Learning Before Jumping

[PinPointer 0]

I bought some paragliding DVD's and found this forum. I usually learn by discussing my ideas, and learn more as I refine my knowledge.

Many of the people posting on this forum seem to have more experience. I have yet to make my first jump. I am interested in learning about strategies to control my point of landing. I have no idea how to control the rigging. I am just starting to watch my paragliding DVD's.

I plan to learn more before I make my first jump. It seems like there is probably not much time to think up creative ideas on the way down, so it would probably be better for me to have some options in mind, before I go up.

I try to take criticism constructively, so if any one sees some better ideas for me, please let me know.

I chose the name Pin Pointer to describe my current goal orientation of learning how to get to where I want to go, on the ground, or water! Cheating the wind, and finding a friendly breeze, are related objectives.

[dannydan 5]

  Quote

Cheating the wind, and finding a friendly breeze, are related objectives.

somwhat yes! But LEARNING how to "work with" nature is best! That of course after retaining and implementing instruction(s) from your EXPEIRENCED coach/instructor!!

WELCOME to the forums and best of luck to you!

[grannyinthesky 0]

From my rather limited perspective, knowledge in your head doesn't necessarily come out of hiding when you are in the air. I'll admit to having the same idea as you appear to have, but i have abandoned that for working with my instructors closely. There have been a substantial number of things that I "knew", but failed to know when it was time to use the knowledge. It will be a blast and the necessary skills and knowledge will come with time. Pat

"safety first... and What the hell.....
safety second, Too!!! " ~~jmy

POPS #10490

[skymama 37]

Welcome to the forums!

She is Da Man, and you better not mess with Da Man,
because she will lay some keepdown on you faster than, well, really fast. ~Billvon

[PinPointer 0]

Dear Sky Mama

I found the SIM manual for sale, for $25.00, on the USPA website. It took me a few visits to find the link to the free download PDF copy.

http://www.uspa.org/publications/SIM/2008SIM/SIM.htm

I am watching my Paragliding DVD's as I have time. I am trying to understand the terminology and headings for the DVD chapters.

I am not familiar with many skydiving terms and abbreviations. I found a Glossary of skydiving terms:

http://www.dropzone.com/safety/resources/handbook/gloss2.shtml

I may utilize this thread to keep Links to useful skydiving learning information references.

Here is another free PDF manual on Parachuting I found:

http://parachutemanuals.com/

Here is a link to the free PDF Arizona Parachute Manual

http://www.dropzone.com/safety/resources/handbook/index.shtml

The links I put in this post to other DZ threads and other info do not seem to work. I put the links also in Word on my computer, so I can make the links work. I searched the DZ form on Links, but did not find anything about how to make links work. I know there are rules about spamming, and I was trying to observe that by only citing free stuff.

[174fps 1]

  Quote

I searched the DZ form on Links, but did not find anything about how to make links work. .

http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?do=markup_help;

[PinPointer 0]

Dear 174 fps,

Thanks for the link to make links work on DZ.

I have been spoiled by the automatic feature on some forums.

http://www.gossamer-threads.com


DZ Glossary




[url]http://www.dropzone.com/safety/resources/handbook/gloss2.shtml /[url]

[url]http://www.dropzone.com/safety/resources/handbook/gloss2.shtml


Maybe a technique would be to copy up to the http://, and then copy into the Gossamer format

The first url jumped up a line on one of my attempts.

I have been posting on a forum where links to resources are expected and demanded, so maybe posting Links is not so popular on DZ. I just like to have a place to post my links for references.

..

[dannydan 5]

HEY HEY HEY here...... are we talking url link and html markup language or are we talking SKYDIVING??


c'mon

[PinPointer 0]

Dear Danny Dan,

I am such a beginner that I can't even understand the posts. I need to understand the words and abbreviations, before I can even start commenting on Swoops and Canopy Control.

I need to get some basic words and references to even start.

Can you get a license without actually jumping first?

[PinPointer 0]

Dear Danny Dan,

I don't feel that I am ready for a coach just yet, as my first dive is months away.

However, I did try to follow up on the concept of finding a coach. I did some searching and was unable to find a Parachute Coach Directory.

I found a thread talking about a button on the "top", but I don't see it.

"I am unsure if it's going to end up being a database that you can access by hitting a link at the top of this forum or simply a big, locked, sticky post that will remain at the top and be edited as I receive notification from qualified individuals.

Just a quick note about that. "Qualified" is a very nebulous term when it comes to instruction and coaching in disciplines which are not regulated by your nation's governing parachute organization. There are quite a few people out there who are fantastic teachers with other "real" ratings, but have never competed in canopy competition in any of the at least three sub-disciplines: swooping, classic accuracy, demonstration accuracy. "



http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=2505063;search_string=Coach%20Directory;#2505063



Any Coaching Directory references for me?




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[skymama 37]

  Quote

Can you get a license without actually jumping first?

No, you need 25 jumps to get your A License.

She is Da Man, and you better not mess with Da Man,
because she will lay some keepdown on you faster than, well, really fast. ~Billvon

[PinPointer 0]

Dear Sky Mama,

I was Googling for Parachute License Qualifications, and found this free PDF on parachute packing:

http://a257.g.akamaitech.net/7/257/2422/11feb20051500/edocket.access.gpo.gov/cfr_2005/janqtr/pdf/14cfr105.43.pdf


I also found this Flight School List:

http:///www.flightschoollist.com/skydivingparachute.htm


Here is the Link to a Directory of Sky Diving Schools in the US:

http://www.flightschoollist.com/skydivingparachute.htm


The Home page also has a Link to a directory of Paragliding schools.


USPA Parachute Website Home

http://www.uspa.org


I found this Link to the USPA License requirements, Levels A through D.

http://www.uspa.org/licenses/index.htm




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[PinPointer 0]

Dear Sky Mama,


It appears that a jump is not required to become a Certified Parachute Rigger.

52 Page FAA Certification Guide

http://rgl.faa.gov/Regulatory_and_Guidance_Library/rgAdvisoryCircular.nsf/0/9a2a098126ceb0ec862569dc00722032/$FILE/ac65-5b.pdf




http://www.dropzone.com/safety/resources/handbook/gloss2.shtml#C

[skymama 37]

Sorry, I thought you were talking about a skydiving license.

She is Da Man, and you better not mess with Da Man,
because she will lay some keepdown on you faster than, well, really fast. ~Billvon

[PinPointer 0]

Dear Sky Mama,

As I am posting, I am learning. I have printed out the DZ glossary, and the SIM Glossary.

I am not ready to jump yet, so I am just making preperatoy, learning moves.

I have spent more time getting aclimated to the DZ forum, than I have spent watching my Paragliding Instructional DVD's.

I should probably shop on E-bay to see if I can pick up some Instructional DVD's at more reasonable prices.

I still have no clue what the handles do, on the parachutes, or how to recover from a stall.

I need to learn more about cross winds, prevailing winds, and updraft situations. On a paragliding site, it recounted two paragliders being lifted some 10,000 feet, while paragliding near a mouintain, some seemingly safe distance from thuderstorm clouds.

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[grannyinthesky 0]

Hi, You might want to think about relaxing a little. I'll admit to almost having the category A part of the SIM memorized by the time I did my first jump course. It turns out, that I really didn't help myself very much. The world of skydiving is a very different place and it is PHYSICAL more than mental. Seeing videos, memorizing terms and so on, really can't build the muscle memory that you will need. What I found is that the knowledge was simply stuck in my head and didn't translate well to physical actions and reactions. What the names of parts of a canopy are doesn't matter when you are trying to control one of those things in the wind, for example. I hope you can jump really soon so you will understand what many here have been trying to tell you.
Learning to pack, by the way, is also very phisical. I have been learning how and I'm good at understanding what I am supposed to do. I could describe the steps very nicely. But getting the canopy to cooperate with me is another story. It is a physical skill and physicals skills take physical practice, not mental practice.
When do you plan on starting?
Pat

"safety first... and What the hell.....
safety second, Too!!! " ~~jmy

POPS #10490

[PinPointer 0]

Dear Pat,

Thanks for the input about Muscular Memory. Has to be learned by actually jumping.

I watched some of my videos lasgt night. Still learning the terms. A coach would have spend most of the time teaching me the terms, to be able to coach me.

I am so unfamiliar with the Sky Diving concepts and terms, that I am really uncoachable. Not that I am that good at following directions, naturally, in th first place.

A lot of the success of a jump depends on what is done before the jump. So I have considerable more gound-learning potential.

Best skies to you!

[grannyinthesky 0]

You're not giving yourself enough credit, or lyour instructors, either. You don't need to learn it all at once. Your insructors will be sure that you understand what they want you to do before you try it in the sky. The learning terms thing is sort of ok, but knowing what flare means for example doesn't have anything to do with knowing how to do it properly and actually doing it. This is the voice of experience speaking. You also don't want to practice doing things until your instructor has shown you how to do them. That can lead to having to unlearn stuff which isn't easy. Coaching, by the way, is what comes after your instructors have taught you most of the basic skills you need. They are well trained in how to teach beginning skydivers what they need to do. How long until you jump?
Pat

"safety first... and What the hell.....
safety second, Too!!! " ~~jmy

POPS #10490

[PinPointer 0]

Dear Pat,

I am interested in learning how to parachute without taking the risk of actually jumping, for now.

I enjoy risks, but I recognize that I am the type of person who likes to push the limits, which is not a good idea for motorcycles or skydiving, which are both fairly unforgiving. Both also entail unforseeable circumstances, which can be unavoidably hazardous.

One advantage of being ABLE to parachute, is to have the potential to land in remote locations, so that I can offer instructional services to people in remote areas. What instructional services do you think might be important for people in remote parts of the world?

I watched some more of a beginning Paragliding DVD last night.

I am surmising that the Handles are brakes for that side of the Parachute. The brakes close down the trailing edge of the Cells, slowing forward movement.

Landing is usually done by stalling, which is by pulling on the D Straps, or "Risers", for the trailing edge, which creates an upward direction, but creates a stall when pulled far enough.



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[grannyinthesky 0]

Oh, this makes your questions more understandable, but to safely parachute into remote areas, you would need a lot of experience that you can only get by jumping, not reading. Even being able to describe and explain every part of the process of doing a jump, the actual jumping is very different. Freefall, for example, is the biggest collection of radically new sensations that I have ever experienced. Try typing "sensory overload" into the search box. You'll see what I mean.

"safety first... and What the hell.....
safety second, Too!!! " ~~jmy

POPS #10490

[PinPointer 0]

I talked to a lady who used to skydive, the other day. She explained that pulling the left handle downward turns you to the left. This seems logical as pulling the left handle down puts on the brakes on the left side, and forward motion on the left would be slowed down, and the right side would continue, un-slowed. So as long as I am going forward, into the wind, then I will turn to the left, as I pull the left handle down. If there was no forward movement in the air, then pulling the handles would not turn me. I would need some forward air speed to turn.

I am recalling a friend who had a lot of jumps in the Army. He said his ankle got messed up, when he did not land just right, when he had to use his reserve chute.

My Army friend said that the guy who packed his chute for that jump, was a jerk. I asked him, "Didn't you check your chute before you jumped?"

My Airborne friend replied, "I never learned how to pack the chute. I just did the jumping."

I thought to myself, that before I jump, I am going to learn how to pack the chute.

Another friend who sky dives said he learned to pack his chute before jumping, as part of the training.

I talked to a Skydiving place nearby. The guy was a certified Rigger. Said I could come hang around and watch. Maybe I could sweep the floor or wash their cars to be useful. What simple chores are helpful around the hanger?


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[labrys 0]

  Quote

I talked to a lady who used to skydive, the other day. She explained that pulling the left handle downward turns you to the left. This seems logical as pulling the left handle down puts on the brakes on the left side, and forward motion on the left would be slowed down, and the right side would continue, un-slowed. So as long as I am going forward, into the wind, then I will turn to the left, as I pull the left handle down. If there was no forward movement in the air, then pulling the handles would not turn me. I would need some forward air speed to turn.

Good luck with getting out there and actually making your first jump!

Just to clear things up in the quote above. What we commonly call "handles" are not used to steer the canopy. The canopy is steered with "toggles" that are also sometimes called "brakes"

"Handles" are deployment and emergency release mechanisms (ie, the main deployment, the main cutaway, and the reserve deployment)

I just had a thought.... you seem very keen on learning even though you may not have commited to actually jumping yet, and that's understandable. It does concern me a little though that if you do decide to go jump, you might be bringing some preconceived notions (that may or may not be correct) about the gear into your training. That could be a bad thing.

First jump training is designed for people with zip-zero knowledge of jumping and the equipment. The class teaches you everything you need to know. You might consider slowing down on the book work a bit. The last thing you want to do is train yourself to pull a toggle when you really need to be pulling a handle.

Someone else suggested going to a DZ to hang out. I'd suggest that if you really want to learn about jumping without commiting to a jump, ask at the DZ if you can sit in on the first jump class one day without the "jump" part. I doubt they'd have a problem with that. At worst, they might charge a nominal fee.

Owned by Remi #?

[grannyinthesky 0]

  Quote

I just had a thought.... you seem very keen on learning even though you may not have commited to actually jumping yet, and that's understandable. It does concern me a little though that if you do decide to go jump, you might be bringing some preconceived notions (that may or may not be correct) about the gear into your training. That could be a bad thing.

THanks for expressing your concerns here. I've had some concerns about the OP trying things because he's read about them here or wlsewhere. I hope he takes your words to heart. He seems bent on trying to learn how to skydive from books and videos. With even my few jumps, I know that's looking for disaster.

"safety first... and What the hell.....
safety second, Too!!! " ~~jmy

POPS #10490

[PinPointer 0]

Thanks for pointing out the pitfalls of my "Learning First" approach. I am trying to learn how to reduce the chance of accidents. I am not sure how to best exit the plane with the best chance of avoiding a tail hit.

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[grannyinthesky 0]

By going to a DZ and doing what your instructors tell you. They are trained to help you learn to jump safely. Too much book and video browsing can set you up for unlearning. For me, I have to put my absolute trust in my instructors first of all and then in myself to be able to do what they tell me. Why not go to a DZ in your area and talk to an instructor there and see what they tell you?

"safety first... and What the hell.....
safety second, Too!!! " ~~jmy

POPS #10490