camera helmet for BASE jumping -> Optik Illusion?

[PhreeZone 20]

Foam will not help, you need to use crushable polystyrene if you really want to assist in protecting against brain injury.

To use an anlogy (I hate tem, they only muddy things up) for helmets: If you think of an egg as your head what would you rather have around it... a painted on layer of epoxy that might keep the shell of the egg fine but will send the yolk slamming into the shell on an impact and breaking it or a protector that breaks and collapsesaround the egg preventing the yolk from moving around inside?

The hardest shell in the world might just prevent a puncture, but it will do nothing to prevent your brain from slamming into the insides of your skull and killing you that way. A better shell is one that absorbs some of the impact while sending as much energy as possible into a crushable liner and a breakable shell. Most the energy is absorbed before the brain has a chance to move inside the skull so what little energy being transfered will not cause near the internal damage.

Yesterday is history
And tomorrow is a mystery

Parachutemanuals.com

[evilivan 0]

Don't remember giving you permission to post one of my shots on a public forum, moffy....


(In fact, don't remember giving you permission to live in my country; note to self: must follow that up and get you deported)

"If you can keep your head when all around you have lost theirs, then you probably haven't understood the seriousness of the situation."
David Brent

[TomAiello 26]

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...but I would rather have a Bone head of some configuration....

I would say you already do....

Sam, play nice. The whole point of communicating on safety issues is to get people to change potentially unsafe practices. Slamming people after they've already learned something quite useful is really going to be counterproductive.

Consider this my nice warning speech.

-- Tom Aiello

Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[TomAiello 26]

Dude, if you turn that caps lock off your posts will come across as a lot less confrontational.

-- Tom Aiello

Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[skreamer 1]

Just keep it quiet, Jules took the other pic.

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In fact, don't remember giving you permission to live in my country; note to self: must follow that up and get you deported

I'm just here for the free dental care.

[freakboy066 0]

I was not trying to be confrontational.I was just trying to make a point.I'll just underline it next time.This is getting a little like the old bitch board.

http://freakboy066.tripod.com/

[freakboy066 0]

I just said foam for a lack of a better word.I am not sure what the name of it is,but it is alot like the Tempurpedic bed foam.It is used by NASA,and also alot in racecar seats.

http://freakboy066.tripod.com/

[K763 0]

If you think of an egg as your head what would you rather have around it...

When I was in grade school we had an "egg-drop" competition. We each wrapped a whole, uncooked egg in some type of protective packaging and then in a box. The boxes were all dropped from a Cessna from probably 1000 feet. After we'd searched and found as many boxes as we could, we opened them to see the results.

The winner was the egg wrapped in bubble wrap. The egg was perfect (but I don't know if the yolk was broken inside or not). It was simple, effective, and easy. Since that person only used one material and still had a whole egg, she was judged the winner.

So I guess I should line my Bonehead RatHat with Bubble wrap????

I never did find my egg-in-the-box...

Peace,
K

[PhreeZone 20]

>.I am not sure what the name of it is,but it is alot like the Tempurpedic bed foam.It is used by NASA,and also alot in racecar seats.

Thats way too soft of a foam if its the ones used for comfort. A good safety styrene is one that if you push hard on it can can hear some of the tiny air pockets breaking. Clearly if its so soft that a push with your thumb dents it, its too soft.

There is a reason Bell, Arial and the others charge big bucks for a solid helmet... it takes a lot of money in R&D to get materials just right. After seeing the results of my brothers bike helmet after he totaled his cycle... I became very interested in helmet design and wanted to see what a plastic shell probally 1/8 inch think just split open. Well he got out with out a single head injury but the helmet took the impact like it should.

Bubble wrap with thin walled bubbles will almost always protect something in a fall since it has give and prevents the egg from slamming into the side of the box when it deceleates. Another good choice for egg protection in a box is crumbled newspapers. Foam peanuts was one of the worst choices. (I was a science geek and actually did the same thing many times in many classes including physics, material science, and shop )

Yesterday is history
And tomorrow is a mystery

Parachutemanuals.com

[whatever 0]

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Where the hell did you come from?

pretty much the same place skreamer did

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You should read my last post.

I did.

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I apologized about being misinformed about the helmets being DOT.

indeed you did

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Also I said that I would also modify my bonehead with extra foam.

which won't achieve your goal of providing significant impact protection, unless your Bonehead was WAY too big to start with and you manage to get hold of some expanded polystyrene foam too and go through the trouble of shaping and fitting it without damaging it

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tHAT IS ALSO WHAT i SAID TO THE ORIGINAL PERSON WHO POSTED.
READ EVRYTHING BEFORE YOU POST!!

I did read the whole thread before I posted, I usually do.

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SOME GUYS ALWAYS HAVE TO GET IN THE MIX?

just trying to help you see that whereas Bonehead make very good skydiving camera helmets, they are not any good at impact protection and cannot practically be modified to provide the same level of protection that a downhill mountainbike helmet can provide at half the cost, or a BMX dirtjumping helmet at about a sixth of the cost

it seems you have made up your mind that your Bonehead will provide you reasonable impact protection, even though several others have given valid reasons why it would not, even if modified.

I've attached some pics.

They are of 3 of my helmets, my 2KC ff2 that I use for skydiving, my TSG dirtjumping helmet that I use for skydiving, rockclimbing and basejumping and my 661 Full Bravo Carbon downhill mountainbike helmet that I use for basejumping.

the TSG I bought in England for £25 and it provides better protection than a ProTec due to the expanded foam construction. I wear that on some skydives and basejumps where object strike is not an issue and the landing area is fairly friendly.

The 661 I bought off the internet for $133 US. I wear that downhill mountainbiking and on basejumps where object strike is a concern and/or the landing area isn't too friendly.

The 2KC I only skydive with.

I have a bulletcam mounted on the TSG in the pic and I have used that on many basejumps and some skydives, with good results.

It's far easier on your neck, presents no real snag hazard and if you choose the bulletcam well, will provide much better lowlight footage than a Sony on nightshot and since I mostly base at night...

if you have any questions about any of the helmets or my bulletcam setup and my experiences with them, I'll gladly answer them

cya
sam


Tom - thanks for making the warning nice.
is this more helpful?

at least give me some credit for having resisted the urge to work his username into my reply...

soon to be gone

[QuickDraw 0]

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If you think of an egg as your head what would you rather have around it...

Steak & chips ?

-- Hope you don't die. --

I'm fucking winning

[skreamer 1]

LMFAO!

Score one for the brummie, nice one Adrian.

[sabre210 0]

Brilliant Ade


ian

[John_Scher 0]

Dear Mr Lou Diamond,

I appreciate that you are not neccessarily qualified in the field of protective helmets however in your opinion would an Optik or other similar helmet benefit as much from an Aero upgrade as would a Protec?

[vid666 0]

***
if you have any questions about any of the helmets or my bulletcam setup and my experiences with them, I'll gladly answer them

[LouDiamond 1]

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would an Optik or other similar helmet benefit as much from an Aero upgrade as would a Protec?

Adding the Aero kit would be a far cry better than the comfort foam in all current skydiving helmets IMO. The Protec is nothing but a flexible plastic shell where as most skydivng helmets at least have a carbon fiber shell. The addition of the Aero kit to the Protec was substantial enough that the military airborne board approved it for our use. Having used both the Gentex helmet( same thing jet fighters wear) and the modified protec/cascade helmet, the addition of the Aero kit made the protec IMO just as protective as the Gentex helmet which consists of a plastic bubble liner and a comfort pad inside the hard shell. I think that if one were to add a Aero kit to a current skydiving helmet that it would improve it substantially to impact forces. however, I think it would still be a far cry from a DOT or SNELL approved helmet. I have used different versions of the Bonehead M3T and the last one I saw had substantially more protective bubble type material inside than the Gentex helmet. I think the M3T would be a good choice for BASE and it's already Black in color.

If one is concerned with the protection of their head then an approved helmet is the way to go. I know how cumbersome a motorcycle helmet would be on a jump( we used to use open face motorcycle helmets back in the day on HALO ops) but it would provide you with industry standard protection, which is still no guarentee your brains will remain unscrambled after an impact. In lieu of wearing a full on motor cycle helmet I think either an Aero upgraded skydiving helmet or the M3T would provide one with substantialy more protection than a normal protec or similar helmet. The only thing that comes to mind is if one could install the Aero kit in a skydiving shell and still have it fit. I am thinking one would need a shell one size larger to install the kit and still have the helmet fit one's head.

"It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required"
Some people dream about flying, I live my dream
SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING

[John_Scher 0]

Lou Diamond,

Thank you for the lengthy and informative reply.

[whatever 0]

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I a bit off-topic - your bulletcam is mounted on your helment pretty sturdily

not really it's on there with rather big tandem linestow rubber band and then covered in gaffers tape

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yet you seem to also have video of it being handmounted - are you really putting all that work into mounting and realligning the cam on your helmet after every time you put it on your hand ? Or do you just use alternate between 2 different bulletcams with the same accessory pack ?

I have used it handmounted a number of times, but I have had it taped to the top of the TSG helmet like that for a while now, I do mainly night jumps now and I like the top facing forward better for that.

It's only about 15 minutes to change it over and aim is not critical as I have a very wide lens in the bulletcam.

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Also - I assume that you just taped the cable(s) all the way down to where the helmet ends to less snag potentintial.

I certainly do, I always wear clothing that will cover the cables too (Cameye Sport cable running to my wrist etc.)

Minimising snag potential is where it's at, as I mainly do slider off jumps and if you snag a line on your camera helmet or setup on one of those, I'm pretty sure you will be landing whatever you have happening above you or be flown into the object by it.

Snag your bridle on a camera setup at slider off altitudes though and I'm pretty sure that's a guaranteed place on Nick's list....

video is cool but safety is cooler

cya
sam

soon to be gone