jumpinfarmer 0 #1 June 14, 2004 When closing the container do you go bottom top left right or bottom top right left. I've been told both ways and have closed and jumped it both ways and see no difference. Also do you put the bag in with the lines toward the bottom of the container, or do you have them up against your back. I've also done both and felt no difference on opening. It seems like every person I ask tells me something different so what do you all think. Thanks, Marc Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kris 0 #2 June 14, 2004 I would suggest going to the source and reading the owners manual. Just a suggestion... http://sunpath.com/service_rigging.htmSky, Muff Bro, Rodriguez Bro, and Bastion of Purity and Innocence!™ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Squeak 17 #3 June 14, 2004 Left Right per manual, Line on BOTTOM, not top the bag rolls (is lifted) out from top to bottomYou are not now, nor will you ever be, good enough to not die in this sport (Sparky) My Life ROCKS! How's yours doing? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jumpinfarmer 0 #4 June 14, 2004 I know the book says left, right. And also to place the lines in the bottom but, several people I know do it differant. When I said to put the lines toward your back it was in a way that the bag would not roll at all durring deployment. It would just come strait out. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diablopilot 2 #5 June 14, 2004 Quote When I said to put the lines toward your back it was in a way that the bag would not roll at all durring deployment. It would just come strait out. It's not the way the manufacturer designed or intended it to be used. I'd stick with the book. Changing the method can lead to problems.---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kris 0 #6 June 14, 2004 Quote I know the book says left, right. And also to place the lines in the bottom but, several people I know do it differant. When I said to put the lines toward your back it was in a way that the bag would not roll at all durring deployment. It would just come strait out. Follow the book. I would think that the people who designed the rig would be who you would want to listen to in regards to the closing order. As for the bag...some rigs you can get away with that on, some you can't. Right now, I believe only the Wings container can be packed with the lines towards the backpad. Mirage, Vector, Javelin, Infinity, and others recommend putting the lines towards the BOC. The other thing with rotating the bag is that if your bag isn't cut square, your rig is going to look awfully pregnant if you pack it with the lines towards the backpad.Sky, Muff Bro, Rodriguez Bro, and Bastion of Purity and Innocence!™ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hookitt 1 #7 June 14, 2004 Quote It's not the way the manufacturer designed or intended it to be used. I'd stick with the book. Changing the method can lead to problems. I'm not suggesting differing from the manufacturer, but what problems would this lead to?My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diablopilot 2 #8 June 14, 2004 Well for example the incident which killed James Martin was attributed to an underset grommet, but apparently a contributing factor was his stowing the D-bag in a fashion not approved by the manufacturer. I definately wouldn't recomend changing the packing method for the D-bag in a rig that has the closing loop attachment point (and associated grommet) INSIDE the container. Of course I far prefer having the closing loop installed in the botom flap.---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hookitt 1 #9 June 14, 2004 That was an underset grommet on the closing loop tab correct? The same incident that caused the service bulletin?My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diablopilot 2 #10 June 14, 2004 Yep. Was also a case of lines stowed to the top if my sources of information are correct and I believe that they are.---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
teason 0 #11 June 14, 2004 I think in the early nineties it was right left for a while and then changed back.(Sunpath would know for sure) We did IADs on javalins closing them right left and found that the bridle sometimes caught the flap and caused a pilotchute hesitation. When simulated on the ground with a tight closing loop, you could pick up a 40lbs student rig by the PC. I know of one DZO who refused to believe this citing stacked grommets and symetrical closing flaps. He still does left right even though it contradicts the manual. As for the lines, I've never heard of lines going against your back. I just don't think it's designed for that! I would imagine you would get excessive wear. talk about a square peg in a round hole...I would rather be a superb meteor, every atom of me in magnificent glow, than a sleepy and permanent planet. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tink1717 2 #12 June 14, 2004 Quote ... I believe only the Wings container can be packed with the lines towards the backpad... Nope, they go to the bottom. Where did you hear that? (just curious)Skydivers don't knock on Death's door. They ring the bell and runaway... It really pisses him off. -The World Famous Tink. (I never heard of you either!!) AA #2069 ASA#33 POPS#8808 Swooo 1717 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr2mk1g 10 #13 June 14, 2004 Check the manual - that's where he heard it. The Wings manual says you can do either. I think it's because the D-bag is square end on whereas other rigs have rectangular profiles. That's just my guess though, but it's def in the manual. See here: http://www.skydivewings.com/Wings%20Owners%20Manual%2011-02%20Single%20Page%20Format.pdf Curiously it lists either packing with the lines against the backpad or rotating the bag so the lines are against the reserve pack tray.... isn't that the wrong way round? It's not how I've been doing it... Opinions? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Snowflake 0 #14 June 14, 2004 Quote I would suggest going to the source and reading the owners manual. Just a suggestion... I did and now I'm confused looking at the wings manual it says Quote Thread the pull-up cord through the closing loop. Close the bottom flap, then the top flap, then the right side flap, and then the left side flap. Insert the curved pin through the closing loop and remove the pull-up cord. Which is opposite to how I've been doing it, but to make things worse the diagram for closing the container with a BOC has right flap as the last flap. Then to really confuse me the pull out closing sequence is the same as above and it's diagram does have the left flap as the last flap. So now I'm just confused if anyone can shed some light please do my head hurts. you shouldn't have to think this early in the morning......Maybe ignorance is bliss Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterrig 1 #15 June 14, 2004 Seems as though, at the DZ, you can ask several folks the same question and and get that many answers. I'd have to go along with Kris and read the owner's manual or, as he suggested, go to Sunpath's web-site and download it. With all the R&D that manufacturer's do in regard to their products, I would trust them. Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerrob 643 #16 June 14, 2004 The Wings manual says that you have the option of packing the smaller versions with lines against BOC or lines against backpad. That is because smaller Wings have "square" (when viewed from the side) main d-bags. If you packed a "long" d-bag - with lines to backpad - it would look fungly. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
teason 0 #17 June 14, 2004 The three magic words in rigging Call the manufacturure. It's probably either a typo or they changed their closing sequence sometime after they had the pretty pictures. Only they know for sure. I would rather be a superb meteor, every atom of me in magnificent glow, than a sleepy and permanent planet. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerrob 643 #18 June 14, 2004 We did IADs on javalins closing them right left and found that the bridle sometimes caught the flap and caused a pilotchute hesitation. When simulated on the ground with a tight closing loop, you could pick up a 40lbs student rig by the PC. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Reminds me of a problem we had with static-lined Telesis student rigs, back in the 1990s. We recommended routing S/L out upper left corner when dropping students from Cessnas and out upper right corner when using Twin Otter. One DZ had both airplanes and got too busy to reclose rigs during busy days. The result was a lot of shredded inner top flaps. Remember that S/L jerks far worse than IAD. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
meatbomb 0 #19 June 14, 2004 Quote Opinions? The Wings manual is crap. Seriously though, it's incredibly unprofessional to have a manual that contradicts itself it not one, but two places...--- Swoopert, CS-Aiiiiiii! Piccies Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr2mk1g 10 #20 June 14, 2004 I'd agree with that - the manual does not appear to have been written by someone who speaks English as their first language. I may well be wrong, but that’s just the “feel” I get from it and the style of writing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hooknswoop 19 #21 June 14, 2004 Bottom, Top, Right, Left will prevent the bridle from snagging the RH flap and cause a PC in tow or hesitation. Ironically you can close the Left or Right reserve flap first, doesn't matter. Derek Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterrig 1 #22 June 14, 2004 We had that discussion, at the last Symposium. The spacing from the center of the grommet to the outer edge of the Right and Left closing flap(s) is the same. For all practical purposes, like you said; "doesn't matter." If someone asks me, I'll just quote the owner's manual. Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hooknswoop 19 #23 June 14, 2004 Quote We had that discussion, at the last Symposium. The spacing from the center of the grommet to the outer edge of the Right and Left closing flap(s) is the same. For all practical purposes, like you said; "doesn't matter." If someone asks me, I'll just quote the owner's manual. Doesn't matter for the reserve flaps. It does matter for the main flaps. If the left is closed first, then the right flap presents a snag hazard to the PC bridle. Derek Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterrig 1 #24 June 14, 2004 Thanks! I should've been more specific. Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bdev 0 #25 June 15, 2004 Quote Quote Doesn't matter for the reserve flaps. It does matter for the main flaps. If the left is closed first, then the right flap presents a snag hazard to the PC bridle. Derek So you're saying it should be right then left for a Javelin ? (just to clear this up, as there's been some discussion about Wings in this thread)--- One life...Use it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
