Remster 30 #26 November 5, 2009 What makes you think you own the road? You like murdering cyclists?Remster Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wmw999 2,562 #27 November 5, 2009 QuoteCommon sense tell you , if you get in front of 2 thousand pounds, You LooseYou ride a motorcycle, right? Yeah, you go faster than a bicycle, but you're still invisible to half the drivers out there, and you don't have any metal around you. General purpose roadways are exactly that. They are open to street-legal vehicles. In farmlands, that includes tractors and combines. In the city, that can include cyclists. It is exceedingly polite when tractors or combines (or anyone else with a line behind them) pulls over for people to pass. It's also exceedingly polite for a bicyclist to do so periodically if they have to stay on the road. That doesn't always happen. But then all those pissed-off drivers don't let people in when merging half the time, either. Wendy P.There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Icon134 0 #28 November 5, 2009 QuoteBike lanes are there for a reason, get outrside of them is suicide, Common sense tell you , if you get in front of 2 thousand pounds, You Loose, (plus I doubt your "interpretation " (because that is all it is) of the Law, What kind of Idiot dares crowd cars , that are traveling at twice your speed? Do You need Laws to make you ride like you have a brain? Perhaps you do!Do you need laws to make you drive like you need a brain? Perhaps you do... or a car driver could kill or maim a bicyclist... and stand over their dead/broken body and exclaim that he/she should have paid closer attention to the laws of physics (mostly the one about inertia) while the police come and take you away for vehichlar manslaughter... QuoteIt is exceedingly polite when tractors or combines (or anyone else with a line behind them) pulls over for people to pass. It's also exceedingly polite for a bicyclist to do so periodically if they have to stay on the road.agreed... and I certainly do if cars don't have an oportunity to pass... I don't know about other cyclists...Livin' on the Edge... sleeping with my rigger's wife... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
downwardspiral 0 #29 November 5, 2009 Wow. Didn't expect this thread to turn out the way it has. www.FourWheelerHB.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,090 #30 November 5, 2009 >Bike lanes are there for a reason, get outrside of them is suicide . . . Bike lanes are great - but they don't exist everywhere. >Common sense tell you , if you get in front of 2 thousand pounds, >You Loose . . . . And the law says the driver then goes to jail for a long, long time (as in this example.) > What kind of Idiot dares crowd cars , that are traveling at twice > your speed? The same sort of idiot that tries to crowd bikes I guess. Heck, I've had cars try to crowd me when I am going twice their speed. A few have lost a bit of paint. >Do You need Laws to make you ride like you have a brain? Perhaps you do! Some people do indeed. The driver they just convicted is a good example. Fortunately he won't be driving anywhere any time soon. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Icon134 0 #31 November 5, 2009 Quote Wow. Didn't expect this thread to turn out the way it has. Really? I kind of did actually... Livin' on the Edge... sleeping with my rigger's wife... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tokter 0 #32 November 5, 2009 Can someone explain to a european what's up with the bycicle riders that are on your lane but ride in the wrong direction (towards you)? Often they are on bmx style bikes with no lights or reflectors etc. Scares the shit out of me every time. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #33 November 5, 2009 As a fellow European... my take is that they are wankers ... simple really. (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Remster 30 #34 November 5, 2009 They dont belong there and deserve to get ticketed.Remster Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jdfreefly 1 #35 November 5, 2009 QuoteBike lanes are great - but they don't exist everywhere. One of the things I've learned over the last year of biking to work is that when there is no bike lane, and you try to be courteous to drivers by staying as far to the right as possible, that courtesy will be repaid by people crowding you...you are actually much better off riding in the middle of the lane and forcing drivers to fully change lanes to go around you. It also greatly decreases your chances of getting "doored". Really, you people that think bikers are just a nuisance should spend a week riding your bikes to work, it might open your eyes. Methane Freefly - got stink? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,090 #36 November 5, 2009 >Can someone explain to a european what's up with the bycicle riders >that are on your lane but ride in the wrong direction (towards you)? There are a few reasons for this. The most common is that they are just not thinking, and it's easier to ride the wrong way (i.e. they don't have to cross the street or something.) The second most common reason is that they have been given bad information by local police. Most police departments recommend that people _walk_ against traffic when they are walking on the road, so they can see cars coming. Some (mistakenly) recommend that bicycles do the same thing. For a few years the guards at Camp Pendleton were telling people this; now they are back to the normal "ride with traffic" rule. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tokter 0 #37 November 5, 2009 QuoteAs a fellow European... my take is that they are wankers ... simple really. Hehe I guess, but I see it so often that I thought there might be some kind of logic there that I just don't get. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tokter 0 #38 November 5, 2009 QuoteThe second most common reason is that they have been given bad information by local police. Most police departments recommend that people _walk_ against traffic when they are walking on the road, so they can see cars coming. Some (mistakenly) recommend that bicycles do the same thing. For a few years the guards at Camp Pendleton were telling people this; now they are back to the normal "ride with traffic" rule. ok, that makes sense, thanks. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #39 November 5, 2009 Quote Really, you people that think bikers are just a nuisance should spend a week riding your bikes to work, it might open your eyes. Remember, SOME are nuisances. As a pedestrian, cyclist, motorcyclist and car driver I've seen members of all groups behave badly - such is life...... I on the other-hand (as I'm sure you are too) am perfection personified (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
downwardspiral 0 #40 November 5, 2009 Quote Quote Wow. Didn't expect this thread to turn out the way it has. Really? I kind of did actually... I guess I'm just an idealist. Last night I was in FedEx kinkos dropping off a small package for shipping. It was right as the last driver was making his pickup so there was a bit of a crowd and scramble to get the packages in the approriate area. A man with four boxes in his arms heavy enough to make him hunch over offered to allow me to go in front of him. Of course I didn't but such a small gesture was huge in my mind and he restored a little faith in humanty for me.www.FourWheelerHB.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Icon134 0 #41 November 5, 2009 QuoteLast night I was in FedEx kinkos dropping off a small package for shipping. It was right as the last driver was making his pickup so there was a bit of a crowd and scramble to get the packages in the approriate area. A man with four boxes in his arms heavy enough to make him hunch over offered to allow me to go in front of him. Of course I didn't but such a small gesture was huge in my mind and he restored a little faith in humanty for me.That's great!!! really... occasionally I have thing happen to me that do in fact restore my faith in humanity... but alas this thread going in the direction it did was unfortunately not suprising...Livin' on the Edge... sleeping with my rigger's wife... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ryoder 1,590 #42 November 5, 2009 There was a squabble recently in nearby Jefferson County over bicycle use of a road that goes up Deer Creek Canyon. One of the county commissioners wrote an article on her blog that ended with this: QuoteTo the motorists reading this: Cyclists do too pay for the roads (sales and income taxes, as well as gas taxes when they are driving). They cause less wear and tear on roads than to autos and trucks. You do not have the inalienable right to drive at or above the speed limit at all times. Slow down and share the road. To the cyclists reading this: On narrow canyon roads that are posted "ride single file," RIDE SINGLE FILE. Obey the speed limit, especially going downhill. Stop at stop signs. No motorist wants hitting a cyclist as a part of their life experience, even if it is your fault. Full text here: http://jeffcocommish.blogspot.com/2009/07/bicycle-and-motorist-conflicts.html Also, this comes from the CO Dept of Transportation: QuoteWhen to take a lane A bicyclist may take the travel lane where traffic is slow and the lane is narrow, there is no shoulder or bike lane, when approaching an intersection, or if you are moving at the same speed as the flow of traffic. Moving to the center of the lane establishes your position and prevents motorists from passing until there's enough room. Ref: http://www.dot.state.co.us/BikePed/Manual/2008%2002%20Rules%20of%20the%20Road.pdf"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DrewEckhardt 0 #43 November 5, 2009 QuoteAnd on the other side of the fence.... You cyclists: 1. Why do you insist on riding in the road when there is a nice bike path or sidewalk on the side? The streets are safer than bike paths with cross-streets, especially where the bike path is going the opposite direction of traffic. Drivers rarely pull into a traffic lane without looking first. Drivers rarely make left turns in front of oncoming traffic they failed to see where they're expecting it on the road. I'd be surprised if I could ride 30 minutes down a bike path running alongside a road without having drivers pull in front of it or make blind left turns across it. On the road, you're in driver's field of vision and roughly where they expect traffic to be coming from. In spite of riding up to 5000 miles a year, the only time I've been hit by a car was on a bike path. The streets are faster too. Even where you don't need to go around stopped cars, most "bike paths" are actually multi-use paths with joggers, dogs, and unleashed children. Quote 3. Why do you guys choose to obey some traffic laws and not others. Case in point: Running and rolling through red lights, right turns without stopping, etc. I follow all the traffic laws except the bike path speed limits. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ryoder 1,590 #44 November 5, 2009 To reinforce Drew's point: QuoteSegregated facilities and accident numbers For urban roads with many junctions, accident analysis suggests that segregated cycling facilities are likely to produce a net increase in the number of collisions. These conclusions are supported by the experience of countries that have implemented segregated cycling facilities. In the United States,[40] UK,[41] Germany, Sweden,[42] Denmark[43]and Finland,[44] it has been found that cycling on roadside urban cycle tracks/sidepaths results in up to 12-fold increases in the rate of car/bicycle collisions. At a 1990 European conference on cycling, the term Russian roulette was used to describe the use of roadside cycle paths.[45] In Helsinki, research has shown that cyclists are safer cycling on roads with traffic than when using the city's 800 kilometres (500 mi) of cycle paths.[46] The Berlin police and Senate conducted studies which led to a similar conclusion in the 1980s.[47] In Berlin 10% of the roads have cycle paths, but these produce 75% of fatalities and serious injuries among cyclists.[48] In the English town of Milton Keynes it has been shown that cyclists using the off-road Milton Keynes redway system have on a per-journey basis a significantly higher rate of fatal car-bicycle collisions than cyclists on ordinary roads.[41] Cycle lanes and bike lanes are less dangerous than cycle paths in urban situations but even well-implemented examples have been associated with 10% increases in casualty rates. Ref: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Segregated_cycle_facilities#Segregated_facilities_and_accident_numbers I read the same thing it the recent book "Traffic", by Tom Vanderbilt."There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Misternatural 0 #45 November 5, 2009 I totally agree- If you act like a wheeled vehicle you will be treated like one, if you behave like a pedestrian on a bicycle you will be promptly run over. Also; >unleashed children Beware of the collateralizing and monetization of your desires. D S #3.1415 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
airtwardo 7 #46 November 5, 2009 5. And whatever happened to the cool sound of baseball cards in the spokes? It's the 21st century my friend, see all the bikers with the headphones on? The sound of playing cards in your spokes...there's an app. for that! ~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MakeItHappen 15 #47 November 6, 2009 QuoteAnd on the other side of the fence.... You cyclists: 1. Why do you insist on riding in the road when there is a nice bike path or sidewalk on the side? 2. For recreational riding, why do you guys get out there in heavy traffic sucking fumes when there are other, less-traveled roads to use? 3. Why do you guys choose to obey some traffic laws and not others. Case in point: Running and rolling through red lights, right turns without stopping, etc. 4. Has common sense changed so much that playing in traffic has become a good idea these days? 5. And whatever happened to the cool sound of baseball cards in the spokes? A sidewalk can be deadly for a bicyclist. http://bicyclesafe.com/ Not only can someone open a store door into your path someone can walk out in front of you. At intersections, cars may not be able to see you approaching the intersection and can turn into you. Bike clubs recommend riding in the street and specifically getting IN FRONT of cars at a stop light (when the light is red) so that they see you. Some cities even have painted areas that bikes should be in at the intersections. I make sure I do this at all signaled intersections, especially when I have my dogs with me. Most cyclists that blow thru stop signs are kids, not adults. Most vehicle drivers try to change the rules of the road from inside their vehicle by directing traffic. .. Make It Happen Parachute History DiveMaker Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 2 #48 November 6, 2009 QuoteYou like murdering cyclists? Tough crowd in here today. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Remster 30 #49 November 6, 2009 I've had too many friends, minding their own business and following rules, ran over by drivers to not be tough. I've also been honked at, at things thrown at me, and ran of the road too many times to not take a cynical view of this issue.Remster Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jcd11235 0 #50 November 6, 2009 QuoteCan someone explain to a european what's up with the bycicle riders that are on your lane but ride in the wrong direction (towards you)? Often they are on bmx style bikes with no lights or reflectors etc. Scares the shit out of me every time. They are under the impression (mistaken, I believe) that it is better to see the closest passing cars approaching than for them to approach from behind. Personally, I choose my path with an intent to reduce closing speeds as much as possible, which means I ride in the direction of traffic when sharing the road with cars. (When riding on the sidewalk, I'm typically indifferent to which side of the road I'm on and make the selection based on convenience.)Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
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