it was rare. Someone first botched a low turn under a highly loaded canopy and we thought it was rare. When the Green Star reserve risers separated from the rig the first time we thought it was rare. When plastic reserve ripcord handles first broke we thought it was rare. When someone first twisted a belly band or leg strap with a pilot chute pouch attached we thought it was rare. When the first mini-riser broke we thought it was rare.

And we could go on and on . . .

You've now heard of several jumpers who've almost come out of their rigs in the sky including Airtwardo who posts here. Now someone had come all the way out.

But it's rare . . .

NickD BASE 194

[riggermick 7]

You are a master of the ironic Nick so how's this? Belly bands, tight belly bands, Structuraly secured to the lumbar (lateral) belly bands!! Really fuckin uncomfortable during an opening belly bands!!! Despite how bad your harness fits, belly bands will keep you close enough to your rig to ride out ANY and I do mean ANY unusual opening.


AHhhhh!!! The distant past comes back to taunt us doesn't it?

The more things change the more they stay the same, ironic huh?

Mick.

[BIGUN 1,483]

My Eclipse student harness has both the bely and back band. One of the reasons for choosing the system.

Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard.

[rhys 0]

the next is german as far as i am aware, the whole system is really nice. looks like a spoert rig, all tuck tabs etc.

i have been told earlier vector or sigma harnesses had no belly band or back strap too? i really like the next harness for comfort but i don't want to lose a cusomer.

"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

[Deuce 1]

RHys, if the lowers are tight, they can't slip out. I don't know your procedure, but if you have the pax sit in your lap, tighten the lowers as tight and symetrical as you can, and have the pax try and try and sit back down on the seat (and they can't, cause they're cinched to you too tight), they aren't going to come loose on opening.

The Sigma harness that the recent fatality fell out of had back and belly bands. It appears from the descriptions of the incident, as well as the post on the RWS website, that the harness was not adjusted right.

[AggieDave 6]

Quote

It appears from the descriptions of the incident, as well as the post on the RWS website, that the harness was not adjusted right.

There have been a few near incidents involving the Sigma harness over the past few years as well. That doesn't mean that that the harness is at fault or the design, just that its a more complicated design then the old Vector harness and that care needs to be taken in making sure the instructor has proper adjustments with the harness. Then again, no matter what the harness is made by whom, that statement still holds true. Sometimes external events take place that make it hard to make sure that the harness adjustment is perfect, different weights, body types and different disabilities with the student. I know that even though I have over 800 tandem skydives using Vector and Sigma systems, I'm re-evaluating and rereading the procedures for disabled persons and proper adjustment of the harnesses just to make sure I'm squared away and ready to go for my students.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[speedy 0]

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RHys, if the lowers are tight, they can't slip out.

I just today demonstrated how a pax can slip out of a next/pdf harness. I was strapped into the harness from a TI that was aware of the problem. I just fell out with little effort.
This is not to say any able bodied person would. But they can! Tandem instructors must be aware of this problem when taking pax's that have little or no control of their legs.

Let's not forget this problem again.

Dave

Fallschirmsport Marl