SkydiveNFlorida 0 #26 January 8, 2004 Additionally... you *might* want to check out used gear because ordering something new you so early in your skydiving career may not be the best decision since you *may* downsize from a 210sf canopy to something more reasonable for your size (you look small, forgive me if i'm wrong) within the next year... obviously, your mileage may vary here. I got a used Javelin from Lisa (skybytch) at the Drop Shop and am very happy with it. I had a few mods done to make it more ff safe, and it is an awesome rig! Make sure if you buy used to have a rigger check the gear out for you before you purchase. If you buy used over the internet, the owner should be willing to ship it to your rigger for inspection (and you to try on) before any $$ is exchanged. jmo of course. Angela. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 273 #27 January 8, 2004 QuoteRight, but when is it truely equal? When two or more containers have delivery times I'm okay with, prices I can afford, are manufactured by people who do a good job of customer service and are known to my local riggers.... then it's equal and the only thing left to base my decision on is.... looks (I think that's everything on the list I posted above...). I stand behind my statement that pretty much any container on the market is going to do what you want it to do. What one person calls a "kickass safety feature", another might call needless bulk in their container. Kinda like the choice between Levi's or Wranglers. Either one will do the job but I like the way Levi's make my ass look. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nightingale 0 #28 January 8, 2004 I've been looking for used, but somewhat new stuff. I found a container that was 10 yrs old (little old for my liking) that fit me well and would hold a 190 max. However, it came with the Raven -M reserve, and I've just heard too many rotten things about that canopy to be real comfortable with it, plus, the main was an OLD PD 190 that wasn't worth much anyway. What I need is something with a 16 in. lift web that'll hold a 190 canopy, maximum. Would like something made in the last 5 yrs or so. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
johnny1488 1 #29 January 8, 2004 Javelin because I dont want any other container. Vector if zephrhills falls of the earth and takes sunpath with it. Johnny --"This ain't no book club, we're all gonna die!" Mike Rome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkydiveNFlorida 0 #30 January 8, 2004 Well, keep looking. I found one on the forum I had shipped to me that was just a tad too small... then I found the one at Lisa's shop and it was a match made in heaven:D Check out your local dzs, and check ads at places like the gear store in z-hills (what is the name, can't think right now) and other shops. And, of course, keep an eye on the classifieds here.. I purchased everything seperate, I got the container from Lisa... the reserve off of this board, and my main was local. But, there are some sweet combo deals now and again, too... so keep your eyes open:) Don't rush,... good things come to those who wait Hate to end up with gear that doesn't fit you or is too old ... then see something great in 2 weeks. Angela. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VanillaSkyGirl 6 #31 January 9, 2004 QuoteWell, keep looking. I found one on the forum I had shipped to me that was just a tad too small... then I found the one at Lisa's shop and it was a match made in heaven:D Check out your local dzs, and check ads at places like the gear store in z-hills (what is the name, can't think right now) and other shops. And, of course, keep an eye on the classifieds here.. I purchased everything seperate, I got the container from Lisa... the reserve off of this board, and my main was local. But, there are some sweet combo deals now and again, too... so keep your eyes open:) Don't rush,... good things come to those who wait Hate to end up with gear that doesn't fit you or is too old ... then see something great in 2 weeks. Angela. I agree. I looked for MANY months and asked so many questions. I also demoed different styles of mains, which I am happy to have done. It was an endless process and is highly personal. You will never know what canopy that you like, until you impartially try them all several times. I am happy with my first rig, but I am also looking to move on to something of better quality and custom fit, as soon as I can downsize. Don't worry, everyone. I am VERY conservative about downsizing my main. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Nightingale 0 #32 January 9, 2004 not rushing... I won't buy til I find something I really like. BUT... I really HATE having a day of jumping cost me a minimum of $85.00 for one jump ($20 jump tix and $65.00 gear rental). I'd jump more often if I could just go down there, shell out $20 or $40 and get one or two jumps in to stay current. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites benny 0 #33 January 9, 2004 this basically seals it for me, as soon as pops transfers the title, i'm selling my car and getting a custom rig. the only thing i haven't decided on is the container, i think i'm down to mirage or infinity. have jumped the mirage and like it, the guys at my dz seem to like them too but those infinities sure look nice... Never go to a DZ strip show. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites falxori 0 #34 January 9, 2004 wings. good price, great service. neat design (according to the experts...) and sweet looking too :-) O "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites pilotdave 0 #35 January 9, 2004 QuotePersonally I think my next rig will be a Voodoo. I really like my bf's Voodoo, ff safe and looks very nice. I think Wings are some of the ugliest containers i've seen. I just don't like them. Many do, though. It's funny how taste can differ. I HATE the look of the voodoo and really like the wings. Dave Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SkydiveNFlorida 0 #36 January 9, 2004 QuoteQuotePersonally I think my next rig will be a Voodoo. I really like my bf's Voodoo, ff safe and looks very nice. I think Wings are some of the ugliest containers i've seen. I just don't like them. Many do, though. It's funny how taste can differ. I HATE the look of the voodoo and really like the wings. Dave Yep... exactly why it is useless polling a crowd unless on functionality of rig, in which case, I think that most new containers are good. You have to make the decision as to what you like, not go by what others like because everyone has different tastes. Angela. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites skybeergodd 0 #37 January 9, 2004 I'm the rigger for my DZ and have packed every rig you can think of...so froma riggers point of view..the Javelin is #1..The Vector is #2..Mirage is #3...and Wings(I charge more to pack a Wings because they are a huge pain in the A** to pack) Safety wise I'd have to go with the Vector 3...it's freefly friendly...very functional and the skyhook just puts it over the top for safety. Looks wise I jump a Vector 3 personally.Hope this helps and to all those people out there who don't like the comment on the wings just remember that is my opinion and it's not going to change. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Amazon 7 #38 January 9, 2004 I bought an Infinity. They are local and I had some sizing issues. I wanted a lower chest strap so it would not hurt my breasts. KellyF did a superb job.. Its easy to pack well made.. is extremely freefly friendly (253mph head down dive so far) and was a very good value. The custeomer service is awsume.. and the delivery times right now are excellent. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites benny 0 #39 January 9, 2004 QuoteI'm the rigger for my DZ and have packed every rig you can think of...so froma riggers point of view..the Javelin is #1..The Vector is #2..Mirage is #3...and Wings(I charge more to pack a Wings because they are a huge pain in the A** to pack) Safety wise I'd have to go with the Vector 3...it's freefly friendly...very functional and the skyhook just puts it over the top for safety. Looks wise I jump a Vector 3 personally.Hope this helps and to all those people out there who don't like the comment on the wings just remember that is my opinion and it's not going to change. Should we feel it necessary to force riggers to inform us of any financial relations they might have wih any manufacturers before giving their opinions on rigs? Just wondering what reasons you give for their rankings? Prioritized criteria list? Never go to a DZ strip show. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Chrisky 2 #40 January 9, 2004 Got myself a Wings after being turned down by the long wait for Javelins. Got all the nice features for a price cheaper than Mirage, and it is the most comfortable rig i've ever been in. Couldn't be happier. The mind is like a parachute - it only works once it's open. From the edge you just see more. ... Not every Swooper hooks & not every Hooker swoops ... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites meatbomb 0 #41 January 9, 2004 QuoteI would prefer non other than a Wings reserve pilot chute on my back. Question for ya...I know of at least one rigger who refuses to pack Wings, due the large gaps between the pop-top cap, and the apex of the pilot chute, caused by the method of attachment (4 pop studs...). He argues that you're just asking for a line to get caught in there...I personally feel that the gap is small enough, and the risk small enough, that I will pack them myself. This guy is my rigging mentor though, so I listen carefully to what he says... Is there a good (ie rigging, not cosmetic) reason for have the pop-top cap studded on rather than sewn? Or is it just so's a customer can change pop-top caps easier?--- Swoopert, CS-Aiiiiiii! Piccies Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Unstable 9 #42 January 9, 2004 I agree 100% with Skybytch - The rigs on the market today are all very well built pieces of Equipment. As long as it fits well, has a pattern that you like, feels good to wear, and something your rigger is familiar with, you will be very happy with your rig. HOWEVER, do your homework. There are a lot of small, almost minute details in the design and engineering of a rig - study and learn what you can , then make a decision that makes sence to you. Call the manufacturers. I gurantee you that all of them will be willing to sit down over the telephone and tell you what sets their rig apart from others. (If they wont' do that, then why would you buy from them anyways??) Just keep asking and keep looking. For what it Matters, I did my Homework and made my calls, and talked to my rigger, and I just order the New Racer 2K3 From jumpshack. Ford's and Chevy's.=========Shaun ========== Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites skybrat68 0 #43 January 9, 2004 Dude, the problem you've mentioned has nothing to do with the snaps which attach the pop top to the reserve pilot chute. The reserve closing loop is too long. The only time I've ever seen a gap like you're referring to was when someone closed the reserve tray wrong. Someone with more experience closing a Wings reserve pack job did reclosed it, and with a shorter closing loop, and now there is no gap at all. If it's closed properly, there should be NO gap. I've actually never thought about why the pop top is capped instead of sewn. I'm sure Henri has a good reason for it as he does for every feature on his containers. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites meatbomb 0 #44 January 9, 2004 Sorry, I didn't explain myself fully, I didn't mean when the rig is packed, I meant in use...If you look at the pilot chute, there is room for lines etc to snag between the cap and the top of the pilotchute, on deployment...--- Swoopert, CS-Aiiiiiii! Piccies Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites skybytch 273 #45 January 9, 2004 QuoteShould we feel it necessary to force riggers to inform us of any financial relations they might have wih any manufacturers before giving their opinions on rigs? What are you insinuating? Is it wrong for anybody with sponsored gear to offer an opinion on gear when asked? note- I'm not saying that skybeergodd is sponsored; I have no idea if he paid for his gear or not; do you know for a fact that he has sponsored gear, benny? Most sponsored jumpers choose their gear based on what they like, not on who will give them free stuff. And not just any old rigger or jumper gets sponsored gear either; ya kinda have to be known in the sport - ie have some skill and/or knowledge and be visible and therefore have probably been in the sport for awhile - before a manufacturer is going to give you a sponsorship. skybeergodd is an active rigger with more skydives than you or I are likely to log anytime soon. I'd value his opinion on which rigs are easier/harder for him to do a reserve pack job on, whether he paid full price for his rig or not. And his opinion is just his opinion anyway. Ask four different riggers the same question about containers and you'll likely get four different answers. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Ron 10 #46 January 9, 2004 I jump a Vector....It is the best engineered rig on the planet. Everything they do has been tested very well. They are the originators of many standard saftey features. 3 ring, Tandem, Sigma.....The list goes on. Having said that, yes I am also sponsord by them, so take that into account as well. I always say this about gear....Look around your DZ, and see what everyone else is jumping. There is a reason for it. It might be just a price issue (Who does not want to save money?), or an availability issue . I would not own a west coast rig if I lived in FL, with 5 major container companies right near me. Or I would not order a rig if it was going to take 2 years to get. While not scientific, looking around and buying what you see makes sense. Very few rigs could be considered "unsafe" today. Leads to point #2 with me....Never be the first on the block with the new toy. You end up being a tester. Nova, Crossfire 1, Reflex with the Catapult, Micro Raven, Astra, CYPRES 2 with the readout problem, Neptune with its gremlins, The Skyhook problem.....Get the picture? So for this reason I would not get an Icon right now.....A very good friend of mine in the industry told me he waits 2 years to get the new toy...by then most of the problems are found out. PD mains are one exeption for me personally....However I still wait two years for reserves and AAD's."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites skybrat68 0 #47 January 9, 2004 The rig that I referred to that had to be reclosed looked perfectly fine when it was first packed. The gap didn't occur until after 2 or 3 jumps because the closing loop was too long. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites meatbomb 0 #48 January 9, 2004 Gah! I must be losing my touch...I'll try one more time...Not when the rig is packed. When the reserve pin has been pulled, and the reserve pilot chute is deployed, you can see the gap...forget the rest of the rig (which is mostly very well designed), I'm just talking about the reserve pilot chute, when it's in active use...phew...that any clearer? Anyone else understand what I'm saying, sometimes another point of view can explain things better...--- Swoopert, CS-Aiiiiiii! Piccies Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites PhreeZone 20 #49 January 9, 2004 I agree packing the Wings PC is harder then packing a Javelin's but this is the first I've heard of someone charging more for one. What are your prices on commonly marked up repack containers like the Reflex and the Racer?Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites pilotdave 0 #50 January 9, 2004 Hey, quit yer bad mouthing about the microraven. The raven dash m had the SB, not the microraven. I'll be selling my microraven soon so I just don't want bad info floating around. Dave Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 Next Page 2 of 3 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0
Nightingale 0 #32 January 9, 2004 not rushing... I won't buy til I find something I really like. BUT... I really HATE having a day of jumping cost me a minimum of $85.00 for one jump ($20 jump tix and $65.00 gear rental). I'd jump more often if I could just go down there, shell out $20 or $40 and get one or two jumps in to stay current. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
benny 0 #33 January 9, 2004 this basically seals it for me, as soon as pops transfers the title, i'm selling my car and getting a custom rig. the only thing i haven't decided on is the container, i think i'm down to mirage or infinity. have jumped the mirage and like it, the guys at my dz seem to like them too but those infinities sure look nice... Never go to a DZ strip show. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
falxori 0 #34 January 9, 2004 wings. good price, great service. neat design (according to the experts...) and sweet looking too :-) O "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pilotdave 0 #35 January 9, 2004 QuotePersonally I think my next rig will be a Voodoo. I really like my bf's Voodoo, ff safe and looks very nice. I think Wings are some of the ugliest containers i've seen. I just don't like them. Many do, though. It's funny how taste can differ. I HATE the look of the voodoo and really like the wings. Dave Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkydiveNFlorida 0 #36 January 9, 2004 QuoteQuotePersonally I think my next rig will be a Voodoo. I really like my bf's Voodoo, ff safe and looks very nice. I think Wings are some of the ugliest containers i've seen. I just don't like them. Many do, though. It's funny how taste can differ. I HATE the look of the voodoo and really like the wings. Dave Yep... exactly why it is useless polling a crowd unless on functionality of rig, in which case, I think that most new containers are good. You have to make the decision as to what you like, not go by what others like because everyone has different tastes. Angela. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybeergodd 0 #37 January 9, 2004 I'm the rigger for my DZ and have packed every rig you can think of...so froma riggers point of view..the Javelin is #1..The Vector is #2..Mirage is #3...and Wings(I charge more to pack a Wings because they are a huge pain in the A** to pack) Safety wise I'd have to go with the Vector 3...it's freefly friendly...very functional and the skyhook just puts it over the top for safety. Looks wise I jump a Vector 3 personally.Hope this helps and to all those people out there who don't like the comment on the wings just remember that is my opinion and it's not going to change. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #38 January 9, 2004 I bought an Infinity. They are local and I had some sizing issues. I wanted a lower chest strap so it would not hurt my breasts. KellyF did a superb job.. Its easy to pack well made.. is extremely freefly friendly (253mph head down dive so far) and was a very good value. The custeomer service is awsume.. and the delivery times right now are excellent. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
benny 0 #39 January 9, 2004 QuoteI'm the rigger for my DZ and have packed every rig you can think of...so froma riggers point of view..the Javelin is #1..The Vector is #2..Mirage is #3...and Wings(I charge more to pack a Wings because they are a huge pain in the A** to pack) Safety wise I'd have to go with the Vector 3...it's freefly friendly...very functional and the skyhook just puts it over the top for safety. Looks wise I jump a Vector 3 personally.Hope this helps and to all those people out there who don't like the comment on the wings just remember that is my opinion and it's not going to change. Should we feel it necessary to force riggers to inform us of any financial relations they might have wih any manufacturers before giving their opinions on rigs? Just wondering what reasons you give for their rankings? Prioritized criteria list? Never go to a DZ strip show. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Chrisky 2 #40 January 9, 2004 Got myself a Wings after being turned down by the long wait for Javelins. Got all the nice features for a price cheaper than Mirage, and it is the most comfortable rig i've ever been in. Couldn't be happier. The mind is like a parachute - it only works once it's open. From the edge you just see more. ... Not every Swooper hooks & not every Hooker swoops ... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
meatbomb 0 #41 January 9, 2004 QuoteI would prefer non other than a Wings reserve pilot chute on my back. Question for ya...I know of at least one rigger who refuses to pack Wings, due the large gaps between the pop-top cap, and the apex of the pilot chute, caused by the method of attachment (4 pop studs...). He argues that you're just asking for a line to get caught in there...I personally feel that the gap is small enough, and the risk small enough, that I will pack them myself. This guy is my rigging mentor though, so I listen carefully to what he says... Is there a good (ie rigging, not cosmetic) reason for have the pop-top cap studded on rather than sewn? Or is it just so's a customer can change pop-top caps easier?--- Swoopert, CS-Aiiiiiii! Piccies Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Unstable 9 #42 January 9, 2004 I agree 100% with Skybytch - The rigs on the market today are all very well built pieces of Equipment. As long as it fits well, has a pattern that you like, feels good to wear, and something your rigger is familiar with, you will be very happy with your rig. HOWEVER, do your homework. There are a lot of small, almost minute details in the design and engineering of a rig - study and learn what you can , then make a decision that makes sence to you. Call the manufacturers. I gurantee you that all of them will be willing to sit down over the telephone and tell you what sets their rig apart from others. (If they wont' do that, then why would you buy from them anyways??) Just keep asking and keep looking. For what it Matters, I did my Homework and made my calls, and talked to my rigger, and I just order the New Racer 2K3 From jumpshack. Ford's and Chevy's.=========Shaun ========== Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybrat68 0 #43 January 9, 2004 Dude, the problem you've mentioned has nothing to do with the snaps which attach the pop top to the reserve pilot chute. The reserve closing loop is too long. The only time I've ever seen a gap like you're referring to was when someone closed the reserve tray wrong. Someone with more experience closing a Wings reserve pack job did reclosed it, and with a shorter closing loop, and now there is no gap at all. If it's closed properly, there should be NO gap. I've actually never thought about why the pop top is capped instead of sewn. I'm sure Henri has a good reason for it as he does for every feature on his containers. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
meatbomb 0 #44 January 9, 2004 Sorry, I didn't explain myself fully, I didn't mean when the rig is packed, I meant in use...If you look at the pilot chute, there is room for lines etc to snag between the cap and the top of the pilotchute, on deployment...--- Swoopert, CS-Aiiiiiii! Piccies Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 273 #45 January 9, 2004 QuoteShould we feel it necessary to force riggers to inform us of any financial relations they might have wih any manufacturers before giving their opinions on rigs? What are you insinuating? Is it wrong for anybody with sponsored gear to offer an opinion on gear when asked? note- I'm not saying that skybeergodd is sponsored; I have no idea if he paid for his gear or not; do you know for a fact that he has sponsored gear, benny? Most sponsored jumpers choose their gear based on what they like, not on who will give them free stuff. And not just any old rigger or jumper gets sponsored gear either; ya kinda have to be known in the sport - ie have some skill and/or knowledge and be visible and therefore have probably been in the sport for awhile - before a manufacturer is going to give you a sponsorship. skybeergodd is an active rigger with more skydives than you or I are likely to log anytime soon. I'd value his opinion on which rigs are easier/harder for him to do a reserve pack job on, whether he paid full price for his rig or not. And his opinion is just his opinion anyway. Ask four different riggers the same question about containers and you'll likely get four different answers. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 10 #46 January 9, 2004 I jump a Vector....It is the best engineered rig on the planet. Everything they do has been tested very well. They are the originators of many standard saftey features. 3 ring, Tandem, Sigma.....The list goes on. Having said that, yes I am also sponsord by them, so take that into account as well. I always say this about gear....Look around your DZ, and see what everyone else is jumping. There is a reason for it. It might be just a price issue (Who does not want to save money?), or an availability issue . I would not own a west coast rig if I lived in FL, with 5 major container companies right near me. Or I would not order a rig if it was going to take 2 years to get. While not scientific, looking around and buying what you see makes sense. Very few rigs could be considered "unsafe" today. Leads to point #2 with me....Never be the first on the block with the new toy. You end up being a tester. Nova, Crossfire 1, Reflex with the Catapult, Micro Raven, Astra, CYPRES 2 with the readout problem, Neptune with its gremlins, The Skyhook problem.....Get the picture? So for this reason I would not get an Icon right now.....A very good friend of mine in the industry told me he waits 2 years to get the new toy...by then most of the problems are found out. PD mains are one exeption for me personally....However I still wait two years for reserves and AAD's."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybrat68 0 #47 January 9, 2004 The rig that I referred to that had to be reclosed looked perfectly fine when it was first packed. The gap didn't occur until after 2 or 3 jumps because the closing loop was too long. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
meatbomb 0 #48 January 9, 2004 Gah! I must be losing my touch...I'll try one more time...Not when the rig is packed. When the reserve pin has been pulled, and the reserve pilot chute is deployed, you can see the gap...forget the rest of the rig (which is mostly very well designed), I'm just talking about the reserve pilot chute, when it's in active use...phew...that any clearer? Anyone else understand what I'm saying, sometimes another point of view can explain things better...--- Swoopert, CS-Aiiiiiii! Piccies Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 20 #49 January 9, 2004 I agree packing the Wings PC is harder then packing a Javelin's but this is the first I've heard of someone charging more for one. What are your prices on commonly marked up repack containers like the Reflex and the Racer?Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pilotdave 0 #50 January 9, 2004 Hey, quit yer bad mouthing about the microraven. The raven dash m had the SB, not the microraven. I'll be selling my microraven soon so I just don't want bad info floating around. Dave Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
