Tension Knot

[r2hubert 0]

I had some thoughts on tension knots. And here are some stuff I thought. Let me know what you think.
I notice that some canopy lines are more rigid and slippery than other. Especially the black ones. Maybe I'm wrong here but it looks like there is a coating on the black ones. Anyway my though was that if the lines a more rigid and more slippery that maybe reduce the risk of getting a tension knot.
If there are actually no difference right now between lines maybe it will be a good idea to coat the lines in that purpose. Of course that will affect the friction on the slider too and my get harder opening (testing will probably confirm that).
So what are you thoughts on that....

Thanks
-- Renaud

--
Renaud SMA #9
"Mind is like parachute. It only functions when it's open."

[RayLosli 11]

If that were true......
There would be more documented cases of older canopy's with
worn-out, old, fuzzy Dacron lines getting knots.
That's not the case.

edit to add:
Saw, Sabia at the beginning of the year get a Knot on a
brand new canopy packed up about two day before it happened.

[KevinMcGuire 0]

Well um actually, If you look to the skydiving world, you will notice that older tandem canopys with "fuzzy" dacron lines tend to suffer from tension knots far more than when they have been relined. I can speak to this personally as I have had to repack many reserves after the mains got tension knots. When I relined the canopys the problem typically went away.
Just food for thought

[RayLosli 11]

Ya.. but Tandems are Slam-Packed as fast as they can be packed by human hands.
For slightly above Minimum Wage.
By someone who does not intend to jump it.
Why do you think they call Tandems... ** Meat-Bombs **

Usually the DZ owner will squeeze every Penney out of a Tandem canopy's life until the
The lines look like Yarn and you can shoot straws through the material.

You may have a point but Tandems get, Packed like Shit and jumped to Death.

[leroydb 0]

Quote

For slightly above Minimum Wage.

minimum wage is paid by the hour... they pack a tandem in 10-15 min. That equals at least 100 an hour if you could pack at least 10... not sure what the normal packer can pack an hour though

Leroy


..I knew I was an unwanted baby when I saw my bath toys were a toaster and a radio...

[KevinMcGuire 0]

Usually the DZ owner will squeeze every Penney out of a Tandem canopy's life until the
The lines look like Yarn and you can shoot straws through the material.

[RayLosli 11]

leroydb:
minimum wage is paid by the hour... they pack a tandem in 10-15 min.
............................................
Exactly my point ,
Not much consideration for a Pilot and his Passenger,

I Have spent more Time, taking a ....DUMP !
.......................................................................................................................


Kevin:
Usually the BASE jumper will squeeze every jump out of his or her BASE canopy until the lines look like yarn and you can shoot straws through the material..... then they sell it to some one else
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Ha.. Ha...
You still don't see the evidence out there on BASE jumps with Tension Knots.
They are still are a rare thing.
The couple of Knots I saw this year in , Malaysia and Royal Gorge, Co.
Were on good clean gear.

[r2hubert 0]

I don't really agree. We cannot look at only one or two examples. And BTW I hope not a lot of people base with old worn out lines...
I think looking at skydiving tandems confirm a little my theory. Even if tension knots are not that frequent I think it's worth to look at, one it's too many when you're under this canopy .
My self only had one tension knot and it was skydiving under a very old F111, and I manage to clear it, so I'm no reference. Just trying to see if there is any research on this or ideas how to reduce the risk.

Thanks for comments.
-- Renaud

--
Renaud SMA #9
"Mind is like parachute. It only functions when it's open."

[clint 1]

YOur on Glue if you think your math works on what you said.

If they do a pack job in 10-15 mins, that means in 1 hour, 60 minutes, he could do 10???

My math says he can do 4-6 in that hour and that means he/she will make $40-60 per hour. The average packer is about 15 mins.

Your a champ if you can do 6 in an hour!!! Maybe 1% of the packers in the world can do 6 tandems PJ's in a hour. Maybe 10 people can pack 10 tandems in 1 hour. I would love to get video of that!! Guiness Book of World Records!

Am I wrong here?

[pBASEtobe 0]

Wasn't there a 2 minute (or less) PJ done at the beginning of Continuum II? Not a tandem but still...

[councilman24 37]

I disagree. Most malfunctions I've seen were tensions knots, including two of my own. This was back with dacron. I can't remember seeing a tension knot in microline. My theory is just that. That the slicker line doesn't hold the knot and while they may form they come out.

I've never heard a manufacturer claim or support this but it sure is my 25 year experience in the sport.

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[RayLosli 11]

Ya...but I think we don't use,Miroline / Spectra ,
We have to use Dacron. in BASE canopy's. I think that is our only choice at the moment.
But only on Slider-Down BASE opening.. Because Dacron has, Higher Static Elongation. (it stretches)
>> ( correct me if I am wrong on the Dacron only for slider-Down. )

I have been thinking and I remember being there at 3 tension knot openings in BASE and
I have seen a few Tandems on the DZ..
The 3 Knots that I have seen in BASE were all Slider-Up.

All 3 were under, 6 second delay at deployment. and packed properly for that delay. All with good fresh gear.

I would be VERY Interested in knowing -Who or How Many have had a Tension Knot in BASE at
High deployment speeds, slider-up.

I don't think it would be a problem using spectra in your, Tail Pocket slider-up.
Skydive CRW has been doing that for quit sometime. They pitch the pilot right out the
door, at exit speed of aircraft. You don't hear of them having to many Tension Knots.

I don't know if it is possible to order a BASE canopy with maybe 1000 Lb. test. Specta
That is smaller diamiter than the Dacron, and slick. If you only used this canopy on Slider-Up....Only
You can always re-line your BASE canopy yourself and check it out.