StearmanR985 0 #1 April 28, 2004 Spectre 150 loaded at 1.4:1 Winds: A good 10 mph PRO packed Jumped once so far (damn work gettin in the way) My initial reaction is that this is truly a great canopy!! Opening was nice and soft. It responds very quickly to toggle input. Turns are fast but altitude does appear to drop quite rapidly with hard turns. Front riser turns take a bit of effort to initiate but once established it seemed easy to control the rate of turn. I did not attempt to make a hard turn on fronts at this time so I do not know what kind of pressure it would take to maintain a hard turn. The canopy responded very well to rear riser input as well. You can plane it out, if you so desire, with very little rear riser effort. I found the best part to be in the flare. Flare power is far more than I expected. When I first started my flare the canopy responded immediately. In fact, I had to hold it for bit as I got closer to the ground before finishing. By the time I did tip toe down (sort of), I was only at half brakes. I realize the 10 mph wind was helping but the flare response still thoroughly impressed me over the Saber2 170 and my Tri 175. Even though I have only jumped it once so far I feel that this will probably be the one I purchase. I fell in love with it from the moment I first pulled on the toggles. Once my hands were in the toggles and I started experimenting I felt right at home. That's my take thus far. Any comments? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
samyueru 0 #2 April 28, 2004 Thanks a lot for posting you're impressions! I'm looking to get a spectre myself, so that review was helpful. Seems like they're a well reviewed canopy form what I've heard from them. Does anyone have any negative comments about one? -Alex Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kris 0 #3 April 28, 2004 Quote Any comments? Yes....your wingloading at your number of jumps worries me greatly. That would be my only comment.Sky, Muff Bro, Rodriguez Bro, and Bastion of Purity and Innocence!™ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nightingale 0 #4 April 28, 2004 Personally, I didn't like the steeper glide ratio on the spectre. I've found I prefer 9 cell canopies, at least at this point. I had wonderful openings with the spectre, but awful landings. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 20 #5 April 28, 2004 The Spectre actually has a better glide ratio then the original Sabre does and its nearly identical to a few other 9 cells on the market due to its choice in airfoil. 7 cells some times do perform better then 9 cells for gliding. In terms of the review.. .search the archives. LOTS of good reading on the Spectre.Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StearmanR985 0 #6 April 28, 2004 Quote Personally, I didn't like the steeper glide ratio on the spectre. I've found I prefer 9 cell canopies, at least at this point. I had wonderful openings with the spectre, but awful landings. Interesting. For what ever reason, I seem to prefer the steeper glide angle. Oh well, we are all different. BTW, my necklace is still treating me well. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nightingale 0 #7 April 28, 2004 I've never jumped an original sabre. had a nice experience demoing a sabre2, though. I put about 12 jumps on a spectre and didn't have a single stand up landing. Demoed my silhouette and had my first stand-up in fifteen jumps. I'm getting stand-up landings now about every other jump. One of my instructors suggested going back to a 9 cell from the spectre because of my landing difficulties, and it seems that his solution was correct, because I have a much easier time landing my silhouette or the demo sabre2 than the spectre of the same size (190) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pilotdave 0 #8 April 28, 2004 If you liked the spectre flare, try a sabre2 if you havent yet. I was about ready to buy a spectre after I demoed it, but decided to try a sabre2 before making a decision. The flare is what changed my mind. Dave Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
headoverheels 333 #9 April 28, 2004 Quote Interesting. For what ever reason, I seem to prefer the steeper glide angle. Get a long spot and you might change your mind. FWIW, a couple of people at Lodi don't like Spectre landings, and are moving to other canopies. The words "lawn dart" were used. Maybe reserve judgement for some no-wind landings. At some loading, it's quite a good canopy. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StearmanR985 0 #10 April 28, 2004 Quote Yes....your wingloading at your number of jumps worries me greatly. That would be my only comment. I know it is aggressive but not outrageous. All I can say is that I intend to be quite diligent with my canopy control both for my safety and the safety of others in the air with me. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nightingale 0 #11 April 28, 2004 have you taken a canopy class yet? I think I'm going to take one in june (soonest I'll have the cash). Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StearmanR985 0 #12 April 28, 2004 Quote Get a long spot and you might change your mind. FWIW, a couple of people at Lodi don't like Spectre landings, and are moving to other canopies. The words "lawn dart" were used. Maybe reserve judgement for some no-wind landings. At some loading, it's quite a good canopy. Hey, this is Lodi, we don't get long spots over here!! Okay, maybe once in awhile we do, but that's what the rear risers are for right? You are right, I did notice it to be a bit ground hungry even in the 10 mph winds. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StearmanR985 0 #13 April 28, 2004 Quote have you taken a canopy class yet? I think I'm going to take one in june (soonest I'll have the cash). Nope. There is a rumor that some peeps are trying to put something together to get Brian Germain over here (Nor Cal) in the near future. Haven't heard anything more about it though. If he does come up here, I am taking the course. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 20 #14 April 29, 2004 Why not head to SoCal and the Icarus boys would love to teach you more then you thought was possible on a 170.Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vdschoor 0 #15 April 29, 2004 Quote Hey, this is Lodi, we don't get long spots over here!! Okay, maybe once in awhile we do, but that's what the rear risers are for right? Hmm I seem to remember a speedstar competition were the 1st 2 round we landed out... And that sucks out there, looking around and as far as the eye can see (or your canopy could potentially fly) there would be grapes or roads with powerlines... I had to land on a really small piece of "open" field with a huge tree right smack in the middle. Anyhoo.. that was under my Triathlon at the time. You will be very happy with the Spectre I am sure, still the wingloading is a little high for your experience, but who am I to talk about that.. I just know I would take a very good look at the wingloading page on PD and realize that that wingloading puts you between the "Expert" and "Max" wingloading... Be careful Jeff, hope to see you soon (and jump with you!) Iwan Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 273 #16 April 29, 2004 Quote but that's what the rear risers are for right? No... that's what deep brakes are for. It's funny to hear people saying they can't land a seven cell... imho if you can't get a standup landing out of any canopy, regardless of the number of cells, it's time for some remedial coaching and maybe thinking about upsizing. I find it's easier to get accurate landings out a seven cell than it is with a nine cell - while some people may pooh pooh the importance of accuracy I feel it's a survival skill. But then again I've never loaded a canopy over 1.25 so what do I know... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkydiveNFlorida 0 #17 April 29, 2004 Quote No... that's what deep brakes are for. My understanding is that it depends on the canopy... althought i'm not sure of why that is (I guess trim of the canopies makes some better with rears and others deep brakes..?). I was advised by Brian Germain to spread my rear risers if needed to make it back from a long spot under my canopy. I don't fly a PD, tho, and I recall Scott Miller advising me differently under a PD Sabre II. I am curious to know why one method is preferrable over another depending on canopy (type/trim). As far as the spectre goes. I flew one for a day and didn't like it. To me, it felt like it had crap for flare... landable, but certainly not preferrable imo. I had been jumping a Sabre II then Stiletto prior to trying it out, so I was spoiled I guess. Although, I am going to guess that at a 1.4w/l you'll get better flare than I did at 1:1. Still, I definitely would demo more than one type of canopy before buying. Angela. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 273 #18 April 29, 2004 Quote My understanding is that it depends on the canopy That's what I've been told; I was also told it depends on what the winds are doing. What I can say and be 100% sure of is for me, under a Spectre at wingloadings between .9 and 1.1, with winds at my back, going into deep brakes gets me further back than does using rear risers. Quote I definitely would demo more than one type of canopy before buying. That is advice anyone thinking about a new canopy should heed - and I'd add not just one type of canopy but also canopies from more than one manufacturer. Just because I love my Spectre doesn't mean it's the right canopy for everyone; just because I'm comfortable and happy at 1.0 doesn't mean that's the right wingloading for everyone (although I strongly feel that no matter how "good" a jumper is at canopy control, 1.4 is excessive for someone with 100 jumps). Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkydiveNFlorida 0 #19 April 29, 2004 Quote That's what I've been told; I was also told it depends on what the winds are doing. What I can say and be 100% sure of is for me, under a Spectre at wingloadings between .9 and 1.1, with winds at my back, going into deep brakes gets me further back than does using rear risers. Can't argue with experience:D I sent a pm to Brian Germain asking if he might clarify things a bit for me. Who knows, maybe it's covered in his book (which I hope comes this week!!) Quote - and I'd add not just one type of canopy but also canopies from more than one manufacturer. Yeah, I forgot to mention that. I was told by so many that PD was the ONLY way to go!! PD is a great company, but I am also very happy with my non-pd canopy. So, certainly people should try for themselves. Quote (although I strongly feel that no matter how "good" a jumper is at canopy control, 1.4 is excessive for someone with 100 jumps). No comment there. I still haven't jumped at that w/l so have no basis for comment. Angela. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #20 April 29, 2004 I have roughly 1900 jumps on Spectres loaded at about 1.2 to 1.3 depending on how closely I'm paying attention to what I eat. Spectres are fantastic canopies that you can use for just about everything short of competitive swooping. They're also pretty forgiving of minor packing errors and are predictable and dependable as far as openings go. I've never had to cutaway (others have, but not me yet). Glide ratio is not really an issue. Landings are also predictable and I used my Spectres to get my PRO rating. I -highly- recommend them. No. I'm not sponsored.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
maxmadmax 8 #21 April 29, 2004 I jumped a Spectre at the WFFC. When it deployed....wham!... that SOB actually made the back of my head and azz touch. It knocked me out. I came to about 15 seconds later and was seeing the proverbial stars.***** So what did I do? Hell, I bought one. But the key is that I PACK IT! And never have had a problem since. Nice smooth openings.... Don't go away mad....just go away! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diablopilot 2 #22 April 29, 2004 Quote But then again I've never loaded a canopy over 1.25 so what do I know... But I have, and I'll tell you that accuracy is a survival skill. I've regularly loaded as high as 2.4 and can put my canopies where I want them. If a person cant do that regularly on their canopy, they either need training, or a new canopy.---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
piisfish 140 #23 April 29, 2004 I have a few jumps (4-5) on a Spectre 150 loaded around 1.2 was a nice experience, a good 7cell canopy. Now I can't really judge due to my inexperience compared to many... but Quote As far as the spectre goes. I flew one for a day and didn't like it. To me, it felt like it had crap for flare... landable, but certainly not preferrable imo. I had been jumping a Sabre II then Stiletto prior to trying it out, so I was spoiled I guess. it has already been said by others in other threads... Did you ever see Bruno Brokken and his Spectre ??? I think his landings are as impressive (or more) as many I have seen with Stiletto's or similar. The person under the canopy really makes the difference. And Bruno is an incredible skydiverscissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VectorBoy 0 #24 April 29, 2004 Quote Quote but that's what the rear risers are for right? No... that's what deep brakes are for. Quote If you are up wind of your landing zone hanging in brakes and being stingy with your Altitudeis the way to go as the winds will do their part to bring you to the landing area. If your are down wind you will still have to be stingy with altitude but smart about howstingy and now the winds will not do their part to bring you back but will actually make things harder on you. You need all of the glide you can get out of your canopy but without it compromising your penetration into the headwind. Hanging in rear risers, which can be physically hard for some people, and takes some finesse to keep from inputing too much. Letting your risers spread out by loosening your chest strap,which not everyone wants to do. Picking up your legs, getting smaller with less frontal area drag will be the way to go. This is a skill and it takes practice. It is much easier for manufactures to say hang in x-amount of brakes as this a more forgiving method of being stingy but in the end not the optimum way to go. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #25 April 29, 2004 Quote under a Spectre at wingloadings between .9 and 1.1, with winds at my back, going into deep brakes gets me further back than does using rear risers. That's more of a PD thing, atleast with every PD canopy I've ever jumped (just about everything but a velocity and lightening). With my old canopy (Heatwave) I'd cover a LOT more distance with rear-risers. With my crossfire2 it depends on what I'm going for. If I need a flat glide but distance, I use rears. If I need to float and wait for traffic to clear, its toggles. Basically, what it means is, folks should go up and not only get good canopy coaching, they need to do altitude clear and pulls, working with EVERY input on their canopy till they can truely fly it. If you think you know every way to fly a canopy, go get some CReW coaching. You WILL learn something, I promise!--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
