Faber 0 #26 November 5, 2005 im whith Sean on that one.. but then again im not good at #´s and telling me that the wind is blowing xmph will only give me a clue,ill need to smell the object and the air.. then ill make a dessision whether ill jump or not.. that said i have jumped in too much wind and feel good about it and climbed down in 0 wind as it didnt feel right.. no gadget can tell me that.. Stay safe Stefan Faber Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BASE813 0 #27 November 5, 2005 Quote Might using these devices inhibit that ability? exactly Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BASE813 0 #28 November 5, 2005 Quoteim whith Sean on that one.. but then again im not good at #´s and telling me that the wind is blowing xmph will only give me a clue,ill need to smell the object and the air.. then ill make a dessision whether ill jump or not.. that said i have jumped in too much wind and feel good about it and climbed down in 0 wind as it didnt feel right.. no gadget can tell me that.. exactly (just like I said previously) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cornishe 0 #29 November 5, 2005 Quote"The ground looks kind of close down there... Hmm, my laser tells me it is ok, okidoki then.. c-ya" The ground constantly looks close. I can't eyeball the difference between 220 and 280. Can you? To me that's a big deal. I think the laser range finder is a great tool. .Abbie Mashaal Skydive Idaho Snake River Skydiving TandemBASE Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TomAiello 26 #30 November 5, 2005 QuoteWhat I do is picture someone standing there, jumping, getting line stretch, and then making whatever turns are needed to head home. I do this every time I look at an object. I'm glad I'm not the only one.-- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TomAiello 26 #31 November 5, 2005 QuoteQuoteKnowing the exact speed will help me determine what types of winds I am comfortable with. am I the only one that thinks this statement is somewhat wrong? I think he's saying that it gives him the ability to quantify the winds he is uncomfortable with. That means that in the future, he'll be better able to discuss those winds with other jumpers, and to check weather reports to know if it's even worthwhile to head out to the object.-- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Johnnyb 0 #32 November 5, 2005 QuoteThe ground constantly looks close. I can't eyeball the difference between 220 and 280. Can you? To me that's a big deal. I think the laser range finder is a great tool. Nope, can't say i do and i know what you mean. Think most of the issues about gizmoz has been talked about before, and they will be again. As long as we use it as a tool and a factor for the final dessision it will be valuable. So, without tools i'm throwing papertowels from A's, watching the flags from B's, some trees/bush on S and mostly wather from the E's + listening the little devil inside... I remember me and a friend at a local cliff bringing some line to find out how tal(or)low the thingy really was. We did some fishing from the exit, tied a knot and brought the result back to our labaratory after the jump for accurate length. We thought about 80m and jumped it like it would be, the result was more like 63m. Conclusion; from now on we could do 80m stuff from 60m JB out (Shit, my spelling is smelling - i blame the keyboard... It's norwegian...) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DexterBase 1 #33 November 6, 2005 I actually bought an anemometer for this very reason, and this was after I had 200 BASE jumps already. I wanted to be able to quantify wind speed. Up until that point, the only thing we had going was, "Well, the wind doesn't feel too bad. Wait there's a gust. Now it's not bad... hmmm..." In practice, the thing always ended up staying in the car and never actually made it to an exit point. Later it started to malfunction so I took it back to REI and traded it back in towards a new pair of hiking boots. Now I'm back to making educated guesses. Who knows... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pope 0 #34 November 6, 2005 QuoteGet a Triax T-Stake. It does everything else... it might tell wind speeds too. I have it on good authority that the T-stake does work as a wind gauge of sorts--Basically, hold it up to the wind, and if the bottle opener whistles, don't jump. And remember--it's never the wrong decision to walk down. If you're not comfortable, winds or not--save your packjob and ground crew. No shame in keeping yourself alive. pope Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MikePelkey 0 #35 November 6, 2005 Dwyer makes a portable hand-held wind meter that sells for $21. I used one for an air speed indicator mounted to a home built gyrocopter many years ago. I had nothing to compare it against for accuracy, but it seemed to work quite well. http://www.dwyer-inst.comIn theory, there is no difference bretween theory and practice. In practice, however, there is. - "RIP Forever Brian Schubert. Always remembered, Never forgotten" - Leroy DB http://www.johnny Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TomAiello 26 #36 November 6, 2005 Quotehttp://www.dwyer-inst.com Clicky.-- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dmcoco84 5 #37 November 6, 2005 QuoteQuoteQuoteKnowing the exact speed will help me determine what types of winds I am comfortable with. am I the only one that thinks this statement is somewhat wrong? I think he's saying that it gives him the ability to quantify the winds he is uncomfortable with. That means that in the future, he'll be better able to discuss those winds with other jumpers, and to check weather reports to know if it's even worthwhile to head out to the object. Yea that’s what I'm getting at. I'm not going to go up and just a use a tool say cool I’m jumping if they are under a certain level. I’m gonna use my brain too. An example of this is on Nov 1st,last time I climbed. I got up to 250 and the winds felt like they were blowing harder than I have previously been jumping and with the wind direction about 25-30 degrees off center I wasn’t really sure what I wanted to do. I’m not that good at determine xmph winds so after using my brain to decide whether I was fine right off the bat or whether I’d like some other sources of input, I could use a wind meter to get the exact wind. If I’m just off and the winds are normal to what I have been jumping then I can use that and my previous feelings to make a decision. Then if I am still feeling negative about the jump regardless of whether the winds are normal or heavier I can know for the future that at Xmph and X degrees I wasn’t comfortable. As my experience gets better that may change but its nice to have a reference for what I jump in and what I don’t. Different conditions are gonna change my decisions too. If the winds are high and going right down the middle, I’d be fine for a jump, but not crazy high and a good deal off center. Am I explaining this right? Pretty much after I make a decision on my comfort level with conditions using my head, I can use tools to log the exact wind speeds just to have a reference to the types of conditions I normal feel comfortable with. Winds and direction combined. Plus when I use VGC I can call a buddy and talk it over with him too. And actually did that too the last time I climbed. I called my buddy and had him check the conditions again on the net to see if there was a sudden change or if reports were just different. If I had exact wind speed, (he’s not there to feel it), he can give me his feelings also. As for the laser, Nick, that’s awesome that you can do that but I personally don’t think I’d be able to make accurate height determinations in that manner with my current experience level. Now here again….If I do as you say and try to make a picture, take a guess at the height, then on top of the object I can laser it and see how close my estimates are. This can train me at making better determination without the laser I think tools like wind meters and laser can be very useful if used in the right way. I think both the human and electronic factors and benefit each other! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dmcoco84 5 #38 November 6, 2005 QuoteSo, without tools i'm throwing papertowels I'd do that regardless of having a wind meter. Thats how I assess direction. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dmcoco84 5 #39 November 6, 2005 QuoteQuoteGet a Triax T-Stake. It does everything else... it might tell wind speeds too. I have it on good authority that the T-stake does work as a wind gauge of sorts--Basically, hold it up to the wind, and if the bottle opener whistles, don't jump. Is it that simple! Awesome I gotta get me one of those! QuoteAnd remember--it's never the wrong decision to walk down. If you're not comfortable, winds or not--save your packjob and ground crew. No shame in keeping yourself alive. pope Heck yea! I'm 4 for 7 On the A i climbed the other day. CLimbing is great exersice. I don't mind climbing down. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pope 0 #40 November 6, 2005 QuoteI think both the human and electronic factors [can] benefit each other! I agree, only that I think it's better to learn the former before implementing the latter. In the end, it's the human making the jump, not the tool. pope Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Luke 0 #41 November 6, 2005 I have a hand held anemometer and use it in the same manner. It occupies so little room that I often forget I have it and it cost so little that I don't care if it gets damaged. I don't think it reports gusts accurately and it's useless at quantifying additional risk associated with wind direction in relation to hazards and sources of turbulence. It's batteries eventually fail. All it does is give an indication of the average wind speed. But that is the good thing about it: it's never scared, it's never gagging to jump, it doesn't care what I may have put into getting to an exit point, or what social function I've given up to be there. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Faber 0 #42 November 6, 2005 ha ha it only made a few months of work then..he he Stay safe Stefan Faber Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DexterBase 1 #43 November 6, 2005 Yeah, you were there when I bought it. It seemed pretty cool at the time didn't it? Oh well. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Faber 0 #44 November 6, 2005 sure did,now im happy that i didnt got one myself.... Stay safe Stefan Faber Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MikePelkey 0 #45 November 6, 2005 <<<< I really trust my eyeballs and the wind on my face, and that's a skill you aren’t born with it has to be developed. Might using these devices inhibit that ability? >>>> Nick, Surely you don't advocate acquiring these skills through trial and error if serious errors can be avoided in the process?In theory, there is no difference bretween theory and practice. In practice, however, there is. - "RIP Forever Brian Schubert. Always remembered, Never forgotten" - Leroy DB http://www.johnny Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TomAiello 26 #46 November 6, 2005 Quote...acquiring these skills through trial and error if serious errors can be avoided in the process? An interesting side note: Back in the day, when "First Jump Courses" were months long and involved 50 or 60 jumps and multiple objects, I made a student of mine actually practice eyeballing object altitude, and then comparing with the altitude we determined with a laser. I got the idea from a CHP I talked to who said that most of the CHP patrolmen were able to estimate a vehicle's speed within 5 mph of the radar gun reading--and that he had once had a judge take him out to a busy street and call out vehicle speeds while the judge used a radar gun, to prove it.-- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pope 0 #47 November 6, 2005 QuoteBack in the day, when "First Jump Courses" were months long and involved 50 or 60 jumps and multiple objects, I made a student of mine actually practice eyeballing object altitude, and then comparing with the altitude we determined with a laser. I got the idea from a CHP I talked to who said that most of the CHP patrolmen were able to estimate a vehicle's speed within 5 mph of the radar gun reading--and that he had once had a judge take him out to a busy street and call out vehicle speeds while the judge used a radar gun, to prove it. I heard the same thing, only it was for CHP Motorcycle Patrolmen only--and it stands up in court. pope Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MikePelkey 0 #48 November 6, 2005 <<<< I don't think it reports gusts accurately and it's useless at quantifying additional risk associated with wind direction in relation to hazards and sources of turbulence. It's batteries eventually fail. All it does is give an indication of the average wind speed. >>>> For what its worth the Dwyer Wind Meter I mentioned in my previous post is a 100% mechanical low tech device. It has no batteries to run down and registers wind velocity including gusts in real time. Note that I used it as an air speed indicator and it was always facing in the right direction to monitor forward airspeed mounted on my gyrocopter. I'm not sure how well it would work as a hand-held wind meter, but that is what it was designed for.In theory, there is no difference bretween theory and practice. In practice, however, there is. - "RIP Forever Brian Schubert. Always remembered, Never forgotten" - Leroy DB http://www.johnny Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dmcoco84 5 #49 November 10, 2005 Found a really good looking Wind Meter if anyone else was interested. Wasn't really advertised on any other website and then I found it on www.ambientweather.com. It’s got the best of everything and nothing you don’t need. All the wind speed necessities, MPH reading, altitude, and a backlight for seeing at night. Its not to expensive either. http://www.ambientweather.com/ke25nivipowe.html Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
leroydb 0 #50 November 10, 2005 i already post that link earlier in this thread bro.... http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=1911171#1911171Leroy ..I knew I was an unwanted baby when I saw my bath toys were a toaster and a radio... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
