technical question on canopies

[fab777 0]

technical, but simple:

What is the best canopy for low jumps?

I understood I shouldn't do what I do with my fox...

Fabien
BASE#944

[TomAiello 26]

That's a question that is sure to cause a lot of argument. I think it's going to boil down to personal preference.

For sure, get bottom skin inlets. After that? Model of canopy will depend on the jumper.

I know that successful freefalls of 173' have been made on Mojo, FOX Vtec, Flik Vtec, Troll MDV and Blackjack. I know that successful freefalls of 156' have been made on FOX Vtec, Flik Vtec and Mojo.

If you are ultra low, having ZP topskin will help inflation. Also, I'm quite a fan of the new Troll center cell valve for faster inflation at low airspeed.

Also remember that the most important component in ultra low freefalls is the PC and PC toss technique. These are more important than canopy choice because PC hesitation can kill you.

-- Tom Aiello

Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[BASE813 0]

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What is the best canopy for low jumps?

what do you mean by low? I mean I would take a non vented canopy to around 220ft freefall, but others would only take a vented canopy below 300ft freefalls...................

I guess it all depends on your opinion of what exactly "low" is..................

One mans SL is another mans FF...............

[BASE864 0]

After a recent discussion with a gear manufacturer, I think I can put in my $0.02 on this question.

The best canopy for low jumps is also dependent on the physical size of the canopy. A canopy on the largest end will weight more and have longer lines than a canopy on the small end. The weight difference will affect how quickly it opens - given the same airespeed and same size of PC. The extra nylon will also increase the time it takes to get it flying.

In otherwords, my FLiK 322 will take a greater snatch force to open than my buddy's FLiK 220 (given the same size PC and airspeed). Thus, I'd have to step up a size in PC or get more airspeed. (On a low jump, it's obvious which is safer!) I definately know that my buddy's freefall jump will be my PCA jump because my 322 takes just a bit longer to open and get flying. On a low jump, that 'just a bit' can be a killer.

So, what this means is, maybe stepping down a canopy size for low jumps could make openings better and faster. Or at least what I was told. Personally, I wouldn't step down a canopy size nor do I recommend it.

That's my $0.02 - let the bashing begin! (I'm very curious to see what others have to say about this.)

I also have the experience of jumping my UNVENTED FLiK 322 off a 230' object. That flight and subsequent landing caused a broken tailbone because the canopy wasn't fully pressurized and flying before I landed. Then I had the VTEC vents & valve covers added to my FLiK. I jumped the same object again using my newly VENTED FLiK 322 and the difference was amazing. I outflew everybody on my load and had a perfect landing. That's the difference the vents made in getting the canopy pressurized and flying faster. (Note: both jumps were PCA'd.)

Later,
BASE864

[pope 0]

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I also have the experience of jumping my UNVENTED FLiK 322 off a 230' object. That flight and subsequent landing caused a broken tailbone because the canopy wasn't fully pressurized and flying before I landed. Then I had the VTEC vents & valve covers added to my FLiK. I jumped the same object again using my newly VENTED FLiK 322 and the difference was amazing. I outflew everybody on my load and had a perfect landing. That's the difference the vents made in getting the canopy pressurized and flying faster. (Note: both jumps were PCA'd.)

That sounds to me like someone fucked up your PCA--230' is PLENTY of time to inflate an unvented 322. Do you have video? Let's see it!
I know I've freefallen 210 with an unvented Fox with no problems...

[BASE864 0]

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That sounds to me like someone fucked up your PCA--230' is PLENTY of time to inflate an unvented 322. Do you have video? Let's see it

To my knowledge, nobody F'd up the PCA. I do have video - just need to load it up. (I'll work on that next week for the sake of learning and spreading the knowledge) On the unvented PCA jump, my end-cells didn't have time to inflate - so I landed on my a$$ with 5 cells. The vented PCA jump got fully inflated and flying in plenty of time to have a great flare.

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I know I've freefallen 210 with an unvented Fox with no problems...

pope, you weight like a buck nothing and probably jump a much smaller canopy. It takes less for you to get open and flying. Thus, I'm sure you had no problems freefalling from 210' and are off and flying quickly. There's no way in hell I'd consider that with my 322' and my current size. I need more airspeed and altitude to get flying so that I can safely land. Like BASE813 said "One man's freefall is aonther man's static line."

Later,
BASE864

[Treejumps 0]

I've got at least a dozen PCAs from 240' and one freefall from 240', all on a Mojo 310. Plenty of altitude to land fine. Must be a dodgy canopy.

Cya

[TomAiello 26]

Unvented Flik is not exactly renowned for clean openings.

-- Tom Aiello

Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[tymkoder 0]

I was there to witness both of the jumps that base864 is talking about.
with any given error the weather packing, and PCA technique where the same.

on the first jump without vents he did have an open canopy. it just never finished presurizing, then he hit the ground.
the second jump with vents the canopy opened instantly and he out flew the rest of our landings.

to compare:
my landing was actually the shortest. 200# exit weight jumping a vented(no vent covers) fox 245. Mine also opens instanly but sinks out very fast. he out flew me by about 30 yards or more.

CHICKEN MAN
BASE 954

[pope 0]

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pope, you weight like a buck nothing and probably jump a much smaller canopy. It takes less for you to get open and flying. Thus, I'm sure you had no problems freefalling from 210' and are off and flying quickly. There's no way in hell I'd consider that with my 322' and my current size. I need more airspeed and altitude to get flying so that I can safely land. Like BASE813 said "One man's freefall is aonther man's static line."

I hear ya JJ--
...BTW my previously mentioned jumps were on a 225 and a 244 with a 42" PC, and I recognize that different sized canopies take different times to inflate, but my point was that given the differences in the height and type of jumps, that the differences between our opening heights should not have been THAT dramatic. I still had at LEAST a five second canopy ride.
Anyhow, sorry about yer ass . Could've been worse--I heard about a guy that was in a similar situation as you, but landed on a BRANCH--and we're talking cornhole, NOT the fleshy part. I wouldn't even put that on a carnage reel!
pope

[maretus 0]

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For sure, get bottom skin inlets. After that? Model of canopy will depend on the jumper.

I know that successful freefalls of 173' have been made on Mojo, FOX Vtec, Flik Vtec, Troll MDV and Blackjack. I know that successful freefalls of 156' have been made on FOX Vtec, Flik Vtec and Mojo.

Sure thing I'd like to have bottom skin inlets if I was going ff from those heights but just out of curiosity, does Mojo have bottom skin inlets as an option or were those jumps done with unvented Mojo ?

http://www.ufufreefly.com

[fab777 0]

[reply
I guess it all depends on your opinion of what exactly "low" is..................

One mans SL is another mans FF...............

[TomAiello 26]

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...does Mojo have bottom skin inlets as an option or were those jumps done with unvented Mojo ?

Those jumps were done before the availability of bottom skin inlets. At the time the Mojo was the best canopy for low jumps and zero airspeed inflation.

-- Tom Aiello

Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[BASE864 0]

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...BTW my previously mentioned jumps were on a 225 and a 244 with a 42" PC, and I recognize that different sized canopies take different times to inflate, but my point was that given the differences in the height and type of jumps, that the differences between our opening heights should not have been THAT dramatic. I still had at LEAST a five second canopy ride.

No worries Chris. I see what your saying. I'm learning that since I'm on the very large end, I can't quite do what all the small guys are doing when it comes to low stuff. So, I'll just have to shoot video and wait for a little more height....

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Anyhow, sorry about yer ass . Could've been worse--I heard about a guy that was in a similar situation as you, but landed on a BRANCH--and we're talking cornhole, NOT the fleshy part.

The old tailbone healed up nicely. Just had to sit on one of those donut/hemroid pillows for a few weeks.

Later,
BASE864