Homeowner: 1, Wells Fargo: 0

[ryoder 1,590]

http://www.philly.com/philly/business/20110215_Consumer_10_0__Phila__homeowner_wins_judgment_against_Wells_Fargo_over_mortgage_fees.html?ref=facebook.com

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[labrys 0]

That's a great story.

Owned by Remi #?

[SarahC07 0]

Agreed. Awesome story. Thanks for sharing.

[JohnMitchell 16]

It's good to see someone stick it to The Man.

[squirrel 0]

While this comes across as a great "fight the system" story, it proves the old saying, "borrower is slave to the lender."

In addition, we (my wife and I) work with banks and foreclosed homes(we run a brokerage), and trust me...it is not "always" the "big bad bank" sticking it to the little guy. In fact, it is pretty much the opposite. For example, I don't know how many, but its alot, like 100s, of "cash for keys" we have had to do. This is a situation where the bank actually pays people to leave the home, which they have been living in for free for usually about 1.5 years, and leave the home in good shape. Instead of stripping all the fixtures and pouring concrete down the toilet. I would say only about 10% are loosing the home due to income problems, the rest are walking away because they did not do their homework and bought a house at the height of the market.

________________________________
Where is Darwin when you need him?

[DrewEckhardt 0]

Quote

While this comes across as a great "fight the system" story, it proves the old saying, "borrower is slave to the lender."

In addition, we (my wife and I) work with banks and foreclosed homes(we run a brokerage), and trust me...it is not "always" the "big bad bank" sticking it to the little guy. In fact, it is pretty much the opposite. For example, I don't know how many, but its alot, like 100s, of "cash for keys" we have had to do. This is a situation where the bank actually pays people to leave the home, which they have been living in for free for usually about 1.5 years, and leave the home in good shape.

Although a lot of those people bought into the myth that the home they were buying was worth what the bank-paid appraiser said it was, that home prices always go up so it was an investment justifying spending 2-3X what it would cost to rent a similar property, and even committed fraud as prompted by mortgage brokers which was then ignored by the banks so they could pocket the origination fees and perhaps loan servicing costs with the risk passed on to investors or insurers like the government sponsored enterprises.

If banks had held the mortgages and only issued loans to people spending 28% of their verified income on PITI with 20% down payments property values wouldn't have gotten artificially inflated and the mess wouldn't have happened.

Quote

Instead of stripping all the fixtures and pouring concrete down the toilet. I would say only about 10% are loosing the home due to income problems, the rest are walking away because they did not do their homework and bought a house at the height of the market.

Home owners walking away from $200,000 (or $1,000,000 in California) mortgages are as justified as Morgan Stanley walking away from a few billion worth of office towers or the Mortgage Banker's Association turning in their keys instead of paying the $75 million on their DC headquarters.

Where the benefits (not paying hundreds of thousands of dollars on a depreciating asset) exceed the costs (expensive credit for a few years or perhaps 7 in the worst case, especially in no-recourse states like California where deficiency judgements aren't allowed on first mortgages used to buy a property) it makes plenty of sense.

[squirrel 0]

Quote

Quote

While this comes across as a great "fight the system" story, it proves the old saying, "borrower is slave to the lender."

In addition, we (my wife and I) work with banks and foreclosed homes(we run a brokerage), and trust me...it is not "always" the "big bad bank" sticking it to the little guy. In fact, it is pretty much the opposite. For example, I don't know how many, but its alot, like 100s, of "cash for keys" we have had to do. This is a situation where the bank actually pays people to leave the home, which they have been living in for free for usually about 1.5 years, and leave the home in good shape.

Although a lot of those people bought into the myth that the home they were buying was worth what the bank-paid appraiser said it was, that home prices always go up so it was an investment justifying spending 2-3X what it would cost to rent a similar property, and even committed fraud as prompted by mortgage brokers which was then ignored by the banks so they could pocket the origination fees and perhaps loan servicing costs with the risk passed on to investors or insurers like the government sponsored enterprises.

If banks had held the mortgages and only issued loans to people spending 28% of their verified income on PITI with 20% down payments property values wouldn't have gotten artificially inflated and the mess wouldn't have happened.

Quote

Instead of stripping all the fixtures and pouring concrete down the toilet. I would say only about 10% are loosing the home due to income problems, the rest are walking away because they did not do their homework and bought a house at the height of the market.

Home owners walking away from $200,000 (or $1,000,000 in California) mortgages are as justified as Morgan Stanley walking away from a few billion worth of office towers or the Mortgage Banker's Association turning in their keys instead of paying the $75 million on their DC headquarters.

Where the benefits (not paying hundreds of thousands of dollars on a depreciating asset) exceed the costs (expensive credit for a few years or perhaps 7 in the worst case, especially in no-recourse states like California where deficiency judgements aren't allowed on first mortgages used to buy a property) it makes plenty of sense.

your points are well taken...if you are always on the side of the buyer. what part of high school did ALL these people not pay attention too...math, history, reading comprehension? Real estate is a long term investment, unless you are willing to take large risk, like speculative building, which we have done. What we see here in this county is people refi-ing the property to the hilt, buying plasma TVs and new cars, and then walking away. Fraud, pure and simple. I wish our observations were otherwise, but they are not.

I am upside down in a few properties I own, but I am not walking. I understand how real estate prices go up, down, up, down, and ultimately, up. Sure it was nice when we observed back to back years of 25% rise in prices, but anyone, yes anyone (even my dad who is a real estate millionaire with barely a high school education) would realize that price increases like that are unsustainable. Unless you have worked first hand in this situation, you really don't get a clear picture. But it sounds a little like you do work in the industry. I understand the theft that happens on wall street, and that is just as bad.

I will again state my original point. The "borrower is slave to the lender." If you do not want to be yanked around, don't borrow, plain and simple. I have to abide by the contacts that I have on my loans, so on some properties I am the slave, but once they are paid off, I am no longer the slave, and having done so on a few...that is the sweetest feeling of all.

________________________________
Where is Darwin when you need him?

[david3 0]

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http://www.philly.com/philly/business/20110215_Consumer_10_0__Phila__homeowner_wins_judgment_against_Wells_Fargo_over_mortgage_fees.html?ref=facebook.com

The bank never stood a chance. What with him being a vampire and all.