TomAiello 26
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whatever 0
QuoteP.S. Want to see my "who is this rfarris guy?" correspondence file? I tend to do that when I see people pop up on the net and start asking questions, too, just to be sure they're in touch with someone, somewhere, who has some experience.
Tom
sounds like you're the J. Edgar Hoover of the BASE internet, right there....
I guess if any sport needs that, BASE is definitely it and kudos to you for doing your part for it.
soon to be gone
rfarris 2
QuoteP.S. Want to see my "who is this rfarris guy?" correspondence file?
umm...nope, but I see your point and agree, ethically.
chow.
BASE813 0
QuoteIn general, I was thinking of selling gear without doing some kind of checking on the buyer. It's more an ethical issue, than anything else, in my opinion. It takes only a few minutes to ask: "what's your experience level?" and "who are you jumping with?". Usually, you can tell if someone is trying to hand you a line when they answer these questions.
I was recently selling a rig. Most eMails I received were from “wannabes” – after some questions to find out that they were not jumping but “had a mentor” I would then only talk with this “mentor” and asked them to get them to contact me. Funny that these “mentors” seemed never to email me!!
Saying that I also received contact from a few “BASE” jumpers – to be honest after speaking I just felt a little uncomfortable in selling to them as they were low timers with no real solid base to go out and jump (no contacts, not enough knowledge about UK jumping) – and I just felt uncomfortable in selling to them.
In the end I sold the kit to someone who had done the BR course but had never made a fixed object jump – why?
Because I was friends and jumped with 2 people that knew him very well and they vouched for him – I trusted their opinion. Since then I have made a jump with the guy I sold the rig to and he recently made a bunch of jumps on a trip, I have no problem in jumping with him in the future.
There are more important things in life than money………………….
Faber 0
Its shit easy to buy a BASe rig on the net,no Q´s asked.thats the way it works no matter how much we like it.
i got my first rig from the net,just orderede by email payed by check,recived it 1 week later.. at that time i didnt even knew any to teach me(wanted to go to Norway at a BR course,but never telled the seller).
I got my 2 rig after i were injuryed,and well know here
so i guess that one dont count
Hey M,it still flyes and have given me some of my best weivs/jumps i just love that gear..And no i wont sell
Stay safe
Stefan Faber
i got my first rig from the net,just orderede by email payed by check,recived it 1 week later.. at that time i didnt even knew any to teach me(wanted to go to Norway at a BR course,but never telled the seller).
I got my 2 rig after i were injuryed,and well know here
so i guess that one dont count
Hey M,it still flyes and have given me some of my best weivs/jumps i just love that gear..And no i wont sell
Stay safe
Stefan Faber
NickDG 23
>My question is, do the BASE manufacturers sell rigs >to anyone who puts up the money?
Everything about BASE jumping is always in a continuos state of change, except for its history. And there’s a timeline in that history concerning the above that might provide an answer.
In the early 1980’s, as BASE jumpers began exploring the art of going lower and slower, the need for BASE specific gear becomes readily apparent. Bigger pilot chutes and longer bridles, the first two implementations, aren’t at first commercially available anywhere. Generally all BASE jumpers of the day are also active skydivers so if you needed this stuff you talked your local rigger into building them for you. Of course, these riggers are doing this for jumpers they know, not strangers off the street or through the mail. And besides BASE jumping has almost zero visibility in the whuffo community at this time, compared with today, as the whole “extreme sport” thing is still a few years away.
In the mid-1980s BASE magazines like “BASEline” and “JUMP” are carrying adverts for BASE pilot chutes and bridles. These components are built by the first crop of BASE jumpers who turned to rigging in order to finance their jumping. In some cases they really are licensed parachute riggers and sometimes they weren’t. A little later Velcro closed BASE containers became available from some of these same riggers turned manufactures. This is before BR, CS, Vert, or any of the big companies now. However, BASE rigs in those days are nothing more than new Velcro closed containers sewn to old, but serviceable skydiving rigs. In this period, people of little, or no experience are kept at bay because the BASE community is still small enough that almost every one knows everyone else.
Late 1980s and into the early to mid-90s, the best of the above, and a few new faces, moved from home lofts and garages into stand alone buildings and became full fledged BASE equipment manufacture. This is a time when yes, pretty much anyone could call up on the phone with a credit card and get BASE gear.
However, this is before it occurred to anybody that the following could happen.
#30 Andre Jewett, April 3, 1994
Age: 29
Antenna Jump (###### Tower)
Jackson, Mississippi, USA
"Andre is an expired USPA "A" license holder and an Army officer. There are
three observers on the load, one is a buddy of his and the other two are girlfriends.
Andre's skydiving gear sniveled to impact. There is nothing to suggest any pervious
BASE experience or training."
#47 Unknown (French?) 199?
Cliff Jump, ######
######, France
"Reports describe this person has having no BASE jumps, no training, no experienced
jumper with him, etc. He purchased BASE gear, chose an under-hung location to launch
from (not one of the ##### regular launch points), pivoted off the launch, went on his back, and struck the cliff in freefall. This fatality caused BASE gear manufacturers to start better screening their customers prior to the sale of BASE equipment."
It’s at this time when Adam from CS says, “Hey fellows, a BASE rig is a loaded gun.” After that, rules like be an experienced skydiver and you’re going to Bridge Day, or have X amount of skydives and you’re being taught by a known BASE jumper, or have X amount of jumps and you’re taking a commercial first BASE jump course, go into effect.
And this is basically what exists today. Can someone still just phone up and get decked out, probably yes, but maybe that’s more about the price of freedom rather than the manufactures not paying attention. But, all in all, they do a good job, and are surely more responsible than their brethren skydiving manufactures who sell hankies to anyone and are the cause of a fatality rate in skydiving that’s (unbelievably) the same as when I started jumping in 1975.
Nick
BASE 194
Everything about BASE jumping is always in a continuos state of change, except for its history. And there’s a timeline in that history concerning the above that might provide an answer.
In the early 1980’s, as BASE jumpers began exploring the art of going lower and slower, the need for BASE specific gear becomes readily apparent. Bigger pilot chutes and longer bridles, the first two implementations, aren’t at first commercially available anywhere. Generally all BASE jumpers of the day are also active skydivers so if you needed this stuff you talked your local rigger into building them for you. Of course, these riggers are doing this for jumpers they know, not strangers off the street or through the mail. And besides BASE jumping has almost zero visibility in the whuffo community at this time, compared with today, as the whole “extreme sport” thing is still a few years away.
In the mid-1980s BASE magazines like “BASEline” and “JUMP” are carrying adverts for BASE pilot chutes and bridles. These components are built by the first crop of BASE jumpers who turned to rigging in order to finance their jumping. In some cases they really are licensed parachute riggers and sometimes they weren’t. A little later Velcro closed BASE containers became available from some of these same riggers turned manufactures. This is before BR, CS, Vert, or any of the big companies now. However, BASE rigs in those days are nothing more than new Velcro closed containers sewn to old, but serviceable skydiving rigs. In this period, people of little, or no experience are kept at bay because the BASE community is still small enough that almost every one knows everyone else.
Late 1980s and into the early to mid-90s, the best of the above, and a few new faces, moved from home lofts and garages into stand alone buildings and became full fledged BASE equipment manufacture. This is a time when yes, pretty much anyone could call up on the phone with a credit card and get BASE gear.
However, this is before it occurred to anybody that the following could happen.
#30 Andre Jewett, April 3, 1994
Age: 29
Antenna Jump (###### Tower)
Jackson, Mississippi, USA
"Andre is an expired USPA "A" license holder and an Army officer. There are
three observers on the load, one is a buddy of his and the other two are girlfriends.
Andre's skydiving gear sniveled to impact. There is nothing to suggest any pervious
BASE experience or training."
#47 Unknown (French?) 199?
Cliff Jump, ######
######, France
"Reports describe this person has having no BASE jumps, no training, no experienced
jumper with him, etc. He purchased BASE gear, chose an under-hung location to launch
from (not one of the ##### regular launch points), pivoted off the launch, went on his back, and struck the cliff in freefall. This fatality caused BASE gear manufacturers to start better screening their customers prior to the sale of BASE equipment."
It’s at this time when Adam from CS says, “Hey fellows, a BASE rig is a loaded gun.” After that, rules like be an experienced skydiver and you’re going to Bridge Day, or have X amount of skydives and you’re being taught by a known BASE jumper, or have X amount of jumps and you’re taking a commercial first BASE jump course, go into effect.
And this is basically what exists today. Can someone still just phone up and get decked out, probably yes, but maybe that’s more about the price of freedom rather than the manufactures not paying attention. But, all in all, they do a good job, and are surely more responsible than their brethren skydiving manufactures who sell hankies to anyone and are the cause of a fatality rate in skydiving that’s (unbelievably) the same as when I started jumping in 1975.
Nick
BASE 194
BASE813 0
Quoteskydiving manufactures who sell hankies to anyone
How fucking true!
![[:/]](/uploads/emoticons/dry.png "[:/]"){kind=small}
Its strange how many skydivers still see BASE as "suicidal" - but have no problem in down sizing more and more earlier and earlier and no one bats an eye over it................
It is deemed "cool" to jump these little pocket rockets - and people are fucking up all over the place in front of the non-jumping public and friends........... but still we are deemed to be the "dangerous" ones! - fucking hypocrites!
base283 0
Quote
Done 66 skydives?
Hmmmm. Ya know, a BASE manufacturer wouldn't sell you a rig, nor would most BASErs with a rig for sale. Thank GOD for EBAY!
a. Many BASE gear manufacturers have sold rigs to jumpers with very little experience, less than Kit. What now?
b. It´s cool that you have sorted out your own limits but where does that give you the right to impose your limit on others?
I am interested in your answers, thanks in advance.
take care,
space
amen to that
-- (N.DG) "If all else fails – at least try and look under control." --
-- (N.DG) "If all else fails – at least try and look under control." --
In general, I was thinking of selling gear without doing some kind of checking on the buyer. It's more an ethical issue, than anything else, in my opinion. It takes only a few minutes to ask: "what's your experience level?" and "who are you jumping with?". Usually, you can tell if someone is trying to hand you a line when they answer these questions.
My experience has been that it depends on the manufacturer. Most of them will ask your level of skydiving experience, and try to maintain a base level (like 150 skydives) for purchasing gear. Sometimes it gets missed, and some folks are desparate enough for the business that they don't mind.
Maybe some manufacturers will comment on their specific policies?
I would hope not. I know that when I bought my fist rig (new from a manufacturer) I felt like I was getting the third degree (what business of it was theirs who _I_ would jump with?) In retrospect, I think it's probably good ethics, as well as good business practice (think, lawsuits) to ask.
P.S. Want to see my "who is this rfarris guy?" correspondence file? I tend to do that when I see people pop up on the net and start asking questions, too, just to be sure they're in touch with someone, somewhere, who has some experience.
Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com
SnakeRiverBASE.com
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